Statue of the Virgin Mary is Left Miraculously Intact After Fire

Aletelia ^ | August 24, 2015

[fatima]

I don’t know I’m not a theologian .I was just wondering what other faiths think and why that title is so offensive to them.I’m glad I read this thread.It gives me a better understanding of what people are trying to say.I do have a special devotion to Our Lady.

[delchiante]

I am familiar with the 15 promises.. And sought to test them with scripture as scripture tells us to test the spirits 1 John 4:1. And prove all things- 1 Thess 5:21

And I didn’t get past the first promise before ‘Mary is quoted’ conflicting Her Son when He quoted Deuteronomy to satan ..
The Living Word made flesh quoted His Living Word when confronting Satan- and this Mary conflicted with it..

His Word is Truth. John 17:17

no lie is of the truth, scripture also tells me that. 1 John 2:21

And the only way to explain it away as not a conflict is to come up with a different definition for ‘serve me’- kind of like we saw with a famous lying president with the word ‘is’..

Rome is proud of their Mary. That Mary has come down here and given promises.
I was ignorant of those until a nice Catholic handed me them as a gift-
And what a gift!

But in the exact opposite direction, which is a blessing from Yah.

And I didn’t get through the first promise before I saw her contradicting the Savior..

I suspect the more a protestant hears those or sees those promises,the more they may want to test them against His Word.

They too may see that Rome has created a false Christ, another Jesus..and another Mary.

Because I readily admit, this Mary points to Jesus in Promise 14.. And I would argue that point with Protestants (and have to, ums and ahs)

That is when I realized the faith I had in Rome’s Jesus was misplaced..and I was a ‘Presbyterian’ when I realized my faith was in Rome’s story, not the Scriptural story.

And I repented from trusting and believing inherited lies.. Just like Jeremiah 16:19 quotes- The Gentiles shall come to thee from the ends of the earth, and shall say, Surely our fathers have inherited lies, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit.

I did only by His Amazing Grace.

But I admit to being different.

I don’t call today Tiw’s day, Casaer augustus 25th day, like the world that wonders after Rome-giving honor to false gods and roman emperors.

I use His Word and His Creation that tells me today is His 2nd Day, the 10th Day of His 6th month. 10 days since the anniversary of His real Birth, when heavens showed the woman clothed with the sun and the moon was under her feet (Rev 12)

Amazing how much Rome has influenced the world away from His Truth..
Simply by testing Rome and everything it teaches with His Word,one can see a house of cards..

It would seem really odd to folks, if not the proohecies given in Daniel and Revelation..

You better believe I am ‘conversant’ with Rome.

Right down to every counterfeit they have made.

And He didn’t let me stay anywhere near there. Even within a daughter of hers..
Nor did He move me into Judaism.

I was led completely out.. And what a blessing I pray all can experience..
True Freedom from this counterfeit world.

For those with eyes to see and ears to hear .

HalleluYAH!

[Faith Presses On]

As I mentioned in an earlier post, I would like to see some pictures of the area before the fire. Searches turned up nothing but I did with a little looking come across the location for this on Google Maps. The pictures are only from the other side, the roads that are visible in the background, but they do tell us some things. I'm going to try posting them, but in case I'm not able to, they're at this community page on Facebook that I own.

From looking around the area, though, which was from what I saw covered with overgrown grass that was likely not cut often, it seems that the grass that didn't burn might not have done so because it was regularly cut, to keep the statue visible, so there was nothing for the fire to spread to.

Another picture of the statue area after the fire, with more detail:



Then from Google maps:





In the top photo, recognizable features like some graffiti, a couple buildings, a traffic sign, and some sort of tower are visible.

In the bottom photo, the statue area is out of sight behind the smaller tree, or large bush, on the right.

[Faith Presses On]

I just posted pictures of the general area from Google Maps, and it seems it was covered with tall grass or brush that likely wasn’t cut often. In that case, it seems the area around the statue, however, would have been maintained, or else it would have become overgrown, and that also seems to be supported by the fact that the grass that didn’t burn appears very short. So the fire might not have spread to the cut-down grass around the statue for that reason.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/3328713/posts?page=203#203

[piusv]

Thanks for researching it. Is it just me or do those flowers look photo-shopped? They are way too tall. Not sure about the statue though.

[NYer]

Thumbs up, dear friend.

[redleghunter]

Who did Jesus go to first, even before His Father, after His resurrection?

Mary Magdeline. Not His mother Mary.

[papertyger]

Do Catholics believe that through Mary the eternal God was created? Or that Jesus didn’t exist until He was conceived by the Holy Spirit in Mary’s womb?

Neither. But your mention of the Trinity is illustrative.

I would recommend following Martin Luther's admonition:

[S]he became the Mother of God, in which work so many and such great good things are bestowed on her as pass man's understanding. For on this there follows all honor, all blessedness, and her unique place in the whole of mankind, among which she has no equal, namely, that she had a child by the Father in heaven, and such a Child.... Hence men have crowded all her glory into a single word, calling her the Mother of God.... None can say of her nor announce to her greater things, even though he had as many tongues as the earth possesses flowers and blades of grass: the sky, stars; and the sea, grains of sand. It needs to be pondered in the heart what it means to be the Mother of God." Luther's Works, 21:326, cf. 21:346.

[papertyger]

I am familiar with the 15 promises.. And sought to test them with scripture as scripture tells us to test the spirits 1 John 4:1. And prove all things- 1 Thess 5:21

I understand all that. I also understand the fervency you have for the Word. What I question is the validity with which you apply your Scriptural test. And this for a number of reasons.

Certainly, if Protestants applied the same standard of punctiliousness for "serve" as they do for "call no man Father," there would be no one left to call Protestant.

Indeed, among the Children of the Reformation, there are a great many meta-doctrines, anecdotes, and aphorisms on how closely to apply various texts that are in no way authorized by the text itself.

These extra-biblical "doctrines" are used to permit convenient latitude on matters such as divorce and remarriage, attire and comportment of women, qualifications of leadership, what kind of leadership, treatment of heresies, heretics and unrepentant sinners...etc.

Usually, these "work-arounds" are granted an informal kind of authorization attributed to a "leading of the Holy Spirit." The problem with that glib "explanation" is there is precious little uniformity of these "authorizations" across the various Protestant sects.

Next, despite many scriptural warnings against seeking to be justified by law, Protestants have in many ways made the Bible into a de facto "law" in itself, though usually for the purposes of condemnation of dissenters rather than justification for themselves.

Finally, I question the validity of the "test" you apply, because invariably Protestants will look only to like minded people to answer the question of whether the test was applied correctly, ignoring or condemning those who don't agree, quickly followed by all manner of chauvinistic accusations as to *why* there was disagreement.

Personally, I believe it is the highest form of "straining at gnats, and swallowing camels" when a Christian of any sect takes obvious relish in acting the "accuser of our brethren."

[Faith Presses On]

I wouldn’t necessarily go by what Luther said, especially a snippet.

As I said, evangelicals believe Jesus is God, and as He came to earth and took human form, Mary was His mother in that sense. It is the stated Catholic belief as well. There is no problem with “Mother of God” in that sense.

The trouble comes in in all sorts of other places where Catholicism rejects other Christian doctrines to give Mary and her human relationship to Jesus, and His birth, an undue place. There’s a focusing on things that’s misplaced.

Yes, she’s unique in a way. But the really important thing is the Spirit of God through Jesus coming to live within a person, so that they, who were spiritually dead, become spiritually alive. In that way, we also have God living within us.

Catholicism makes her so unique, that she’s isolated. She’s not a person of the Trinity, but she’s not like anyone else in the Church, when I think that she is in some ways is true, and that would be just what spiritually she would and does want, the fellowship of equals among other creatures. The Bible descriptions of her show she felt that way. I also think that what Catholics would burden her with, if it were possible, no person would want to be burdened with as they are the burdens of God Himself. The Bible teaches that if in obedience to God we surrender ourselves He will give us what truly fulfills us, and that means what God created us to be, even if we don’t in the beginning see ourselves as we really are. If we are more or less than we should be, as God made us to be, we can’t have true spiritual contentment. At the end of the day, Mary knew that she was Jesus’ mother in many ways that were not like the God the Father and God the Son relationship.

[avenir]

“Catholicism makes her so unique, that she’s isolated. She’s not a person of the Trinity, but she’s not like anyone else in the Church, when I think that she is in some ways is true, and that would be just what spiritually she would and does want, the fellowship of equals among other creatures. The Bible descriptions of her show she felt that way. I also think that what Catholics would burden her with, if it were possible, no person would want to be burdened with as they are the burdens of God Himself. The Bible teaches that if in obedience to God we surrender ourselves He will give us what truly fulfills us, and that means what God created us to be, even if we don’t in the beginning see ourselves as we really are. If we are more or less than we should be, as God made us to be, we can’t have true spiritual contentment. At the end of the day, Mary knew that she was Jesus’ mother in many ways that were not like the God the Father and God the Son relationship.”

Well said.

[papertyger]

I wouldn’t necessarily go by what Luther said, especially a snippet.

May I ask on what grounds you so gratuitously dismiss and demean a valid citation as "a snippet?"

What Christian "doctrines" are Catholics violating to give Mary her "undue place?"

[FourtySeven]

Thanks for the research. I would say your theory is plausible but some questions remain:

1. Were the flowers in the photo added before or after the fire. (The article in the OP seems to indicate they were added before, which is miraculous if so)

2. Why is the statue not scorched? It’s clearly made of a whitish stone so would easily show soot or scorch marks. I suppose it’s possible someone cleaned it after the fire but there’s no mention of that anywhere.

Like all proposed miracles, there’s always a way to doubt the claim. Sometimes even reasonable ways to doubt. In this instance, I’m not really convinced to doubt. Even if the grass around the statue was too short to spread the fire to the statue the grass itself would still be scorched, as heat and hot ash from the surrounding fire spread to it. It’s not.

I chose to believe the surrounding area (and hence the statue itself) was spared the heat of the fire by Mary. Such power is hers to command but doesn’t originate from her. It’s her Son’s power given to her. For our benefit. If we chose to see.

[delchiante]

I am not a ‘protestant’ anymore is my point, if protestant means Roman Catholic vs Protestant..(which is the debate that happens here a lot)

I realized my debates within the Catholic vs Protestant circle was first founded on a false premise that I used to accept. I do not accept that premise anymore thanks to Him.

The false premise is that Rome has any authority or standing with the God of Abraham,Isaac and Jacob or His Beloved Son..

They do not.

They have counterfeited the things of God..cleverly.. A vessel for the enemy,like Islam is- and like Judaism is...all babel..

And until one sees that, the Catholic vs Protestant debate is simply a circling fire line with circular reasoning started with a false premise, that will lead no one to genuine Truth..

I am no longer a ‘protestant’ debating Roman Catholics about their Jesus and their Mary. They created them. They own them.
I do ‘protest’ Rome and I guess by extension Roman Christianity (which is the whole thing these days) because of the counterfeiting that has taken place.

He showed me that Rome’s Jesus and Mary are counterfeits to Truth.

Bottom line? All the protestants you debate accept Rome’s authority and Rome’s Jesus and Rome’s Mary .

I do not anymore. That is why I have had protestants defending Rome in an odd twist at times on the forum.

Protestants and the world needs Rome.. They need them to tell them what day it is. They need to tell them when to work and when to worship.

I used to. But I am free..

You and I don’t start with the same premise so you and I won’t agree on anything.

I am not a part of Roman Christianity, or Islam, or judiasm or any other sect/denomination that begins with Rome having any authority on times, laws, or the Creator of the Universe.

You have a right to feel wronged and attacked by protestant daughters that haven’t done the testing He led me to do..

They protest things without wondering how much of their foundation is founded on Rome and not Him.. Blinded from it.
And I has humbled in that process..

But again, I see today as His 3rd Day. Not like those protestant neighbors of mine who mock and ridicule a Roman Catholic Pope on one side of their mouth, all the while trusting Rome’s calendar named after a Pope (Pope Gregory-gregorian) to tell them when to work and worship on the other side of their mouth.
Again, prophetic..

He showed me my own hypocrisy.. And I repented.

And I have been greatly blessed by Him for it.

[A child of Yah]

I’m totally unfamiliar with “Nestorian”, yet I’m sure that anything that steps outside the perimeters of an “organized religion” will always be considered “heretical”.

“Faith Presses On” pretty much sums it up because it is difficult for me within my own limited understanding to convey it in mere words.

I’m just not on board for that phrase or title: “Mother of God” being assigned to Mary. I have never seen it in Scripture, and our LORD’S WORD will always be the measuring stick of my life here, now and forever.

I also enjoy the freedom I have from not participating in any “organized religious sect” because I don’t have to adhere to any of their dictates. I will always rely on the Holy Spirit to teach me all things and to guide me into all truth, and my mind is not closed to learning more as I grow in His Word.

[A child of Yah]

you are very welcome ... smiles and hugs back (*<>*)

[FourtySeven]

Thank you for posting this. I actually must admit I did not know about these promises, at least I’d heard there were some promises attached to the Rosary but I never knew what they were.

#1. Whosoever shall faithfully serve me by the recitation of the Rosary shall receive signal graces.

“Signal Graces are those special and unique Graces to help sanctify us in our state in life. See the remaining promises for an explanation for which these will consist. St. Louis de Montfort states emphatically that the best and fastest way to union with Our Lord is via Our Lady [True Devotion to Mary, chapter four].” Source: http://www.ourladyswarriors.org/prayer/15promise.htm

I didn’t know what “signal graces” were until today so thank you again. All the more reason (for me) to pray the Rosary every day, given that promise and the other 14. Also I’d say a reading of St. de Montfort’s writing cited there would be in order.

Thanks for your help!

[ealgeone]

You might want to read about that really close. Notice the emphasis on doing these things for Mary....being devoted to her.

Your quote from Montfort really shows the false teaching associated with the catholic Mary....."the best and fastest way to union with our Lord is via Our Lady".

You will not find that any where in the New Testament.

Why?

Because it's a false teaching.

[escapefromboston]

Maybe you should consider being a Christian.

[RoosterRedux]

I am a monk.

My entire existence is devoted to our Lord and Savior.