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This Protestant Researched Marian Miracles, & What He Learned Blew His Mind
Churchpop ^ | April 4, 2015 | Albert Little -

Posted on 04/05/2015 1:59:53 PM PDT by NYer

Dizzy Girl / Flickr

Satan cannot drive out Satan. A house, or a kingdom, cannot be divided against itself.

The synoptic gospels of Matthew, Mark, and Luke all record this profound event in the earthly ministry of Jesus Christ. After healing a demon-possessed man, Jesus is confronted by the Pharisees, the pious religious leaders of the time, who question what authority Jesus has to cast out demons. They suggest, since Jesus certainly can’t possibly be working through the power of God, that it must be Satan, the devil, that’s given Him the power to drive out the demonic.

I think it’s safe to say that Jesus’s profound theological observation—that Satan can’t work against himself—can be applied to the context of modern day miracles as well.

Miracles, like those connected to the appearance or the intercession of the Virgin Mary, cannot possibly be explained as work of Satan. Miracles which, for all intents and purposes, draw millions to Jesus Christ Himself. When I dug deep into the historical miracles of the Catholic Church, especially those connected with the intercession and appearance of the Virgin Mary, I knew I had something enormous to contend with. What I found, dear reader, blew my mind.

As a Protestant, especially a Pentecostal, miracles weren’t something wholly unfamiliar to my faith life or to my understanding of Christianity. Far from it. In the middle years of my University life I attended a charismatic Pentecostal church in town where faith healings, speaking in tongues, and being slain in the Spirit were par for the course in a Sunday evening meeting. I’ve witnesses miracles, to be sure.

When I began to explore the Catholic Church, however, I was perplexed, as a Protestant, as to how miracles could be attributed to the intercession of Mary. To begin, I didn’t understand that notion of the intercession of the saints, so that didn’t help. But I worried, as well, that perhaps all those superstitious Catholics had the wool pulled over their eyes, so to speak, by the Father of Lies, Satan himself.

I think this is a fairly common concern of evangelical Protestants—at least this was my experience. What if the miracles of Mary were nothing more than a garden variety strategy by Satan to lead the Catholic Church, and well-meaning Catholic Christians, away from the truth of Christ? What if, instead of raising up Christ, these miracles were a diabolical means to elevate Mary to the status of an idol? My fear, as a good Pentecostal Protestant, was that Satan had put Mary in the way of Christ.

But how can a kingdom be divided against itself? It can’t. Jesus is clear.

Because, as I’ve learned, the Marian miracles, and there are scores and scores of them, do not lead well-meaning people away from Christ, towards Mary. The Marian miracles lead millions to Christ. And that can’t be the work of Satan.

Our Lady of the Miraculous Medal

In 1830 an apparition of the Virgin Mary appeared to Sister Catherine Laboure, a novice in the community of the Daughters of Charity in Paris, France. Over the course of several appearances, the Virgin Mary allegedly told Sister Catherine to have a medal fashioned in her image for faithful Catholics to wear around their necks.

Now called the Miraculous Medal, the medal itself features highly symbolic imagery of Mary and asserts, among other things, her Immaculate Conception, a dogma which wasn’t proclaimed by the Church until 24 years later, although it had been piously believed since the early foundation of the Christian Church.

Several things are critically important to understand about this story.

The first is this. The Virgin Mary appeared to Sister Catherine—these days canonized as St. Catherine—at a critical junction in the life of the Church. Although widely held to be true, the Church hadn’t promulgated an official teaching on the Immaculate Conception of the Virgin Mary—that is, she was conceived from the very first moment, protected by God, from sin. St. Catherine’s apparition of the Virgin Mary appeared at just the right time, making even more popular the widely held belief by establishing a mission to create and distribute the Miraculous Medal and its message.

The second important thing to understand is this. The body of St. Catherine is what the Church calls incorruptible. What does that mean? That means that coming up on 200 years after her death her body, which lies interred in the chapel where she first received this vision of the Virgin Mary, has not decayed.

I’ll say that again: Her body has not decayed. For how long now? 200 years.

What blows my mind, dear reader, is that not only have miracles been genuinely associated with the medal that the Blessed Mother gave to St. Catherine—that’s why it’s called the Miraculous Medal—but that, as if to underscore the reality of these miracles, Catherine’s body itself has not decayed, unpreserved, after nearly 200 years!

Our Lady of Guadalupe

In a nutshell, the miracle of Our Lady of Guadalupe is something after the heart of Jesus. Of course, because Mary’s miracles don’t work through some incredible power of Mary herself—they point to Christ—so we should expect, as she often does, Mary to appear to the poor and destitute, the young and the sick, as Jesus did, and would.

In 1531, the Virgin Mary appeared to a native American peasant named Juan Diego in a place just outside of Mexico City. Mary asked for Juan to petition the local bishop to have chapel build in her name. Juan, obviously awestruck, went to the bishop but his story wasn’t well received. In the course of several more appearances, and the continued reluctance of the bishop to believe Juan’s story, the Virgin Mary instructed him to gather some flowers into his cloak, flowers growing on a particular hill which, interestingly enough, weren’t native to the area (and shouldn’t have been growing at that time).

Finding the flowers, Juan gathered them up and went to see the bishop. When he opened his cloak to show the bishop the flowers, as proof of the Virgin Mary’s appearance and the truth of his story, he revealed quite a bit more.

Instead, the inside of Juan’s cloak was miraculously transformed into a deeply symbolic image of the Blessed Mother. Like the Miraculous Medal, 300 years later, the symbolism was incredibly rich, and the appearance of the image itself, entirely miraculous.

In fact, and incredibly, like the incorruptible body of St. Catherine the very same cloak worn by Juan Diego, displaying the image of Our Lady, can still be seen today, nearly 500 years later. The cloak and its preservation from decay, subjected to rigorous scientific tests, is truly beyond the explanation of science.

And pointing to Christ? The miracle of the cloak and word of its occurrence spread throughout Mexico and it’s believed that some eight million Aztec natives were converted to Christianity. The pilgrimage to see Juan’s cloak and the chapel which was, obviously, built in her name following the miracle, remains the largest pilgrimage in North America and sees millions of people every year come to celebrate Mass, and worship Jesus Christ, from all around the world.

That blows my mind.

Our Lady of Lourdes

Finally, the miracles of Our Lady of Lourdes.

In 1858, the Virgin Mary appeared to Bernadette Soubirous, a 14-year old peasant girl in Lourdes, France. In the course of several appearances, the Virgin Mary spoke to Bernadette who, like Juan, wasn’t at first believed by her parents and peers. But Bernadette insisted, and persisted, and Mary’s appearances culminated in the instruction to Bernadette to dig in a certain area of the ground, near the grotto, where Mary had been appearing.

From the area Bernadette dug a spring appeared. This spring would later go on to be connected with scores of miraculous physical and spiritual healings and gain official status in the Church as a place of great importance.

In fact, the incredible aspect of Lourdes, in my opinion, is the enormous body of evidence which exists to support the profound miracles perpetuated at this holy site. The Lourdes Medical Bureau, an organization which exists to examine and rule on possible miraculous healings, has declared 68 scientifically inexplicable miracles to have occurred at Lourdes. The Bureau itself is incredible in its sophistication and expertise made up on an enormous panel of expert doctors, including skeptics, from around the world and with a tightly-controlled and highly-regulated system for declaring what is, and isn’t, an unexplained miracle.

Out of some 7,000 cases the Bureau has examined 68 may seem like a small amount of genuine healings. But, think about this, that’s still 68 healings that science cannot, in any sense, explain.

That blows my mind.

Lourdes, to this day, is one of the most popular Catholic pilgrimage sites in the world.

Mary’s Miracles Always Point to Christ

A good, devout Catholic doesn’t need to believe in any of Mary’s miracles to be a Catholic. The Church teaches that private revelation, like these sorts of miracles, can be believed, or not. Even in cases, like Lourdes, where the Church definitively declares a miracle to have taken place it’s up to the individual believer to necessarily subscribe to it, or not.

Personally, and, obviously, there’s a lot of compelling stuff in here. For me, as a Protestant, I find no other way to explain these miracles than to say, flatly, that there’s something about Mary. Something incredible. Something blessed.

If God doesn’t work through the intercession of the saints, if Mary was no one more special than a fourteen year old Jewish virgin, then why is her intercession the cause of these profound miracles? Why, if she is not, as Catholics assert, first amongst the saints, would God use her in this way? It would, in the end, truly be pulling the wool over the eyes of Catholics if God used Mary in this way and let us go on, happily, believing in her special place in the kingdom.

If Mary isn’t who Catholics say she is, and if the saints aren’t to be venerated (asked to pray for us in the same way I ask my living, Christian friends to pray for me) then why would God allow her to appear, in this way, to mislead Catholics. Because, ultimately, it would be misleading if she appeared like this and she wasn’t someone special.

Would God allow that? Would God use that?

As a Protestant, I struggled for answers here.

It would be, utterly impossible, however, for Satan to be working in this way. I think that’s clear enough. Satan could never, and would never, use anything that would lead so many millions of people to a relationship with Christ—and that is precisely what these Marian miracles do.

There are only so many ways to explain our way out of this, and they all exhaust in a simple conclusion. And that conclusion, the truth about Mary, the saints, and their intercessory power, has blown my mind.



TOPICS: Catholic; Prayer; Religion & Culture; Religion & Science
KEYWORDS: catholic; miracles
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To: verga
What's that Country song? Oh yeah, First Time for Everything So glad I could help. ;o)
161 posted on 04/05/2015 9:24:09 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: Salvation
I once believed all of it and already have read much about the Our Lady of Guadalupe in Mexico. One version I read was build a temple for her, not a church.

Our Lady of Guadalupe Extremadura Spain (12th century)

Like I said, everything on the web is pro Our Lady of Guadalupa except for some sites I wouldn't want to use as sources. When JPII canonized Juan Diego, some warned him, but he went ahead and did it. It's got too much momentum to back pedal to anything else now.

I'll look at a few of your links but I think my mind about that one is closed now. In coming years it could even be dangerous as proponents of reconquista will rally under the banner of Our Lady of Guadalupe. Their fanaticism about her at this point knows no bounds.

So it is futile to have a rational discourse about it.

162 posted on 04/05/2015 9:25:49 PM PDT by Aliska
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To: NYer
What a whacky story...

If God doesn’t work through the intercession of the saints, if Mary was no one more special than a fourteen year old Jewish virgin, then why is her intercession the cause of these profound miracles? Why, if she is not, as Catholics assert, first amongst the saints, would God use her in this way? It would, in the end, truly be pulling the wool over the eyes of Catholics if God used Mary in this way and let us go on, happily, believing in her special place in the kingdom.

If Mary isn’t who Catholics say she is, and if the saints aren’t to be venerated (asked to pray for us in the same way I ask my living, Christian friends to pray for me) then why would God allow her to appear, in this way, to mislead Catholics. Because, ultimately, it would be misleading if she appeared like this and she wasn’t someone special.

This little info-mercial wasn't designed to win any bible believing Protestant Christians to the Catholic religion...It is clearly written to encourage Catholics to stay within the Catholic religion...

Seems like an intelligent intellectual Catholic would ask him/herself why Jesus would send Mary in these apparitions...Why not send himself??? Why direct people to Mary to be a mediator between God and man when he can do so himself???

Millions of Catholics all over the world fall down and pray to these statues of Mary...Why not Jesus himself???

163 posted on 04/05/2015 10:08:29 PM PDT by Iscool
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To: Rides_A_Red_Horse

bump


164 posted on 04/05/2015 10:17:01 PM PDT by GeronL (CLEARLY CRUZ 2016)
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To: ebb tide
Do you believe Mary was the Mother of Jesus Christ?
Do you believe Jesus Christ is God?

Do you believe the God of Creation has a mother???

165 posted on 04/05/2015 10:23:06 PM PDT by Iscool
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To: pbear8
You left out the part that after the miracle that God ordained using Our Lady of Guadalupe, the natives abandoned their pagan religion with human sacrifices and thereafter worshiped the One True God.

Not from what I understand...The Marian Catholics below the border have a mix of Catholicism and paganism...

166 posted on 04/05/2015 10:25:56 PM PDT by Iscool
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To: Iscool
I just watched a 2-part video about Our Lady of Guadalupe being idolatry. Most of the video was about a festival in Seville, Spain.

Some of it with all the candles and artistic floats are so incredibly beautiful, it's hard to give it up if it is indeed idolatry.

167 posted on 04/05/2015 10:39:25 PM PDT by Aliska
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To: editor-surveyor

So true. I tried just this morning to point a life long, active Catholic to the BIBLE upon a request (recommendation) for a book of devotionals. The retort I received was that the Bible is too overwhelming. She had tried a couple times but couldn’t COMPREHEND and never got very far. She was looking for something easy to read.

No interest whatsoever. She apparently wrote the Bible off long ago.

I never get used to these responses although by now, I should know better!


168 posted on 04/05/2015 10:44:41 PM PDT by bonfire
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To: Aliska
Some of it with all the candles and artistic floats are so incredibly beautiful, it's hard to give it up if it is indeed idolatry.

Especially if you learn that stuff as a kid and it is pounded into your head going into adulthood...

169 posted on 04/05/2015 10:56:56 PM PDT by Iscool
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To: ealgeone

Being the mother of God is not the same as being the creator of God. Do you believe that Jesus did not exist until he was born in human form? Mary allowed herself to be used to provide the physical body that Jesus used to redeem us.

Mary, as Mother of the Incarnate Jesus, who is fully God, is the mother of the One True God even though she did not create God. Mothers don’t create their children, God does. She did, however, bring God into this world, which is what each of our mothers has done.

The argument does not fall apart at all, in fact your argument proves that Mary is indeed the mother of God if you accept the concept of Trinity.

God the Father is God.
Jesus is God.
The Holy Spirit is God.

They are all the same Person and always have been.

Jesus is God the Father.
Jesus is the Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit is God the Father.

Jesus doesn’t have a father as we understand the word. No physical male body was necessary to contribute to his conception and birth. God the Father is Jesus’ spiritual Father in the same way that God the Father is our spiritual Father. Except that Jesus was not created by God the Father in the same way that we were. Our souls were created at some point by God. Jesus has always existed. He did not spring into being when he became incarnate.

None of this makes sense to human logic. That is why it is a mystery and requires faith to believe. God’s logic is not ours. Our brains cannot understand it, we must simply believe it.

If you do not accept the concept Trinity as Three Persons in One God, then all of these other arguments are trifling and will never be resolved.

Love,
O2

‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God’


170 posted on 04/05/2015 11:12:24 PM PDT by omegatoo (You know you'll get your money's worth...become a monthly donor!)
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To: FourtySeven; mlo; boatbums
So this is how we know they aren't from Satan. Because they lead people to Christ AND because, Satan simply can't do them.

Keep in mind that the end times deception is not simply Satan working up another one of his typical magic shows.  It is a judgment sent by God Himself:
Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
(2 Thessalonians 2:9-11)
Also remember that Jesus said this deception coming would be so powerful it would deceive even the elect, if that sort of thing were possible (by inference it is not),  
For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
(Matthew 24:24)
So now we have no ordinary roster of signs and wonders. We have a delusion, sent by God, that will allow the great deceiver to fool everyone but the elect.  This means any of the easy tests we might come up with, however reasonable they might seem, could fail.  By definition, it will be impossible to see through this deception by ordinary human means.  God Himself will preserve those who are His elect sheep.  They will avoid deception, not because they are smart, or have used readily available "miracle" tests.  They will avoid deception because they are elect, and as the elect, they have an indestructible love of God's truth.  

So the focal point, the first premise of detection, is not simply that we think it is creative or not. That too can be structured to deceive.  We are finite, fallible sinners.  We are easy to dupe.  But if we have a love for the truth of God, when the deceiver comes, he will find us unwilling to buy the false message of the miracle, because we trust the word of God.  

Think of it as a replay of the Garden of Eden, only in this second version Eve recognizes the temptation as contradicting what God actually said, and she refuses.  But it is a judgment to those who have not loved the truth.  A judgment powered by God Himself.  There is no way to avoid becoming one of the Devil's duped drones, apart from being one of Jesus' sheep, and therefore heeding only Jesus' voice.

Conclusion:  Nothing in the particular quality of the miracle matters, if the message is in conflict with the truth of God as revealed in His word.  Let it be as stupendous as any miracle you've ever heard of.  It will still be false if it draws souls to idolatry. The Egyptian wizards could throw down their staffs and make live snakes.  Surely to the ordinary Egyptian, that must have seemed to be an act of creation.   Yet they could not create gnats.  The deceivers will know the limits of their powers, but there is no assurance anyone else will know.  Do not trust in your own wisdom.  It will be a fatal mistake in the last days:
Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.
(Proverbs 3:5-6)
Peace,

SR


171 posted on 04/05/2015 11:18:47 PM PDT by Springfield Reformer (Winston Churchill: No Peace Till Victory!)
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To: daniel1212; ebb tide

Good read Daniel. Bookmarking for future reference. :)

Peace,

SR


172 posted on 04/05/2015 11:25:03 PM PDT by Springfield Reformer (Winston Churchill: No Peace Till Victory!)
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To: ebb tide

When they are not willing to either post their creed or admit their denomination that is code for “home church.” You know like those adorable Westboro people.


173 posted on 04/06/2015 2:29:35 AM PDT by verga (I might as well be playing chess with pigeons,.)
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To: boatbums

Good rationalization, Still praying for God to open your mind and soften your heart.


174 posted on 04/06/2015 2:34:06 AM PDT by verga (I might as well be playing chess with pigeons,.)
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To: NYer

Wonderful article. Thank you!


175 posted on 04/06/2015 4:22:01 AM PDT by St_Thomas_Aquinas ( Isaiah 22:22, Matthew 16:19, Revelation 3:7)
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To: omegatoo; ealgeone
She did, however, bring God into this world

Nope...God was already in the world...That's why the bible is very careful never to say, 'mother of God'...

They are all the same Person and always have been.

And yet they are three separate persons...

Our souls were created at some point by God. Jesus has always existed. He did not spring into being when he became incarnate.

So was Jesus' flesh God???
Or just his spirit/soul???
Was Mary a foster mother to God???

Php 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
Php_2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

Php_2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
Php 2:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

1Ti_3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

None of this makes sense to human logic.

And yet you are using your human logic to conclude that God has a mother...

Something in there doesn't fit...WE KNOW GOD DOES NOT HAVE A MOTHER...

We are better off to leave it be as a mystery...

To use the failed human logic to make Mary the mother of God opened the door to the fantastic fable that the Catholic religion invented/created about the mother of God...

176 posted on 04/06/2015 5:15:22 AM PDT by Iscool
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To: ebb tide
Either you reject that Mary was the Mother of Jesus or that Jesus is God; you are rejecting your sola scriptura.

Faulty Catholic reasoning based on error promulgated by Catholicism in giving Mary a title that the Holy Spirit never addressed her by.

If what you claim is the case, then the same accusation can be make of Luke who used the title, and the Holy Spirit who inspired it.

177 posted on 04/06/2015 5:24:04 AM PDT by metmom (...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith...)
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To: verga
When they are not willing to either post their creed or admit their denomination that is code for “home church.” You know like those adorable Westboro people.

Please man, buy a bible, or get a free one on line...You have much to learn...

The Westboro people met in a church...

Mat_13:36 Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field.

Mat_26:18 And he said, Go into the city to such a man, and say unto him, The Master saith, My time is at hand; I will keep the passover at thy house with my disciples.

178 posted on 04/06/2015 5:25:05 AM PDT by Iscool
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To: NYer
DeMontfort would agree.

19. If we examine closely the remainder of the life of Jesus Christ, we see that he chose to begin his miracles through Mary. It was by her word that he sanctified Saint John the Baptist in the womb of his mother, Saint Elizabeth; no sooner had Mary spoken than John was sanctified. This was his first and greatest miracle of grace. At the wedding in Cana he changed water into wine at her humble prayer, and this was his first miracle in the order of nature. He began and continued his miracles through Mary and he will continue them through her until the end of time.

Jesus can't do anything unless it is "through Mary".

179 posted on 04/06/2015 5:36:15 AM PDT by DungeonMaster (Maybe they really want what they wanted in Sodom.)
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To: Iscool

We are better off to leave it be as a mystery...


My first thought is that man can’t leave it that way because that means man is man and God is God. It means man is not in control and not god.

A second thought is how do we regard a mystery? Because we can’t know it all, some will ignore it or create their own answer. The third choice is that we can learn a little more but we will never learn it all. Thus RC Sprouls challenge to us that WE MUST ALL BE THEOLOGIANS AND NOT LET OTHERS DO OUR THINKING FOR US.

But man does have a good imagination to create answers. Do a web search on Thomas the twin. There are quite a few imaginative answers on why he was called that. Some state he was the twin brother of Jesus and it was he who actually died on the cross. There are other just as imaginative ideas.

THIS IS WHY I DON’T TRUST TRADITION! AND WILL USE THE BIBLE TO TEST THE TRUTH.

By the way, the Bible does answer the question on why he was called Thomas (or twin). His given name was Judas, so he was the second disciple with that name so to distinguish him from the other he was given the nickname “Twin” I find it interesting that nicknames have been given in small groups for a long time. But that simple answer does not satisfy many.

Again, do a search on Thomas the twin and it is truly amazing what people will believe.


180 posted on 04/06/2015 5:46:09 AM PDT by PeterPrinciple (Thinking Caps are no longer being issued but there must be a warehouse full of them somewhere.)
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