Editorial: Indian nicknames / They're still offensive and needless

Star Tribune. ^ | June 9, 2003

[presidio9]

The Star Tribune newsroom will now call sports teams by their chosen names, including Indian nicknames, as editor Anders Gyllenhaal explained in a column published Sunday. That's best, for newsrooms should reflect reality as accurately as possible. But it's also reality that Indians do not like the use of "Braves" and "Redskins" and other nicknames that have been appropriated by sports groups. The teams themselves should drop them.

[LittleJoe]

The truth?
Most Indians are Conservative American Patriots who do not like the term Native American. You can find some of us right here on Free Republic.

This crap is nothing more than a communist attempt to classify Indians As a bunch of simple minded drunks who need the protection of the Great White Father.

If you want truth, check out Bad Eagle Forum. You may even find some fellow Freepers there.

[TC Rider]

Could we lay off the Native American nicknames and go for gay nicknames instead?

How about:

The Oakland Rump Rangers

The Baltimore Butt Bandits

[Erasmus]

I'm considering "Dances on Tables."

Too bad you're not Scandahoovian. I would have recommended Dances on Lapps.

[Erasmus]

I'm proud to be a Hoosier (i.e., someone from Indiana as well as a former student at IU) and am calling on all noble Illinois natives to lobby the University to change their mascot from the Fighting Illini to the correct Illinois native:

The Suckers.

You may not be aware that the "Illini" and "Chief Illiniwek" debate began at least a decade ago. Fortunately, it is somewhat in remission just now. It flares up again when some mush-headed Liberal Arts Sophomore can rally a few noisemakers to its cause.

--From an (old-school) Illini

[AngryJawa]

"As a white man, I would have no problem rooting for the Whiteskins. I don't suspect many others would either."

As a Whiteskin fan from way back, I've had absolutely no problem rooting for them despite their dreadful lack of team speed. 8^)

[presidio9]

Plus, they can't jump, and they are comprised entirely of quarterbacks, offensive linemen and Ed McCaffrey.

[nobdysfool]

It is stupid as if it is not written down no one will have record of it ever existing. Thats all.

That's your opinion, but that doesn't make it fact. How do you know there is not a cultural taboo which prevents them from doing this? I say respect their culture even if you don't agree with how they want to deal with it.

Native American culture is fast assimilating. Look at how few Sioux speak Lakota. If people do not document how the language works it will be forgotten.

That may be, but is this the only culture that has ever faded into the sands of time without a trace? It's their culture, not yours. How is this going to affect you personally? My guess is, not a whole lot.

It's called preserving history. If you think people who deliberately prevent the recording of history are not behaving stupidly then you have cognitive problems.

I know what it's called and there is nothing wrong with my cognitive abilities. You, on the other hand, have demonstrated that you don't get it. No matter how much you may want the cultural history preserved, it's not about you and what you want, it's about them and what they feel is right for them. Get over it!

[AngryJawa]

Well, at least they're hard-working, smart, over-acheiving, unselfish players with good community relations skills.

[arasina]

I'm waiting for the liberal cry to change the name of my state and city and expect those of us in Indianapolis, Indiana to pay for it.

[agarrett]

I know what it's called and there is nothing wrong with my cognitive abilities. You, on the other hand, have demonstrated that you don't get it. No matter how much you may want the cultural history preserved, it's not about you and what you want, it's about them and what they feel is right for them. Get over it!

  Ah, but it's part of our cultural heritage to write things down, and try to preserve waht we can of the past. In telling us we must respect their cultures and traditions, you are in fact, telling us to disregard our own. Why then do their traditions carry more weight than our own?

  When the British ruled India, settee was still the custom. The Brits were horrified, but were told that this was an ancient custom, and they should not interfere. The British effectively responded that their ancient customs included hanging chaps who did things like that. Guess what? Settee turned out to be not quite so deeply embedded in the culture as the Indians had thought ;-)

  People are welcome to their cultures. But we have ours too, and will continue to live that way. If that conflicts with other cultures, we should consider the matter, decide whether the benefits outweigh the cost of the potential insult, and proceed appropriately.

  In the case of writing down history and folklore of the American Indians, I'd say go ahead and write them down.

Drew Garrett

[activationproducts]

Actually this is whole thing is another symptom of Native American demagogues belly aching about nothing. How on earth could they be hurt by their eoples history being known?

In fact why do you think one or two individuals ought to let an entires cultures history fade into the ether. Many of them would like to see their culture recorded. I know I grew up around the Sioux.

Just because you and a few others see no value in history does not mean that the rest of us forward looking individuals should heed your call to ignorance.

[berserker]

"Redskins" is the one name that I think people can find offensive without being hypersensitive, actually. I think they've certainly got one of the coolest of the indian logos, though.

They have also lost their USPTO trademark protection for their name "Redskins" as being offensive (apparently patently so).

[berserker]

These are the people who run around looking for things to be offended about.

You're right - who could possibly be offended by this?

[nobdysfool]

Just because you and a few others see no value in history does not mean that the rest of us forward looking individuals should heed your call to ignorance.

Well, you've demonstrated that your grasp of English is a little tenuous...Where did I ever say that I saw no value in history? That's your assumption, because you can't see past your own opinion. All I'm saying is that if they don't want their history recorded, what you want shouldn't be forced on them against their will. I would like it very much if that history were preserved, but not so much that I will force them to give what they don't want to give. Besides, how could you be sure it was accurate, if it were gotten under duress? They might just make up a bunch of mumbo-jumbo, just to pull your leg.

I am making no call to ignorance, but you sure are demonstrating yours.

And for the record, I'm a history buff. It was my favorite subject all through school, and I have rows of books about history in my library. So don't accuse me of ignorance when it comes to history. There's a good chance I know more than you do about any given historical subject picked at random.

[activationproducts]

If you have ever spent time around reservation bound Indians you would realize most of what they tell you about their history is pulling ones leg. This is evidenced by the varying stories from varying source on the same subject.

Also ad-hominems are not what proper discource is about. Good day.

[annyokie]

Too funny! Christians offended by Angels and the Saints? I'm offended by the "who dat" and demand reparations!

[nobdysfool]

Also ad-hominems are not what proper discource is about. Good day.

Whatever. You obviously didn't get my point. Opinions vary...

[Mr. Lucky]

Particularly if you're a fan of the local baseball team. Remember what would happen when the home team hit a home run at the old Bush Stadium on 16th Street?

[Labyrinthos]

...Notre Dame Fighting Irish...

How about the Notre Dame Drunkin Irish.

[Sonny M]

According to a sports illustrated poll done several years ago, the overwhelming majority of native americans do not find offence with the use of native american nicknames for sports teams.

Every other poll has come to the same conclusion, and some polls say native americans actually find a sense of pride in those names being used.

This is just a loud and vocal minority screaming, and a very quiet and silent majority. If you rounded up enough say irish people to complain about notre dame, the NY Times would put it on the front page and try and spin that as how most irish people feel.

Go Fighting Irish!!!!!!!!!!