Posted on 01/28/2024 7:39:07 PM PST by Kazan
Remember when the Germans laughed at him.
Well, he could be right in that years of abuse of article 5 followed by statements like this have a tendency to become self fulfilling prophecy.
After the USA invoked article 5 in September 2001, EU NATO and Canada rapidly sent assistance to the mainland USA for surveillance and self protection.
If the USA hadn’t mission creeped it into multiple invasions of Middle Eastern countries (except the country that sheltered ed the Wahabbi group which had organized 9/11 - Saudi Arabia) AND if EU NATO had started paying its fair share, things would be different.
If Trump reckons that the Russian demands for NATO to effectively abolish Article 5 so Putin can hit Ukraine again - and Lithuania and Latvia and Estonia, and possibly Alaska, without any meaningful NATO ally response - then he’s sorely mistaken.
Russia has scuppered every past peace deal by insisting on the 2021 ultimatum - that included a requirement that NATO members don’t even conduct joint training exercises inside their own countries without prior approval from the Kremlin.
That’s got nothing to do with rational Russian defence requirements; it’s a combination of irrational Russian paranoia, Russian butthurt, and Russians with a hard on.
Just like with Able Archer, where some Soviets commanders were convinced that they were looking at an attack on them despite the false positive nowhere near matching a real world attack pattern, and others were looking for any excuse to start world war three.
Putin’s regime wants ALL NATO aid between its own members in its own territory to not just be slow walked, but subordinate to a Moscow veto. If a NATO ally assists another NATO ally that’s been attacked by Russia - and does so without Moscow’s approval - Russia will consider that an attack on Russia.
I mean, you have to be spectacularly retarded not to see why US NATO cannot and must not ever concede to that element of the Russian ultimatum, and see why it’ll be a cold day in hell before you’ll see that NATO principle abolished without a single member of EU NATO vetoing it.
Imagine if the USA told Russia, “abolish the CSTO mutual security guarantees or we’ll launch a special military operation from Alaska to the far northeast and Arctic regions” and ask yourself if Putin would be so retarded as to avert war by saying yes.
>>”I wouldn’t expect NATO to”
Neither would I. But they’re obligated to do so by the NATO charter. That’s the whole point of it, which begs the question - what’s the point of being a signatory to a mutual defense treaty if the other parties have no intention of honoring their commitment? We’d do better going it alone. If we determine at some point in the future that it’s in our best interests to cooperate with countries in Europe, then we should deal with it on a case by case basis.
It was invoked by the United States.
That was due to 9-11.
NATO provided all the support that was needed.
Trump is wrong here.
Regards,
Utopian gobble-de-gook? Like all men are created equal and endowed with certain inalienable rights. Like GDP per capita of $80,000. Like putting a man on the moon, running a sub 4 mile, and dancing like Fred Astaire.
You prefer a world of Putin and Xi. Arrest of political opponents. Throw them off buildings. Keep them off the ballot. Invading Europe one country at a time. Bribing Biden and his corrupt son. No wonder you disrespect those who have served in uniform.
Free Republic doesn’t belong to the sniveling cowards of negativism. Free Republic doesn’t belong to anybody. It’s a free speech forum.
NATO is about done-wait for the next round of elections in Europe. Trump is Right. Remember WW II Started in 1939 and we did zip until late 1941.
They would “help” by sending UN troops to shoot Americans.
‘’Foreign aid. The taking of money from poor people in rich countries and giving it to rich people in poor countries.’’
“I bet if the US were attacked by Russia in Alaska, we’d hear crickets from NATO Europe.”
If the military balance were such that Russia would attempt an attack on Alaska, you can be SURE that Europe would do nothing to help the USA.
“Utopian gobble-de-gook?”
“...we could mutually-secure our freedom and independence and take a giant step to ending the scourge of war.
I invite you, my friend, to think big. Our country is already the greatest force for good in the history of the world. There’s nothing we can’t achieve. “
This is all hubristic and utopian nonsense.
It sounds like a cross between Wilson’s moral vanity Internationalism, the Yale Undergraduate UN Club, and Cringe USA BoomerCon nostalgic overconfidence and bravado.
Sorry the job of name-caller in chief has already been taken.
Well of course not. NATO countries other than the US and UK would need to have real armed forces and a spine to do that and as everybody knows, they have neither.
NATO is “obsolete.”
Many in it believe the risks are to high if nuclear wars were to start and China is counting on it.
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