Posted on 07/21/2016 8:22:56 AM PDT by ChicagoConservative27
Lindsey will endorse Hillary at his party's convention in Philly.
Context is everything. Trump is sending a message. You can read the entire transcript of the interview here
Trump is right. NATO countries are committed under the treaty to spend 2% of GDP on defense annually. Five NATO members are expected to meet the alliance’s 2 percent target for defense spending in 2015. Poland joins Britain, Estonia, Greece, and the United States as the only members of the 28-country alliance to meet the threshold.
NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg commended the change, but warned that total alliance spending will decline by roughly 1.5 percent this year. Of the 28 countries, 18 are increasing their military spending in real terms, the data indicates. Still, alliance members will spend a collective total $892 billion on defense in 2015, down from $942 billion in 2014 and $968 billion in 2013.
An excerpt from the NYT interview:
SANGER: But I guess the question is, If we can’t, do you think that your presidency, let’s assume for a moment that they contribute what they are contributing today, or what they have contributed historically, your presidency would be one of pulling back and saying, “You know, we’re not going to invest in these alliances with NATO, we are not going to invest as much as we have in Asia since the end of the Korean War because we can’t afford it and it’s really not in our interest to do so.”
TRUMP: If we cannot be properly reimbursed for the tremendous cost of our military protecting other countries, and in many cases the countries I’m talking about are extremely rich. Then if we cannot make a deal, which I believe we will be able to, and which I would prefer being able to, but if we cannot make a deal, I would like you to say, I would prefer being able to, some people, the one thing they took out of your last story, you know, some people, the fools and the haters, they said, “Oh, Trump doesn’t want to protect you.” I would prefer that we be able to continue, but if we are not going to be reasonably reimbursed for the tremendous cost of protecting these massive nations with tremendous wealth — you have the tape going on?
SANGER: We do.
HABERMAN: We both do.
TRUMP: With massive wealth. Massive wealth. We’re talking about countries that are doing very well. Then yes, I would be absolutely prepared to tell those countries, “Congratulations, you will be defending yourself.”
SANGER: That suggests that our forward deployments around the world are based on their interests — they’re not really based on our interests. And yet I think many in your party would say that the reason that we have troops in Europe, the reason that we keep 60,000 troops in Asia, is that it’s in our interest to keep open trading lines, it’s in our interest to keep the North Koreans in check, you do that much better out away from the United States.
TRUMP: I think it’s a mutual interest, but we’re being reimbursed like it’s only in our interest. I think it’s a mutual interest.
SANGER: We were talking about alliances, and the fundamental problem that you hear many Republicans, traditional Republicans, have with the statement that you’ve made is that it would seem to them that you would believe that the interests of the United States being out with both our troops and our diplomacy abroad is less than our economic interests in having somebody else support that. In other words, even if they didn’t pay a cent toward it, many have believed that the way we’ve kept our postwar leadership since World War II has been our ability to project power around the world. That’s why we got this many diplomats —— TRUMP: How is it helping us? How has it helped us? We have massive trade deficits. I could see that, if instead of having a trade deficit worldwide of $800 billion, we had a trade positive of $100 billion, $200 billion, $800 billion. So how has it helped us? SANGER: Well, keeping the peace. We didn’t have a presence in places like Korea in 1950, or not as great a presence, and you saw what happened. TRUMP: There’s no guarantee that we’ll have peace in Korea. SANGER: Even with our troops, no, there’s no guarantee.
TRUMP: No, there’s no guarantee. We have 28,000 soldiers on the line. SANGER: But we’ve had them there since 1953 and —— TRUMP: Sure, but that doesn’t mean that there wouldn’t be something going on right now. Maybe you would have had a unified Korea. Who knows what would have happened? In the meantime, what have we done? So we’ve kept peace, but in the meantime we’ve let North Korea get stronger and stronger and more nuclear and more nuclear, and you are really saying, “Well, how is that a good thing?” You understand? North Korea now is almost like a boiler. You say we’ve had peace, but that part of Korea, North Korea, is getting more and more crazy. And more and more nuclear. And they are testing missiles all the time.
SANGER: They are.
TRUMP: And we’ve got our soldiers sitting there watching missiles go up. And you say to yourself, “Oh, that’s interesting.” Now we’re protecting Japan because Japan is a natural location for North Korea. So we are protecting them, and you say to yourself, “Well, what are we getting out of this?”
SANGER: Well, we keep our missile defenses out there. And those missile defenses help prevent the day when North Korea can reach the United States with one of its missiles. It’s a lot easier to shoot down from there ——
TRUMP: We’ve had them there for a long time, and now they’re practically obsolete, in all fairness.
SANGER: Relatively new missile defenses would allow us ——
TRUMP: I’m only saying this. We’re spending money, and if you’re talking about trade, we’re losing a tremendous amount of money, according to many stats, $800 billion a year on trade. So we are spending a fortune on military in order to lose $800 billion. That doesn’t sound like it’s smart to me. Just so you understand though, totally on the record, this is not 40 years ago. We are not the same country and the world is not the same world. Our country owes right now $19 trillion, going to $21 trillion very quickly because of the omnibus budget that was passed, which is incredible. We don’t have the luxury of doing what we used to do; we don’t have the luxury, and it is a luxury. We need other people to reimburse us much more substantially than they are giving right now because we are only paying for a fraction of the cost.
SANGER: Or to take on the burden themselves.
TRUMP: Or, if we cannot make the right deal, to take on the burden themselves. You said it wrong because you said or — or if we cannot make the right deal for proper reimbursement to take on the burden themselves. Yes. Now, Hillary Clinton said: “I will never leave Japan. I will never leave Japan. Will never leave any of our ——” Well now, once you say that, guess what happens? What happens?
HABERMAN: You’re stuck.
TRUMP: You can’t negotiate.
HABERMAN: Right.
TRUMP: In a deal, you always have to be prepared to walk. Hillary Clinton has said, “We will never, ever walk.” That’s a wonderful phrase, but unfortunately, if I were on Saudi Arabia’s side, Germany, Japan, South Korea and others, I would say, “Oh, they’re never leaving, so what do we have to pay them for?” Does that make sense to you, David?
SANGER: I was just in the Baltic States. They are very concerned obviously about this new Russian activism, they are seeing submarines off their coasts, they are seeing airplanes they haven’t seen since the Cold War coming, bombers doing test runs. If Russia came over the border into Estonia or Latvia, Lithuania, places that Americans don’t think about all that often, would you come to their immediate military aid?
TRUMP: I don’t want to tell you what I’d do because I don’t want Putin to know what I’d do. I have a serious chance of becoming president and I’m not like Obama, that every time they send some troops into Iraq or anyplace else, he has a news conference to announce it.
SANGER: They are NATO members, and we are treaty-obligated ——
TRUMP: We have many NATO members that aren’t paying their bills.
SANGER: That’s true, but we are treaty-obligated under NATO, forget the bills part.
TRUMP: You can’t forget the bills. They have an obligation to make payments. Many NATO nations are not making payments, are not making what they’re supposed to make. That’s a big thing. You can’t say forget that.
SANGER: My point here is, Can the members of NATO, including the new members in the Baltics, count on the United States to come to their military aid if they were attacked by Russia? And count on us fulfilling our obligations ——
TRUMP: Have they fulfilled their obligations to us? If they fulfill their obligations to us, the answer is yes.
HABERMAN: And if not?
TRUMP: Well, I’m not saying if not. I’m saying, right now there are many countries that have not fulfilled their obligations to us.
SANGER: You’ve seen several of those countries come under cyberattack, things that are short of war, clearly appear to be coming from Russia.
TRUMP: Well, we’re under cyberattack.
SANGER: We’re under regular cyberattack. Would you use cyberweapons before you used military force?
I completely agree with Trump. In fact I think we should pull out of NATO and form a new European alliance that includes Russia and does not include Turkey and countries that are intent upon committing cultural suicide.
And yes, I think Putin would make real concessions regarding relations with the former satellites and Iran in return for inclusion as a European partner.
Norway is only spending 1.5% of GDP on defense compared to 3.6% by the US. Norway is a rich country. Why can’t they pay their fair share?
When you honor your pledge, we will think about it, then after we decide to take it or not, we’ll get back to you, we’ll call you, don’t call us...
Your a Hillary supporter, you hate the party your in, why don’t you go over and support Hillary, Cruz, and everyone else that has been shown to be a turn coat...
We, the American Voters have taken this election over, WE have chosen Trump/Pence to head OUR party and OUR COUNTRY, we not longer are in need of your helpless attacks...bye!!!
Read my post #42. Estonia is paying 2% of GDP this meeting its commitment.
Shut up lindsay-girl
We as the GOP can work this out after we defeat Hillary.
I utterly agree.
It is shameful.
The truth is that the leading politicans and establishment do rely on the much maligned American big brother.
Some military chiefs have tried to raise the alarm, saying things like - we might have decent special forces (they are good), but we don’t have regular troops to defend even Oslo itself.
We now have a conservative government, where our minister of defense has warned about Russia yet our government is only increasing the defence budget a tiny ammount.
Of course we could afford probably going as far as 5 percent and us being quite rich probably could mean we would have a decent defense.
As it is now, we are using large parts of our defense budget on buying the F-35, whilst the navy and army are lagging behind.
To put it short - It is shameful that a country as rich as Norway, lying on the Russian border, does not even fulfill the modest 2 percent requirement.
Estonia though is one of 5 NATO nations who does, and immediately answered America’s call when article 5 was invoked after 911 sending troops to Afghanistan.
NATO is a relic of the Cold War.
Here is a video with some very interesting comments from former Sec Def Donald Rumsfeld. Check out min 4:22 - 6:30.
Rumsfeld: Why I will vote for Trump
The former NATO ambassador Rumsfeld was not shocked by Trump's comments re NATO. In fact he had in 2002 or 2003 sent a PM to President Bush suggesting looking into reorganization of NATO.
Luxembourg -- .5%
Spain --.9%
Hungary -- .9%
Belgium -- .9% (and NATO Hdqtrs is in Brussels contributing millions to the local economy)
Canada --1%
Slovenia -- 1%
Slovak Republic -- 1%
Latvia -- 1%
Italy -- 1%
Some other large countries:
Germany --1.2%
Turkey -- 1.7%
France -- 1.8%.
How long must Uncle Sap provide the security umbrella for Europe and Canada while most of the countries are spending less and less on their own security? The US is the biggest debtor nation in the world. We have a $19.4 trillion dollar debt and are running a $600 billion deficit this year.
Wow, kabar thanks for posting.
I agree with everything Trump said in this interview.
Though it did not cover the Erdogan part.
See video I posted just above your post. Trump is not alone calling for reforms of NATO.
It is more than shameful. It has to change immediately. The US can't afford to continue to carry the burden of other countries' defense without them doing their fair share. Trump is laying down a marker. It does not go over well in Europe and Canada. They prefer Hillary who will not address the issue and will continue the hollowing out of the US military.
This is the classic guns versus butter battle that happens when great nations decline. Butter usually wins because it has more constituents. The welfare system will continue to consume more and more of the budgets of Europe, the US, and Canada.
Trump is once again speaking the inconvenient truth and being pilloried for it. Graham is wrong and Trump is right.
I agree.
Now reading the entire transcript I have changed my mind on both the Erdogan issue and the NATO issue.
I almost feel bad for pressing the alarm button with my earlier thread.
Thanks again for posting the entire transcript.
Cheers,
Euro.
This time Lindsey Graham is correct.
When one enters into a pact, one expects the rest of the parties to pull their own weight. Trump understands that we can't be the primary funder while letting the rest get treated via the taxpayer's backs
You got that exactly right. Tell him to just shut up and go to the sauna and get a nice massage.
Puleaze....I thought Mr. 0.2% left the building.
Then why was Trump saying last Sunday that he'd call on NATO to help with fighting ISIS in Syria?
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