Posted on 07/19/2018 7:39:46 AM PDT by Salvation
The Catechism of the Catholic Church teaches,
[M]ortal sin destroys charity in the heart of man by a grave violation of God’s law; it turns man away from God, who is his ultimate end and his beatitude, by preferring an inferior good to him. In mortal sin the will sets itself upon something that is of its nature incompatible with the charity that orients man toward his ultimate end. As such, the sin is mortal by its very object whether it contradicts the love of God, such as blasphemy or perjury, or the love of neighbor, such as homicide or adultery (Catechism of the Catholic Church # 1855-1856).
Many people today scoff at the idea that mortal sin is a turning away from God. They doubt that people directly intend to turn away from God, as if the fornicator or the murder or the thief would say, “I hate God and so I am going to turn away from Him by sinning.”
That is not what catechism says, however. Rather, it says that our preference for an inferior good to God by a grave violation of His law is what turns us away from Him.
It says that in mortal sin we set our will upon something we know to be incompatible with our ultimate end. Although our first thought may not be that we are rejecting God, we set our will on something incompatible with God. In so doing, we are preferring something or someone to God.
This poisons our heart if we do not repent because we feed a desire in our heart for what is not God and we starve our heart from Him and what He offers. Soon enough we prefer the darkness to the light. We prefer the trinkets of this world to God and come to regard Him as a thief who comes to take what we want and keeps us from doing what we want to do. God becomes our enemy.
If we die in this state, the warmth of God and Heaven seem overwhelming, wrathful, and like a consuming fire. We cannot endure and so we turn away finally and permanently to a place that we strangely prefer, but which is hellacious because it is not that for which we were made. It lacks the one thing necessary: God.
And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil. Everyone who does evil hates the Light and does not come into the Light (John 3:19-20).
In mortal sin it is not that we directly turn from God — at least not at first — but that we turn to the lesser things of the darkness and come to hate Him who is the Light.
So, IOW, if you sin once after your saved, it’s hell for you and no 2nd chance, eh?
I would reply, but metmom did it so much better.
All I have to add is that I’m really sick of Catholics telling me that I don’t REALLY believe in good works, just because Jesus covers all my sins.
As if we wouldn’t do good works if we weren’t threatened into them.
Is that really what you believe, that you’re not going to do good works unless God threatens you?
But what IS blasphemy against the Spirit?
I know what I believe, but I want to hear what you have to say.
bkmk
I left to make my hubby lunch, as he is on oxygen 24/7 and unable to do those things, drive, or help me. I’m a little surprised you wouldn’t look that up yourself.
ROFL.. I would have thought with all your minister claims you would already know the context of Mathew 12:31.
Context of Mathew 12:31
“The Pharisees had blasphemed against the Spirit of God. The evil ones had said the power with which Christ did miracles was of Satan. Therefore Christ gave the unpardonable sin, as it related to their deliberate refusal to acknowledge God’s power in Christ. And speaking against the Holy Spirit is forbidden, as it leads to a mortal sin, whereby the person does not realize God has trusted them with all that is available! To reject the Holy Spirit is to REJECT Christ’s Sacrifice on the Cross/SALVATION.
Remember what Jesus said in John 16:7 7But very truly I tell you, it is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Advocate will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. (some translations say Comforter)
To reject the Advocate, who appeals on your behalf to God will leave the person to face the wrath of God.
WHICH brings Hebrews into a sad reality, that what God gives in Baptism of the Holy Spirit is the power of Healing, Deliverance, to overcome sin. So rejecting Christ Power is what a Christian does who allows their sin to overtake their body/mind to the point that they reject Christ Salvation, and the power of the Holy Spirit!” Therby losing what God gave them originally.
I’m sure you can figure out the rest of it from your spiritual education, as I read that you have extensive training. bye
Lord NO, did you not read all of my comments, that is ludicrous! Maybe you have a problem with reading comprehension> it is clear there is only one unforgiveable sin and that is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.
The Pharisees had blasphemed against the Spirit of God. The evil ones had said the power with which Christ did miracles was of Satan. Therefore Christ gave the unpardonable sin, as it related to their deliberate refusal to acknowledge God’s power in Christ. And speaking against the Holy Spirit is forbidden, as it leads to a mortal sin, whereby the person does not realize God has trusted them with all that is available! To reject the Holy Spirit is to REJECT Christ’s Sacrifice on the Cross/SALVATION.
Remember what Jesus said in John 16:7 7But very truly I tell you, it is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Advocate will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. (some translations say Comforter)
To reject the Advocate, who appeals on your behalf to God will leave the person to face the wrath of God.
WHICH brings Hebrews into a sad reality, that what God gives in Baptism of the Holy Spirit is the power of Healing, Deliverance, to overcome sin. So rejecting Christ Power is what a Christian does who allows their sin to overtake their body/mind to the point that they reject Christ Salvation, and the power of the Holy Spirit!” Therby losing what God gave them originally....SALVATION!
Scripture will always verify itself, and as Petrosius posted I John 5:16;17 verifies that there is a sin that leads to death.
There is spiritual death, and there is physical death:
Hebrews 6:1-3 is about Spiritual Death, that comes from not stopping sin, and willfully throwing away Salvation.
1 Corinthians 5:5 5hand this man over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved on the day of the LORD. Note: This is about physical death. And the church acceptance of the sin.
Petrosius is right “there is a clear distinction between Mortal sin, and sin that is not.”
No matter the Church, be it Protestant, Pentecostal, Catholic, or other. People tend to accept all that is taught in the pulpit, and that is not always the truth! Even publications from Churches are NOT always correct, so reading the Bible and praying about it will always be productive to grasping what it is God was saying!
John 14:26 New King James Version (NKJV)
26 But the [a]Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.
Petrosius, I pray I did not offend you by my posting. God bless you.
metmom... We all can learn from the Bible, what God is saying through reading and asking the Holy Spirit to clarify. Blessings.
I knew the answer. It’s why I asked. I wanted to if you did.
However your position means if the believer commits a mortal sin they’ve lost salvation forever. The NT doesn’t teach that.
Not at all! It is an open forum. Post away and thank you for your support.
Makes sense.
It can be summed up, I think, one word: Unbelief.
Of course, the definition of ‘unbelief’ is rejection of the Holy Spirit’s work to lead you to Jesus’s redeeming power.
However your position means if the believer commits a mortal sin they’ve lost salvation forever. The NT doesn’t teach that.
***
It seems here that there’s a misunderstanding, or at least that’s not what I understood from Ambrosia’s comments.
I don’t think that Ambrosia is saying that committing sin will lose salvation, other than blasphemy against the Holy Spirit, as Jesus said. Which, far as I can tell, she defines as the rejection of the work of the Spirit in leading one to Jesus. And so it’s unpardonable, because committing that sin means that one will NEVER repent, and so never have forgiveness.
Which is a little different than the Catholic definition of mortal sin, I think?
Correct me if I’m wrong about what I’m hearing, of course.
Thanks, but Hebrews is in the NT!
Actually Hebrews 6: 4-6 is about the person with Salvation, and the Baptism of the Holy Spirit, who has operated in the any of the nine gifts of the Spirit, if they decide to willfully sin and give up their belief in Christ to do so, it cannot be reclaimed...as they have had all God can give them here on earth!
I will post a link, a bible study that tells what those gifts are and how they operate.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Corinthians+12&version=KJV
Scripture on gifts:
Let me help you understand ACTS, and PENTECOST...that is when Disciples and many others (3000) received the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. NOW, many teach that was done away with when the Disciples were on the earth, however that is impossible. Saul of Taurus was killing Christians, and became Paul the Apostle, after he was converted, WHICH DID NOT HAPPEN UNTIL JESUS HAD ASCENDED INTO HEAVEN, AND MET HIM (IN THE SPIRIT) ON THE ROAD TO DAMASCUS!
Now, Paul the Apostle wrote the Book of I Corinthians 12 which teaches about the Gifts of the Holy Spirit, so WHY would Paul bother teaching the Church how to operate in the nine gifts of the Holy Spirit, if they did not have them?
Those gifts operate in most Pentecostal, Catholic Groups filled with HS, and other Charismatic Groups.
At Notre Dame in their auditorium 3000 Catholics were filled with HS, and began speaking in tongues, and that movement is still alive today, only not in Mass.... here is link that will help you understand that phenomena!
So please realize that God is still infilling people like the day of Pentecost, and the last great revival is on the horizon It will be made up of lots of Denominations, filled with Holy Spirit including Catholics!
There will be about 3 people in Heaven.
However, if you read all of Hebrews 11 you will see your position is not supported by the texts.
Why are you twisting my words around, there is NO WHERE in any of my posts that I say if one sins, they lose their salvation forever! That makes no sense. Did you take English in High School, because this stinks of a problem with reading comprehension!
OR you disagree, so you want to trash me and my answers! My position is supported by texts. And other scripture in the Bible. Like these:
Jesus said he had to go away that the Holy Spirit may come. Well, Salvation is all you need to go to heaven, however, there is more. The nine gifts of the spirit can only operate through the power of the Holy
spirit who indwells his people.
John 16:7 7But very truly I tell you, it is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Advocate will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you.
Luke…11:12 What father among you, if his son asks for a fish, will give him a snake instead? 12 Or if he asks for an egg, will give him a scorpion? 13 So if you who are evil know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him!”…
AND he instructed the Disciples to go to the Upper Room.....ACTS.. Pentecost!
The ones who will lose their Salvation are those who operate in the gifts of the Spirit and THROW THEIR SALVATION AWAY, because they cannot crucify Christ a second time!
Perhaps you need to re-read what those gifts of the Spirit are and begin practical application.
NO, you know I said only those WHO ARE FILLED WITH HOLY SPIRIT AND THROW THEIR SALVATION AWAY, TO STAY IN SIN lose their Salvation, because they are trying to crucify Christ again. Hebrews 6: 4-6 READ IT UNTIL YOU GET IT!
Because Christians sin all the time and get forgiveness! There is only one type of person who fits Hebrews 6: 4-6
I understand it! Maybe you never will! Too bad.
The verse says *fallen away* not *turned away and chose to reject*.
The reading that this is to believers then means that if the believer falls into sin, they are done for. Their fate is sealed, and they are consigned to hell forever.
The nine gifts of the spirit can only operate through the power of the Holy spirit who indwells his people.
There are more than nine gifts of the Holy Spirit. There are other lists besides 1 Corinthians 12.
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