[grania]

Both sides were promised stuff, because nobody wanted those darn Ukranians to have nukes. The US promise was definitely not a treaty. I don't know what the NATO promise to Russia was, but I assume a hollow promise to them, too.

Let's apply some logic here. Split Ukraine in half. If any surrounding country wants the western half, let them have it. Just keep the Kiev coup gov out of the eastern half, where they aren't welcome. If people aren't happy with the half they're in, facilitate a move.

Am I missing anything here? I just can't imagine how it doesn't escalate to a major war if US trained, armed, and advised troops show up in eastern Ukraine.

[1rudeboy]

Am I missing anything here?

Yes, you are appeasing military aggression.

[dp0622]

Very concerned about the situation. Putin seems a little unstable. While I understand Russia's historical fear of invasion, putin is talking about nuke use like it is just another weapon, selling SAMs to Iran, chronically initiating aircraft incursions, and killing/arresting enemies while using propaganda to get 80 percent support. I think he wants the empire back. And I think we have the WRONG president at this time In history. Plus, the Ukraine soldiers are putting up fiercer resistance than expected from what I've read. Don't know what to make of the whole situation. Also suspicious that Soros wants to put up one billion dollars as long as its guaranteed. What nerve.

[mac_truck]

Both sides were promised stuff, because nobody wanted those darn Ukranians to have nukes.

The deal was made to prevent Ukraine from selling their nukes to the highest bidder on the black market, which was what they were doing with the rest of their military hardware.

No one trusted the Ukrainians then and nothing in their short sordid history as a 'democracy' rebuts that consensus.

[FreeReign]

Let's apply some logic here.

Okay.

Split Ukraine in half....

LOL

You said you were going to apply simple logic.