Sci Fi Reality Creep

NewsMax.com ^ | 11/04/02 | Geoff Mecalf

[zingzang]

For several years I have been grousing about government use of technology to eviscerate our liberty and freedoms. Subdermal biochip implants are no longer radical right-wing or fundamental Christian fear mongering – they are reality, and Digital Angel is hard at work convincing a gullible world that they are the slickest thing since pre-sliced bread (although, like George Carlin, I never understood what IS so slick about pre-sliced bread).

There is what has become a significant industry overcoming the inevitable objections to "chipping." They are VERY busy.

It has been "suggested" that subdermal biochip implants could/would assist the military in locating downed pilots. Parents could/should have them implanted in their children to aid in locating them if they are lost or kidnapped.

Heck, cars now have GPS units that offer help-on-demand road assistance at the push of a button – even if YOU don't know where you are, some omniscient 'they' does.

Scanners are cheap and, once in production, will get cheaper. All that is very "what if" and gee whiz. However, the dangers of incrementalism are clearly documented. Social Security started in 1935.

The current numbering system started in 1936.

The IRS started requiring the numbers on tax returns in 1962.

In 1970, all banks were required to get your number.

My military ID number was changed to my Social Security Number in 1971.

In 1982 ANYONE getting any sort of government kiss had to show his or her number.

Babies now need SSNs, but incrementalism never stops with the last offense.

B K. Eakman recently ripped more leaves off the onion. [http://www.beverlye.com/implant_20021102.html] Rapid routine advances in computer cross matching have become as common as pigeon droppings in Trafalgar Square and cover the full spectrum from census, motor vehicle, tax, title and insurance databases to school records. The inevitable consequence is an exploding information industry of data traffickers and "brokers," licit and otherwise. All these new data managers/marketers link information to accommodate the needs of employers, credit bureaus, universities, police, corporate spies – and government.

This is a VERY big business, and data-laundering results in big money.

Knowledge IS power. Bear with me for a short syllogistic ramble:

Knowledge is power. Power corrupts. Absolute Power corrupts absolutely. Therefore, Knowledge corrupts. And Absolute Knowledge corrupts absolutely … go figure. Once upon a time, before "power" crystallized how best to exploit and manipulate "knowledge," most analysts were interested in aggregate data. They tried to determine public-policy trends or assess the results of advertising strategies aimed at specific demographics. However, then came government-mandated database consolidations, standard definitions, uniform codes and compulsory compatibility among local, state and federal (drum roll for Hal's grandparents) computers.

The new generation of ID implants holds a sizable paragraph of information. Yeah, we get the idea. Big-Flipping-Brother knows where you are ALL the time. Privacy – the very concept of privacy – becomes an anachronism.

Scott McDonald of the Web site Scan This News once noted: "A lifetime of information can be easily databased using a microchip system. All movement, transactions, and interactions can be recorded and monitored once everyone has their own unique identifier. Every detail of a person's life will be finally accessible to authorities through the widespread use of implanted chips ... it must begin somewhere and school children are the most likely candidate."

You can damnbetcha that there has been and will be opposition to implanting children and the destruction of privacy. However, McDonald suggests, "Some will holler: 'The Constitution this, and the Constitution that.' But only those social misfits, kooks, and rebels with something to hide will hold out strongly."

Oh yeah? Even those social misfits, kooks, and rebels with NOTHING to hide STILL object.

"Little will they know, the very act of objecting, in itself, will suffice to 'identify' them as trouble-makers," continues McDonald. "They can then be arrested and force-chipped as part of the booking process! Besides, most Americans – after they've been reminded of all benefits and services they will sacrifice if they refuse – will soon acquiesce. This is how it worked when Congress enacted laws to coerce parents into numbering their children at birth. A few grumbled for a short while. But, once the threat of no longer being able to claim their children on tax returns set in, they got right in line down at the Social Security Administration and had their children numbered."

The myopic hubris of bureaucratic sphincters is sufficient to gag a maggot. Those of us who still intend to defend and protect the Constitution against ALL enemies, foreign AND domestic, are, by definition of "The Controllers," "social misfits, kooks, and rebels." Then again, according to the FBI definition, they are terrorists: "Terrorism is the unlawful use of force or violence against person or property to intimidate or coerce a government, the civilian populace, or any segment thereof, in furtherance of political or social objectives."

F. Scott Fitzgerald once said, "The test of a first-rate intelligence is the ability to hold two opposed ideas in the mind at the same time, and still retain the ability to function."

Please, let us all "retain the ability to function."

[zingzang]

Sorry, spelled his last name wrong. It's Geoff Metcalf.

[Tribune7]

Sci Fi Reality Creep

I thought it was going to be a thread about Al Gore.

[lds23]

Just wait for the widespread application of "micro-threads". Cheap and small, they have many uses.

They can be implanted in clothing (ostensibly to track if they're being shoplifted, but they stay in the clothes so you can be found "wearever" you may be). They can (already have been???) implanted in money (again, ostensibly to track crime, but perhaps to track all "untaxed" transactions).

Don't worry, they're on their way FAST.

[zingzang]

That being said I've burned all my clothes, quit my job, and now wear dead animals as clothing. Okay, just kidding about quitting the job. ;)

[Eala]

Besides, most Americans – after they've been reminded of all benefits and services they will sacrifice if they refuse – will soon acquiesce

They've been acquiescing for some time, because they thought they were free. But when does one stop acquiescing, at what point does one stand up knowing that the rest (or enough of them) will stand too? Too soon -- you're screwed (and you become the example that holds the rest down). Too late -- is never.

[Dan Day]

It has been "suggested" that subdermal biochip implants could/would assist the military in locating downed pilots. Parents could/should have them implanted in their children to aid in locating them if they are lost or kidnapped.

I highly doubt there are subdermal chips which can be used to track your location like this. The amount of power necessary to broadcast an "I am here" signal which would be detectable from more than a few feet away (much less untold numbers of miles) would require a power source much too bulky to be implanted under the skin, unless you're talking about something even more intrusive than a pacemaker:

The only subdermal chips I'm aware of (my three parrots have each had one implanted in case they get stolen or lost) are passive, and can only be scanned by a scanner passed over the chip from no more than a foot away. They're not used to "track" anything, they're only useful if the animal has been recovered and you want to be able to prove ownership, or if the animal has been lost, recovered by someone, and brought to a vet or animal shelter which then routinely scans pets to try to look up their owner in the registry. It's no more than a "collar tag" that can't be lost or removed.

[all4one]

Think of this technology as LoJack (which is now a widely used chip located in an automobile to locate stolen vehiches, via satellite).

The is currently a family in Florida who volunteered at the beginning of 2002 to be implanted with the chip. If I can find a link to that story I will post it. Subdermal chips are already part of our current technology.

[zingzang]

I think you're right, but think about how bulky mobile phones were 20 years ago. Look at how much we can pack into a minute amount of silicon now. I think the technology will be here before long.

Check out how "friendly" their website makes this invasive technology look:

http://www.digitalangel.net/

[Justa]

So this subdermal stuff started with pets?

Great.

[PsyOp]

"Doublethink means the power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one?s mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them." - George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four, 1949.

[Dan Day]

I think you're right, but think about how bulky mobile phones were 20 years ago. Look at how much we can pack into a minute amount of silicon now. I think the technology will be here before long.

But look at how big phones still are *now*. As small as it is, you still couldn't implant a Nokia phone under your skin. Consider how big just the battery is, and they only last 24 hours before they need to be recharged again.

The folks who are paranoid about getting "chipped" so that they can be monitored at all times never seem to stop to think about how Big Brother is going to manage to recharge your "monitor" every 24 hours, or how they're going to implant into you a power supply big enough to last several years between replacements...

It just isn't practical.

Check out how "friendly" their website makes this invasive technology look:

Again, note how big the actual unit is -- it's the size of a paperback book and has to be clipped to your belt, *and* has to be recharged frequently or it's useless.

Electronics often shrink over time, but power sources aren't so easily miniaturized.

[null and void]

Collar tags are put on possessions by their owners...

[Dan Day]

Think of this technology as LoJack (which is now a widely used chip located in an automobile to locate stolen vehiches, via satellite).

What do you mean by "this" technology? Nothing in the Newsmax article even approaches a workable "people locator chip". As I mentioned already, you couldn't possibly implant a sufficient power source into a person to enable remote location. The car LoJack system only works because it's hooked to the car's 20-pound battery and has a big antenna run through the car's body.

The is currently a family in Florida who volunteered at the beginning of 2002 to be implanted with the chip. If I can find a link to that story I will post it. Subdermal chips are already part of our current technology.

I'd appreciate a link, and I'll bet you twenty bucks it's *not* a "LoJack" type system they're testing. The Newsmax article only described a "data chip" implant, which unlike a LoJack type system, *would* be feasible, albeit not nearly as Big Brotherish as a "remote tracking" system.

A "data chip" would have to be scanned (or written) from very close up, it's not someting that could be detected, read, or tracked from a distance greater than about 3 feet, max.

[Dan Day]

Collar tags are put on possessions by their owners...

So were my parrot's microchips -- I took them to a vet to have them implanted, it wasn't done against my will.

That still doesn't make it a tracking system, it's quite simply impossible to locate a lost pet using these things.

It's just a form of positive identification, since parrots don't have fingerprints and I don't think dogs and cats' pawprints are necessarily unique (nor constant over time, since they would tend to get scuffed a lot).

A human "identichip" would be no more nor less intrusive than having a fingerprint check done, or having to show your picture-ID when paying for something with a check at a retailer.

[null and void]

And as the owner of your parrots, that is your unquestionable right, and a prudent thing for you to do.

It's only the government's right to do it to you if they own you.

(Didn't we fight a war about this very issue a century and a half or so ago?)

[Richard Kimball]

So this subdermal stuff started with pets?

700 Club had a report on it years ago. It started with extremely valuable race horses, and from there was expanded to include most valuable livestock. The chips allowed IDing of the horse from across a field. In there story, the horses were being scanned from across a field, showing how they could be ID'd easily. Other concepts are medical historys implanted so hospital ERs can easily get medical histories on people.

I'll never get one.

[Flying Circus]

Rather than take a huge leap from a tracker to a satellite based world tracking system, lets take the smaller step. Lets say we increase the pet tracker range by a single order of magnitude, ie a scanner can scan the ID at ten feen rather than one foot that your pet's scanner does. The energy output only is only 10^-9 of what a cell phone uses, and could work in a completely passive mode. This is hardly outside the bounds of modern electronics.

However, at ten feel you have tremendous power to track the movements of an individual in society. All doors and entrances in public buildings could keep a record of who went through and when. Roads and intersections could have scanners to monitor the traffic, how many people and who is in a car. Economic and security reasons can easily be found to pay for putting the trackers out there too. How safe do you feel then?

[mvpel]

You are not aware of the technology, it would seem. The "Digital Angel" chips being discussed here are a different type of technology than the pet ID microchips, and can be tracked through the cellular phone network to pinpoint the location of the chipped individual.

[Dan Day]

You are not aware of the technology, it would seem. The "Digital Angel" chips being discussed here are a different type of technology than the pet ID microchips,

I'm well aware of that. That's why the pet ID microchips are the size of a grain of rice, while the "Digital Angel" system is the size of a paperback book, has to be worn on a belt hook, and needs to be recharged frequently.

*I'm* completely aware of the difference between identifier chips, which are feasible to implant, and tracking systems, which are *not*. However, I can't say the same for a lot of the folks who expecting to be "chipped" any day now by Big Brother so that their every move can be monitored. It just ain't gonna happen, because the types of electronics being discussed here (and cavalierly mentioned back-to-back in the original article as if they were interchangeable) are *not* even remotely similar to each other.

Thus my point(s) in this thread.

and can be tracked through the cellular phone network to pinpoint the location of the chipped individual.

That's not how it works. It has a GPS receiver built-in, according to the website. And presumably it has the heart of a hardwired cell phone built into it in order to "phone home" when the user is in trouble.

And you're *not* going to see that feasibly implanted in anyone's body in the next decade or two, at least.

For the Nth time, the fact that there are implantable "tag" microchips is *not* the same thing as an imminent threat of everyone getting "LoJacked".