Posted on 06/20/2017 8:43:40 AM PDT by Cecily
As a Shipboard Dwelling Sailor, this is not only possible, but expected by the crew.
I remember taking basic damage control and the froggy voiced E-8 O.I.C. told everyone of us former recruits, “That if it comes down to saving your life or saving the ship and other lives, you will and may have to shut a hatch on one of your shipmates!” Sounds heartless, but ever Sailor knows this before hitting the fleet.
Have you ever slept in a berthing compartment aboard a naval ship? You assumed the clock started ticking at the moment of collision, as if it were a shotgun start to a foot race.
First of all, it's fairly dark in a berthing area at night. A few red lights are lit, and perhaps a light or two in the head. Most sailors sleep in their underwear--briefs, boxers and a tee shirt. Their boots are usually nearby, and perhaps they have a set of utilities that they can pull on relatively quickly.
No one knows precisely what happened to the berthing area where the sailors were trapped, though it's very likely that all of sleeping sailors were jostled awake in some form. Very likely, many were thrown from their racks, and were likely disoriented, initially. Remember, it was already dark, and now you introduce the possibility of flooding into the berthing compartment.
For those that can move on their own, their instinct will be to move to the ladders leading out of their berthing, maybe grabbing whoever else they can on the way. Despite the motivation to get out of that compartment, a queue would inevitably form--perhaps some sailors are pushing into others with urgency--depending on how quickly water poured in.
It's quite possible that many of the deceased sailors were injured immediately during the collision, and couldn't move on their own. They may have been knocked unconscious, or perhaps even killed upon impact.
So your minimal time of ONE MINUTE, while generous-sounding, still doesn't give them much time to get out of their berthing area, not considering the environment and the circumstances.
As for the CO, he will undoubtedly be blamed and will become the historical fall-guy, as skippers always do. But people should realize that even skippers need sleep, and require to be wakened when their presence is needed--such as in an emergency. Given that the Captain was injured and trapped in his cabin during the collision, we know that didn't occur, at least not in a timely enough way.
What you say is true, TBM.
I have several years sleeper in the berthing compartments of both DDG and LHA.
Your points are valid.
These guys were likely injured upon initial impact. Some may even have washed out the hole in the side of the ship.
I’d actually assumed what you stated, that in an emergency situation procedure and training kick in ... period. God bless and comfort the families for their sons’ sacrifices. And those in command.
Just as likely they were thrown, in a deep sleep, out of their racks onto the deck, in pitch darkness in a flooding compartment...that requirement of being able to find your way out was going to be critical no matter what.
My wife kind of laughs at me, but when we go to a hotel (or most recently on a cruise ship) I have a flashlight next to my bed, clothes nearby laid out, and I have two routes out of the room to the outside or deck that I navigate with my eyes closed (I only did that with my eyes closed on the cruise ship when nobody else was around!) a few times just to be sure I can do it in pitch black.
Old Navy Wife speaking, here. You nailed it. ;)
My battle station was in a 5th deck magazine packed with high explosives well below the water line. I felt very safe and secure in my steel cocoon. The real heroes were those who worked on the flight deck, exposed to the weather with nothing between them and the enemy but a few layers of cloth.
If the CO was not on the bridge at the time of the collision, then I agree that the cause is almost certainly a negligent watch.
It's awful to cast blame, but an investigation will no doubt confirm your suspicions.
Of course, the CO is ultimately responsible, and he will be relieved if he hasn't already.
Just remember; even in peace time, every Sailor aboard every Navy ship at sea knows why those water tight hatches are there.
If the compartment is flooding, you dog it, even if it’s your brother on the other side.
Just part of Duty, Honor, and Country.
I read a story about Guadalcanal, and there was a US Navy destroyer offshore, being frantically signaled by a group of Marines. They weren't sure if it was real or a trick by the Japanese, but they sent a boat ashore and picked up a party of Marines that had been out there, trapped behind enemy lines, and eventually somewhat surrounded by the Japanese on land with their back to the sea. The leader of that group was Chesty Puller. Here is the write up from some web site on it:
"...Shortly after arriving on Guadalcanal, Puller led his battalion in fierce fighting along the Matanikau River. During the engagement, three of Puller's companies were surrounded and cut off from American forces by Japanese troops. Puller ran to the shore, signaled a U.S. Navy destroyer, the USS Monssen, and directed the ship to provide covering fire while landing craft rescued the surrounded Marines. During the rescue, U.S. Coast Guard Signalman First Class Douglas Albert Munro, Officer-in-Charge of the group of landing craft, was killed while providing covering fire for the Marines and was posthumously awarded the Medal of Honor for his actions, making him the first, and to date the only, Coast Guardsman to receive the decoration. Puller's quick thinking in organizing the rescue saved the three companies and earned Puller the Bronze Star with Combat "V"..."
The reason I bring this up, was when they got Puller and some of the Marines on the destroyer (to direct fire in support of the Marines ashore) they were in tough shape, having been in continuous combat with little food or rest, so they sailors treated them like royalty with food and clean clothes where they could get them. In the discussion, the Captain of the Monssen asked them if they wanted to stay aboard for another day or two, and Puller and the Marines declined politely. The Captain said to the Marines something to the effect of "I don't know how you can do it, living under those conditions, people firing at you, living in the mud..."
Puller and the Marines looked surprised, and responded something like "Heck. We don't know how you sailors do it. We Marines always know where we are and have our feet on the ground, we can hunker down in a hole...you guys on the ships, you never know where you are, and if someone fires at you, there is no place to go!" while all the Marines nodded in assent!
And thanks for your service also!
This.
TURKEY TROTS TO WATER GG FROM CINCPAC ACTION COM THIRD FLEET INFO COMINCH CTF SEVENTY-SEVEN X WHERE IS RPT WHERE IS TASK FORCE THIRTY FOUR RR THE WORLD WONDERS
Capsize is more likely than outright sinking, given flooding on the one side; and, free movement of water in large spaces without baffles to prevent sloshing.
The first Adams class destroyers were built in the late 1950s. McNamara didn’t become SecDef until 1960. The design and preliminary construction started during the Eisenhower administration.
That makes more sense, I agree.
The only thing I might add is that if there was a CPA-zero situation, the quarter master, lookouts, and the CIC surface watches should've all been echoing the same thing to the OOD. All of these reports about this contact should be entered in log books, along with any action take by the OOD.
That happened to a friend of mine when he was a kid, too. He said it was the most excruciatingly painful thing he had ever experienced, before or since, and that he was writhing and kicking in agony under water. Then just before he lost consciousness, his body relaxed and the pain and fear vanished, and he was at peace with it.
Sigh. I just don’t see how the Navy is going to come out of this smelling like a rose, even if it was hostile intent.
I am saddened by much I see, and when the Iranians captured those two Navy boats last year, it nearly made me spit.
I don’t have a wish to see the USN doing poorly, but...something is rotten.
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