Posted on 11/02/2015 6:56:55 AM PST by Salvation
All Souls’ Day by Jakub Schikaneder, 1888
I have blogged before on Purgatory. Here is a link to one of those blogs: Purgatory – Biblical and Reasonable. I have also written more extensively on its biblical roots here: PDF Document on Purgatory.
On this Feast of All Souls, I want to reflect on Purgatory as the necessary result of a promise. Many people think of Purgatory primarily in terms of punishment, but it is also important to consider it in terms of promise, purity, and perfection. Some of our deceased brethren are having the promises made to them perfected in Purgatory. In the month of November we are especially committed to praying for them and we know by faith that our prayers are of benefit to them.
What is the promise that points to Purgatory? Simply stated, Jesus made the promise in Matthew 5:48: You, therefore, must be perfect as your Heavenly Father is perfect. In this promise is an astonishing declaration of our dignity. We are to share in the very nature and perfection of God. This is our dignity: we are called to reflect and possess the very glory and perfection of God.
St. Catherine of Siena was gifted by the Lord to see a heavenly soul in the state of grace. Her account of it is related in her Dialogue, and is summarized in the Sunday School Teacher’s Explanation of the Baltimore Catechism:
The Soul in the State of Grace– Catherine of Siena was permitted by God to see the beauty of a soul in the state of grace. It was so beautiful that she could not look on it; the brightness of that soul dazzled her. Blessed Raymond, her confessor, asked her to describe to him, as far as she was able, the beauty of the soul she had seen. St. Catherine thought of the sweet light of that morning, and of the beautiful colors of the rainbow, but that soul was far more beautiful. She remembered the dazzling beams of the noonday sun, but the light which beamed from that soul was far brighter. She thought of the pure whiteness of the lily and of the fresh snow, but that is only an earthly whiteness. The soul she had seen was bright with the whiteness of Heaven, such as there is not to be found on earth. †My father,†she answered. “I cannot find anything in this world that can give you the smallest idea of what I have seen. Oh, if you could but see the beauty of a soul in the state of grace, you would sacrifice your life a thousand times for its salvation. I asked the angel who was with me what had made that soul so beautiful, and he answered me, “It is the image and likeness of God in that soul, and the Divine Grace which made it so beautiful.†[1].
Yes, this is our dignity and final destiny if we are faithful to God.
So, I ask you, “Are you there yet?†God has made you a promise. But what if that promise has not yet been fulfilled and you were to die today, without the divine perfection you have been promised having been completed? I can only speak for myself and say that if I were to die today, though I am not aware of any mortal sin, I also know that I am not perfect. I am not even close to being humanly perfect, let alone having the perfection of our heavenly Father!
But Jesus made me a promise: You must be perfect as the heavenly Father is perfect. And the last time I checked, Jesus is a promise keeper! St. Paul says, May God who has begun a good work in you bring it to completion (Phil 1:6). Hence, if I were to die today, Jesus would need to complete a work that He has begun in me. By God’s grace, I have come a mighty long way. But I also have a long way to go. God is very holy and His perfection is beyond imagining.
Yes, there are many things in us that need purging: sin, attachment to sin, clinging to worldly things, and those rough edges to our personality. Likewise most of us carry with us hurts, regrets, sorrows, and disappointments. We cannot take any of this with us to Heaven. If we did, it wouldn’t be Heaven. So the Lord, who is faithful to His promise, will purge all of this from us. The Book of Revelation speaks of Jesus ministering to the dead in that he will wipe every tear from their eyes (Rev 21:4). 1 Corinthians 3:13-15 speaks of us as passing through fire in order that our works be tested so that what is good may be purified and what is worldly may be burned away. And Job said, But he knows the way that I take; and when he has tested me, I will come forth as pure gold (Job 23:10).
Purgatory has to be—gold, pure gold; refined, perfect, pure gold. Purgatory has to be, if God’s promises are to hold.
Catholic theology has always taken seriously God’s promise that we would actually be perfect as the Father is perfect. The righteousness is Jesus’ righteousness, but it actually transforms us and changes us completely in the way that St. Catherine describes. It is a real righteousness, not merely imputed, not merely declared of us by inference. It is not an alien justice, but a personal justice by the grace of God.
Esse quam videri – Purgatory makes sense because the perfection promised to us is real: esse quam videri (to be rather than to seem). We must actually be purged of the last vestiges of imperfection, worldliness, sin, and sorrow. Having been made perfect by the grace of God, we are able to enter Heaven, of which Scripture says, Nothing impure will ever enter it (Rev 21:27). And again, you have approached Mount Zion and the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and countless angels in festal gathering, and the assembly of the firstborn enrolled in heaven, and God the judge of all, and the souls of the just made perfect (Heb 12:22-23).
How could it be anything less? Indeed, the souls of the just made perfect. How could it be anything less if Jesus died to accomplish it for us? Purgatory makes sense based on Jesus’ promise and on the power of His blood to accomplish complete and total perfection for us. This is our dignity; this is our destiny. Purgatory is about promises, not mere punishment. There’s an old Gospel hymn that I referenced in yesterday’s blog for the Feast of All Saints that says, “O Lord I’m running, trying to make a hundred. Ninety-nine and a half won’t do!â€
That’s right, ninety-nine and a half won’t do. Nothing less than a hundred is possible because we have Jesus’ promise and the wonderful working power of the precious Blood of the Lamb. For most, if not all of us, Purgatory has to be.
“Protestants have abandoned the Greek manuscript chain and the translations of them upon which Sola Scriptura was based. Why does it matter ? The KJV contradicts MrRogers’s assertion that there is no condemnation of a Christian...”
No. We use the Greek manuscripts, although not the translations of them.
The NASB:
“GREEK TEXT: Consideration was given to the latest available manuscripts with a view to determining the best Greek text. In most instances the 26th edition of Eberhard Nestle’s NOVUM TESTAMENTUM GRAECE was followed.”
AFV: “The KJV contradicts MrRogers’s assertion that there is no condemnation of a Christian while a Christian is committing mortal sins (walking after the flesh), and not walking after the Spirit.”
Paul says later in Chapter 8:
“However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him. 10 If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness...12 So then, brethren, we are under obligation, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh— 13 for if you are living according to the flesh, you must die; but if by the Spirit you are putting to death the deeds of the body, you will live. 14 For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. 15 For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, but you have received a spirit of adoption as sons by which we cry out, “Abba! Father!†16 The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God, 17 and if children, heirs also, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him so that we may also be glorified with Him.”
And as Paul wrote in his next letter to the Corinthians:
“17 Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come. 18 All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us the ministry of reconciliation; 19 that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation. 20 Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God. 21 For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.”
The scripture does not divide sins into mortal and venial, for ALL sins are mortal - the wages of sin is DEATH. But believers are born again, into a new life:
“But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, 13 who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.” - John 1
“...31 but these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.” - John 20
The One who gives new life knows what He is doing. The one who works his way to heaven will never get there. To return to Romans 8:
“29 For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. 30 And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.”
You forgot one important fact...We have the scriptures and we can see when you guys are not telling the truth...
1Co 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
As we can see from actually reading scripture, no one is the building spoken of...Not I nor you nor anyone you've ever known...
The context is the foundation...And how Christians build upon the foundation, NOT that Christians become the building...
We build the building...We do not become the building...
The flames do not come any where near the Christian...
You ought to be ashamed of yourself trying to pull a fast one like that...
Could you please define what your understanding of Biblical Inerrancy is?
Do you accept the Catholic NABRE as the Word of God?
What is the authorized English language translation of the Bible for the Catholic church?
since there is no suffering ("fire") there.
There's no suffering in 1Cor. 3:15 either...It's the works that get burned up, not the Christian...Read the rest of the verses that clearly explain that...
The Catholic doctrine of purgatory alone explains this passage.
Ridiculous...
I don't see a contradiction of the Byzantine vs. Alexandrian primary texts. The verse that follows makes it clear. We can discuss that if you want. Mr Rogers NEVER made a claim reference Christians committing mortal sins getting a free ride on such sins. He pointed out in one post the entirety of Romans 8 where Paul tells the Roman church "whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified." Sounds like a promise.
What happened when David committed murder and adultery? What did God do to reach David? He convicted David through Nathan the prophet. Who do we as Christians have to convict us of sin? Who do we have as Christians to give us the strength to resist temptations? Who do we have as Christians to indwell us and conform us to the Image of the Son?
If we lack faith for our Almighty God to preserve us and sanctify us, are we not denying His Power and Promise? Is that not sinning against the Holy Spirit Who testifies of Christ's Finished Work?
I have to ask again. Is not the NABRE the official and approved English language version Bible for the Catholic church? If yes then you should not be pointing fingers at Mr Rogers. The NABRE has the same wording of Romans 8 as the NASB.
“What happened when David committed murder and adultery? What did God do to reach David? He convicted David through Nathan the prophet. Who do we as Christians have to convict us of sin? Who do we have as Christians to give us the strength to resist temptations? Who do we have as Christians to indwell us and conform us to the Image of the Son? “
Worth repeating, praise God!
Now the things which I write unto you, behold, before God, I lie not.That's in the form of a valid oath. Notice he doesn't swear by some thing. he is simply affirming a solemn truth in the form of an oath. That's what an oath is for. There is no contradiction. Paul did not violate the law, because Jesus did not change the law. He reformed our understanding of it. The issue isn't finding the right verbal formula for making promises while crossing your fingers. The issue is saying what you mean, and meaning what you say. Integrity. And that law will never change. Period.
(Galatians 1:20)
I know it is Autumn with nice stacks of straw on farms. A great time of year to make straw men.
Please do explain to me your objection to the apostle Paul when he said:
"For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified. What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?" (ROMANS 8)
Are we to deny the same God who is sovereign in calling us, and justifying us will give us a serpent instead of a fish?
Kind Sir you have been most misinformed. Evangelicals who by God's Grace are born again know they are called to lead pure lives in brotherly love and lead orderly lives (1 Thessalonians 4).
For such honors our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and we want to be pleasing to Him presenting our "bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable to God, which is your reasonable service."
**Kind Sir you have been most misinformed. Evangelicals who by God’s Grace are born again know they are called to lead pure lives in brotherly love and lead orderly lives (1 Thessalonians 4). **
If only their posting followed the “no sin” path.
No, that is not what the text says:
For we are God' s coadjutors: you are God' s husbandry; you are God' s building (1 Cor. 3:9)
And then:
he shall suffer loss; but he himself shall be saved, yet so as by fire. (1 Cor. 3:15)
These verses clearly refer to the man himself being allegorized as a building. I agree that the man also appears as a builder in Verse 10, as are Paul and Apollo, but that is consistent with the view that the people in focus are Christians building their lives on the foundation of Christ. It does not refer strictly to ministerial clergy, since the metaphor Paul provides applies to "every man".
ZERO mention of sin or impurity
Sin indeed is not in the picture because Purgatory, not Hell is described here. "Impurity" as a word means admixture of lower material and we obviously have plenty of references to that here.
Your quote is fine by itself but the fallacy is interpretation by omission: you refuse to acknowledge the verses who speak of each man being purified by fire yet saved. In other words there is a description of purgatory in front of you so you quote the preceding verses as if they negate the description.
1030 [...] after death they undergo purification, so as to achieve the holiness necessary to enter the joy of heaven.
So where is the Catechism disputing that the final purification occurs solely on the supernatural merits of Christ by Whose blood we are saved?
The "only partially cleansed by the blood of the Lamb" is indeed a canard not found in the Catechism nor any other Catholic source.
Thank you for this detailed analysis. We are dealing with obfuscation here. I cannot say if the obfuscation is intentional, for at this point Protestantism has accumulated a thick culture of lies about the Holy Scripture, that people internalize and pass on as scriptural content in earnest.
1 Cor. 3:9 says otherwise.
“These verses clearly refer to the man himself being allegorized as a building.”
“He who plants and he who waters are one, and each will receive his wages according to his labor. For we are God’s fellow workers. You are God’s field, God’s building.”
Hmmm. We vs You. We is not the same as you.
“According to the grace of God given to me, like a skilled master builder I laid a foundation, and someone else is building upon it.”
Someone builds a foundation, but they are not the foundation they are building. To make it even clearer, someone else is now working on the building, so unless they are also working on Paul (who is not at Corinth), it means...yeah, it means Paul is NOT the building.
But then, most builders are not the building.
” since the metaphor Paul provides applies to “every man”. “
I assume you refer to verse 8, in the DR: “Now he that planteth, and he that watereth, are one. And every man shall receive his own reward, according to his own labour.”
By most standard use of language, the “every man” refers back to the farm workers, not every man in the world.
Suppose I wrote, “The team worked very hard. Every one was hot.” Would that mean everyone on the team, or everyone in the world? Yep! Team!
Same thing applies to verse 10, in the DR: “According to the grace of God that is given to me, as a wise architect, I have laid the foundation; and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.”
Every refers back to those doing the building. As the ESV puts it: “According to the grace of God given to me, like a skilled master builder I laid a foundation, and someone else is building upon it. Let each one take care how he builds upon it.”
As Robertson puts it:
According to his own labour (kata ton idion kopon). God will bestow to each the reward that his labour deserves. That is the pay that the preacher is sure to receive. He may get too little or too much here from men. But the due reward from God is certain and it will be adequate however ungrateful men may be.
Take heed how he buildeth thereon (blepetoo pos epoikodomei). The carpenters have need of caution how they carry out the plans of the original architect. Successive architects of great cathedrals carry on through centuries the original design. The result becomes the wonder of succeeding generations. There is no room for individual caprice in the superstructure.
http://www.studylight.org/commentaries/rwp/view.cgi?bk=45&ch=3
However, basic English also suffices. These verses clearly DO NOT refer to the man himself being allegorized as a building.
What is the Bible verse that says you go to purgatory?
Verse 9 and Verse 15 do.
“you refuse to acknowledge the verses who speak of each man being purified by fire yet saved.”
Those verses do not exist.
“he “only partially cleansed by the blood of the Lamb” is indeed a canard not found in the Catechism nor any other Catholic source.”
“1030 All who die in God’s grace and friendship, but still imperfectly purified, are indeed assured of their eternal salvation; but after death they undergo purification, so as to achieve the holiness necessary to enter the joy of heaven.”
“but still imperfectly purified”
Christ’s blood failed. It left us imperfectly purified, so our own suffering and torment needs to cleanse us - according to the Catholic Church. Christ failed, but man will earn a spot in heaven. Catholic theology, not mine.
“Verse 9 and Verse 15 do.”
Verse 9: “For we are God’s fellow workers. You are God’s field, God’s building.”
We. You. These words are not the same. Verse 9 does not mean what you say it means.
Verse 15: “If anyone’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire.”
If anyone’s work in building the church, since it is the BUILDING tested by fire, not the BUILDER. The builder will remain saved, but he suffers the loss of his ministry - because he did not build to last, but built on his own power.
In any case, verse 15 does NOT suggest the man is the building.
Let’s try the New Living Bible, since it is easier to read:
“5 After all, who is Apollos? Who is Paul? We are only God’s servants through whom you believed the Good News. Each of us did the work the Lord gave us. 6 I planted the seed in your hearts, and Apollos watered it, but it was God who made it grow. 7 It’s not important who does the planting, or who does the watering. What’s important is that God makes the seed grow. 8 The one who plants and the one who waters work together with the same purpose. And both will be rewarded for their own hard work. 9 For we are both God’s workers. And you are God’s field. You are God’s building.
10 Because of God’s grace to me, I have laid the foundation like an expert builder. Now others are building on it. But whoever is building on this foundation must be very careful. 11 For no one can lay any foundation other than the one we already have - Jesus Christ.
12 Anyone who builds on that foundation may use a variety of materials - gold, silver, jewels, wood, hay, or straw. 13 But on the judgment day, fire will reveal what kind of work each builder has done. The fire will show if a person’s work has any value. 14 If the work survives, that builder will receive a reward. 15 But if the work is burned up, the builder will suffer great loss. The builder will be saved, but like someone barely escaping through a wall of flames.”
Does that help?
Context; Heaven is not a democracy, nor a republic. I already posted the scripture that shows Moses' prophecy and that the Prophet to come would speak God's words, so yes, He can legislate from the bench.
I've yet to find the phrase "moral law" in the scriptures themselves to differentiate one of the 613 commandments from another. Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it. For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
Exodus, Catholic chapter twenty, Protestant verses eight to eleven,
James, Catholic chapter two, Protestant verse ten,
as authorized, but not authored, by King James
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