An Immoral Tax

Wall Street Journal ^ | Feb 18, 2003 | MICHAEL NOVAK

[The Raven]

We are so habituated to the progressive income-tax that most conservatives, fiddling at the margins, fail to focus their ire on the basic immorality of that progressive income-tax, and the social damage it has caused.

At some time during the 20th century, the Democratic Party came to believe that the state is not a fickle abuser of human liberty (as liberals once held); instead, the state could be an angel of good whose mission is to bring about the equality between rich and poor which dreamers have always dreamed about. The means: redistribution of income. For the left, redistribution became a rod of judgment, separating wolves from sheep. Those in favor are noble, those opposed "mean-spirited." Only by understanding this does one grasp the vituperation that Tom Daschle, Hillary Clinton, Ted Kennedy and others heap upon the Bush tax proposals.

[The Raven]

Another problem with this tax:

Most people start out in the low brackets at a young age. As they gain experience in the work place, they earn more.

Some people celebrate "tax day" - the day of the year where the government stops taking all of our income. But we could also celebrate "retirement age."

The government can easily increase our retirement age by taxing the pants off of people approaching retirement.

I favor a redistibution of wealth to ourselves.....a mortgage to pay for our health, education and welfare when we're young and not earning money or earning very little money. Then we pay it back. If we do well in the world, we can either retire early, or perhaps, pre-pay our children's education , etc.

[A CA Guy]

I know many well-off folks and they understand the need for a progressive tax since there is difference between giving 10% of your only dime and 10% of 10 million dollars.

Even the Bible admired more the pennies of a poor person over the big offerings of the rich because for the poor it was a much greater sacrifice to due without the pennies.

Most reasonable people I know say the rates are out of this world and prevent prosperity and job growth.

The rates Ronald Reagan had were about perfect. I remember that the money to the treasury doubled as all tried to prosper and keep more of their hard earned money.

If you want to really get pissed about taxes, look into the death tax. For the wealthy with millions, almost half the wealth gets confiscated after their death.

[goldstategop]

Translation: only in America (unless its the already rich Left protecting its fortunes) its regarded as evil to get rich and stay rich.

[ovrtaxt]

Even the Bible admired more the pennies of a poor person over the big offerings of the rich because for the poor it was a much greater sacrifice to due without the pennies.

Check out that story in Mark 12 to 13. Jesus watched as this old lady gave the very last of what she had to the religious leaders. He stated that she gave more than the others because they gave out of their abundance, but she gave out of ther great poverty. He wasn't pleased. He walked out of the temple and prophecied it's destruction.

He wasn't giving an endorsement of sacrificial giving, he was giving a condemnation of the 'religious' manipulation of people for profit.

This doesn't change the fact that taxing productivity is immoral. Why should someone who produces more wealth than another be penalized more severely? The greater producer is more beneficial to society, why discourage it? Everyone should be regarded on a level playing field.

[David Isaac]

Having little knowledge of the facts in this area, I still wonder if the really rich lose half of their estates to the death tax. Are there not numerous creative and perfectly legal ways to avoid paying that tax? I find it hard to believe that those who supplement the meager incomes of our politicians, would do so if there were not "legal" ways for them to keep all of their money.

[FreedomPoster]

While there are many loopholes and dodges, there are also many small businesses and family farms that are destroyed because of the need to sell off to pay estate taxes.

[FreedomPoster]

Which BTW is very disruptive to an already-shakey economy.

[A CA Guy]

Having sat through family wealth and preservation courses, I can only say that nearly half of a large estate would go to taxes.
The only way to avoid taxes completely would be to give it away in a charity.
But if you want to leave it to your family and you have considerable wealth, your rate is 49% after the first deductible part this year.

[A CA Guy]

The Widow's Offering

41Jesus sat down opposite the place where the offerings were put and watched the crowd putting their money into the temple treasury. Many rich people threw in large amounts. 42But a poor widow came and put in two very small copper coins,[10] worth only a fraction of a penny.[11]
43Calling his disciples to him, Jesus said, "I tell you the truth, this poor widow has put more into the treasury than all the others. 44They all gave out of their wealth; but she, out of her poverty, put in everything--all she had to live on."

The reason for marginal tax rates is the poor and middle class can't carry an equal burden compared to the wealthy.

Most wealthy don't mind paying more, but most do have an issue with current rates being as high as they are.

You get more money from the wealthy.
You don't get a job from the poor either.
The poor are not a great base for taxation.

It is true though that the current rates are way to high now.

[aardvark1]

Even the Bible admired more the pennies of a poor person over the big offerings of the rich because for the poor it was a much greater sacrifice to due without the pennies.

This story of the "widow's mite" is not about taxation. It's about VOLUNTARY giving!!!! The Bible does talk about tax, but this story isn't it. What we currently have for tax rates falls more under the idea of stealing, coercive redistribution of wealth, and the productive forced to support the non-productive. The Bible has much to say about these topics as well.

For detailed reference read RJ Rushdoony, Gary North, and George Grant for starters.

[Wonder Warthog]

"I know many well-off folks and they understand the need for a progressive tax since there is difference between giving 10% of your only dime and 10% of 10 million dollars."

Sorry, but I don't buy the "need" for a progressive tax. Such a tax is simply unequal treatment under the law, and is against everything the American Republic was established for.

[ovrtaxt]

38a He also said in His teaching, "Beware of the scribes,... 40 They devour widows' houses and say long prayers just for show. These will receive harsher punishment." 41 Sitting across from the temple treasury, He watched how the crowd dropped money into the treasury. Many rich people were putting in large sums. 42 And a poor widow came and dropped in two tiny coins worth very little. 43 Summoning His disciples, He said to them, "I assure you: This poor widow has put in more than all those giving to the temple treasury. 44 For they all gave out of their surplus, but she out of her poverty has put in everything she possessed--all she had to live on." 1 As He was going out of the temple complex, one of His disciples said to Him, "Teacher, look! What massive stones! What impressive buildings!" 2 Jesus said to him, "You see these great buildings? Not one stone will be left here on another that will not be thrown down!"

The reason for marginal tax rates is the poor and middle class can't carry an equal burden compared to the wealthy

Even though the wealthy pay more percentage-wise, (on income only) the bulk of the tax base comes from the middle class. The income tax is a tax on productivity. Those with a large estate already, have smaller income (as a percentage of their overall wealth). They are not that affected by an income tax.

The death tax is supposed to tax the rich who live off of established wealth by preventing an aristocracy from being established, but there are ways to transfer wealth to the next generation through trusts, offshore accounts, etc.

The most equitable solution is a tax on consumption. Every individual controls how much they will pay by how much they spend, with food, medicine, necessities being exempt.

[weikel]

The wealthy still pay more with a flat tax because its collected on a % basis, if the wealthy weren't taxed so heavily they'd pay more your obviously not a supply sider.

[ovrtaxt]

RJ Rushdoony, Gary North, and George Grant for starters.

cool! you're a restoration guy! ever read David Chilton? (Days of Judgment, Paradise Restored) Some of the best theology Ive ever read.

We're talking about the widow's mite as a sidebar. Somebody brought it up and I thought I would put my two cents in. hahahahah(sorry...)

[Free the USA]

http://www.freerepublic.com/perl/bump-list

[from occupied ga]

Taking ever more revenue from the well-off is fine.

I think that the author of this has let his communist core show through.

[fporretto]

The progressive income tax was an outcropping of the Progressive movement of the turn of the century era. It was motivated largely by envy: the only emotion forbidden by the Ten Commandments, and for good reason.

During the debates over the income tax, an anti-tax senator posed this question to his colleagues "across the floor": What measures would be set in place to insure that the tax did not someday grow as high as 10% of a person's income? A pro-tax senator rose to reassure him that that could never happen, as the people would never allow it!

O my people, O my city!

Freedom, Wealth, and Peace,
Francis W. Porretto
Visit the Palace Of Reason:
http://palaceofreason.com

[Bob Buchholz]

I seem to be a bit more callous than most. I feel that EVERY person should pay taxes from the first dollar that they earn to the last. The present system is bound for destruction simply by its distribution. Currently only slightly more that 50% of Americans pay any tax at all. Bush's tax plan will exempt even more from taxes. When a majority of people pay no taxes, they have nothing to gain from a tax cut and even more to gain from tax increases. As more and more is demanded from fewer and fewer, fewer will be willing to earn the extra dollar that would simply go to taxes.

The only way to prevent this is to make sure that EVERYONE pays some taxes and bears some of the pain associates with taxation.

[aardvark1]

cool! you're a restoration guy!

You mean Reconstruction...and the answer is "yes, and proud of it." Chilton was great! His book "Days of Vengeance" is unbeatable.

[upchuck]

The solution.^"