Posted on 07/06/2020 5:36:22 AM PDT by marktwain
More facts are surfacing in the George Floyd case. We need to step back, allow a critical examination of evidence, and allow the criminal justice system to be applied. As gun-activist regular AmmoLand News readers well know the effect emotional sensationalism can have on the aftermath of an event and the crisis that is never left to waste.
It is important to follow proper procedures, rules of evidence, allowing the defense to present its case and an adversarial examination at trial. Despite how much we are morally revolted by the initial video evidence it is irresponsible for national media figures to proclaim guilt before a trial is conducted or the defense is heard. Here are some reasons to withhold judgment.
Having studied self-defense doctrine, and having some familiarity with police policy, it was not surprising neck restraints are allowed by the Minneapolis Police Department.
Numerous people have claimed no police department allows neck restraints.
MPD neck restraint policy, from the MPD website. Cropped and scaled by Dean Weingarten
Link to MPD policy [update MPD has now removed this page from their website but we have captured a screengrab above]
The policy says light pressure applied by the leg or arm, to the side of the neck, is allowed to restrain a person who is actively resisting arrest.
There is a video showing Floyd initially resisting arrest as he is taken from the car he was in. Two passengers come out of the passenger side and are not handcuffed. Here is a factual summation of the events leading up to the now-infamous video.
(Excerpt) Read more at ammoland.com ...
I have trouble believing a conviction can come out of this, unless you trim the charge down a good bit. With that in mind, zero chance I’d rebuild in the community of Minneapolis, and I’d be preparing for BLM to burn down more of the city in 2021.
Mmmm... I am seeing this as circumstantial, not necessarily exculpatory. I am guessing that the reason that they haven’t released the body camera recordings is because they were switched off or the recording was deleted. It’s happened before in Minneapolis - the Justine Damond case, anyone?
I would also point out that in the past “it was in the manual as an allowed policy” did not save LAPD officers from 1. killing people while attempting to take them into custody by accident and 2. finding out that juries did not agree they were reasonable.
Saving myself some typing and copying from another post I made here on FR:
I would point out that the 80s and 90s LAPD had no shortage of officers highly trained in various chokeholds and they still had people die as a result, from officers that *weren’t* being racist/punishing extrajudicially/settling scores, etc.
The genuine problems seemed to revolve around a few general categories - one, the officer had adrenaline induced time sense dilation and simply maintained the hold longer than they thought. I spoke to an retired officer that had that happen to them and it basically destroyed him psychologically.
Two, the officer thought the perp was faking it and continued to maintain the hold, when the perp wasn’t faking it.
Third, anatomical anomalies, where blood vessels weren’t constructed like they were supposed to be. Chief Gates of the LAPD at the time notoriously speculated that some races might have anatomy that made them more susceptible to bad reactions to a choke hold - there may be something to that, but nobody has ever done a study.
I don’t see that *any* amount of training can resolve the above. There were cases of *senior instructors* in the LAPD having people die on them for one of the items cited above.
I doubt the cops can get a fair trial but just like almost everyone of these type of cases the initial reaction and treatment is BS.
” critical examination of evidence, and allow the criminal justice system to be applied.”
Ya, right. The leftist see due process as an impediment to the narrative that police just hunt down black folks and kill them because they are racist.
“We need to step back, allow a critical examination of evidence.....” You did read that part right? Sadly, we know that won’t happen. Unless someone wants the entire city Burned, Looted and Molested. Hope you had an awesome 4th of July.
George Floyd was never the cause of the widespread riots, the machinery for rioting and looting under the guise of “protest” was already in place, with George Floyd’s death being only the trigger. The fact that there was a video made of the events of the arrest, and widely publicized, was just the opportunity the cabal behind the riots and looting needed to fit, if somewhat awkwardly, into their narrative, that white cops kill black men. They could not quite make it stick in Ferguson, Missouri, but they have refined the presentation greatly since then.
I don’t have a problem with the restraint
The problem is it was excessive...
I don’t they’ll get the murder conviction the press wants.
If the cop followed the procedure it’s the people who signed the procedure document who should be prosecuted if the procedure itself is deemed illegal. This will never happen because the signatures on that document would probably include the Chief of Police, the Mayor, and probably some others who, almost certainly, would include some blacks. So it’ll never happen.
“Third, anatomical anomalies, where blood vessels weren’t constructed like they were supposed to be. Chief Gates of the LAPD at the time notoriously speculated that some races might have anatomy that made them more susceptible to bad reactions to a choke hold....
So I guess we can classify anyone they can possibly find with their trachea, a four inch tube about 1 inch in diameter, on the back of the body next to their spine can be considered alien. Chief Gates is a moron.
He didn’t die of a lack of blood flow due to restriction. He died of cardiac arrest. This was not a choke hold. A choke hold restricts the windpipe. Th cop’s knee was on the back of the neck, the victim was talking to him, so his air intake was available. If his air was restricted, he wouldn’t be able to talk forming sentences.
They reacted to race when this happened. They didn’t use the facts. The cop has never been considered innocent, as the law requires, before being proven guilty. And the preponderance of reasonable doubt automatically relieves the murder charge alone. They got no case, so to get the race thing off their backs, they tossed a cop under the bus.
He’ll probably go to jail (back wheels of the same bus). They will deal with him or get involuntary manslaughter, which does qualify basically. He was wrong for not recognizing a medical emergency. But the whole group didn’t see it either, so was it recognizable at the time if no one saw it. We’re back to reasonable doubt.
rwood
“Light pressure”, is a broad term that can vary greatly in it’s interpretation.
The only major media figure who has even been talking about due process and the rule of law has be Bill O'Reilly. He refuses to call the event a killing or murder, because that needs to be determined in court.
The Officers were fired without due process, before they were even interviewed as required by the official police rules.
The Left knew they had a once in a lifetime opportunity to game the system when Rush Limbaugh, Shaun Hannity and nearly all the conservative media hopped on board and refused to even listen to the officer's side of events.
He died if cardiac arrest.
Good for you. More of us really need to keep putting that out there, nobody in the press will.
A knee did not do this. A cop did not do this. Not intentionally... The only thing I see the cop did wrong, as you point out, is not recognize a potential medical emergency. But if the guy is talking, his breathing has not been shut off. Impossible to tell a person you can’t breathe, if you really can’t.
I saved a guy’s life one night, choking on a bite of meat. Did he tell me he was choking and unable to breathe? Hell no, all he could do is frantically point, I had to guess and ask questions. Fortunately, I had recently looked up how to use the Heinlich maneuver, and he walked away from the table, instead of being carried out in a body bag. But he could not TELL ME he could not breathe...
Exactly.
One of the points I was trying to make, yes.
Er, no. There are documented cases where the person who died had abnormal carotid arteries (or bloodflow) that simply didn’t re-open after pressure was released. In a couple cases, the choke hold caused an aneurysm to burst. A “choke hold” restraint does not work by compressing the trachea but by compressing the blood vessels feeding the brain. The idea is to briefly deprive the brain of oxygen causing lack of consciousness. Unfortunately, because even if the cops do everything right, there *are* anatomical anomalies like the ones I mentioned above that can cause death if a choke hold is applied. I’m not blaming the police for these anatomical issues happening (because duh) but it is a far more widespread problem than was originally thought in the 1960s and through the 1970s. Chief Gates made his infamous observation when he noticed that some races were dying in chokeholds more than others and the MEs were coming back with COD being odd anatomical failures.
Keep in mind that this was *before* the Rodney King incident, too, and that most chokeholds had already been banned by the LAPD in 1980.
As for Cause Of Death... the “cardiac arrest” verdict was returned by the Hennepin County ME. Same office and staff that desperately tried to avoid confirming that Officer Mohammed Noor shot and killed Justine Damond, then after having to admit it, wrote their report to try to say that he basically did her a favor by shooting her.
I wouldn’t trust them if they told me someone got run over by a bus and I’d seen the accident that happened myself.
Suppose you’re officer Chauvin. The crowd is yelling at you to change your behavior. One of your fellow officers asks you about your behavior. You continue the behavior.
Are you just a big racist who sees an opportunity to kill Mr. Floyd? No matter the consequences?
Or are you doing something you think is ok? Something you’ve been trained to do?
Hopefully, we’ll hear his side of the story.
Don’t forget that he’s on video as rejecting medical assistance for Floyd until it was far too late. Also, he continued the hold for *far* longer than he should have.
I don’t know if it really was racially motivated, or (as some evidence seems to indicate) if it was simply settling scores with a former co-worker. At the very least, he’s a bad cop - because when everyone around is looking askance at you, one of your fellow officers is telling you to reconsider your actions and the crowd is telling you to at least get the guy medical assistance, you maybe *should* reconsider your actions. Also - once the fight’s over and the guy is in full restraints, the fight is OVER. You don’t keep up the hold - and time sense dilation or not, seven minutes is far too long to maintain that hold.
I am less interested in what Chauvin has to say and what the officers’ body cameras recorded. Are we taking bets that it’s another “oops, we didn’t turn them on” as in the Damond case or the “oops, the recordings were accidentally deleted” excuse?
They have not been released yet.
The report is from AP, a very leftist organization.
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