Posted on 08/28/2014 9:17:40 AM PDT by Kaslin
"The best laid schemes of mice and men often go awry." -- Scottish poet Robert Burns, "To a Mouse" (1786)
CAIRNRYAN, Scotland -- For Americans whose knowledge of this beautiful land is limited to kilts, whiskey, bagpipes and the film "Braveheart," the forthcoming referendum on whether Scotland should remain part of the United Kingdom or become an independent nation will come as a curiosity at best.
The primary objection of those favoring separation is the lack of self-determination granted to Scots by the British government. Though Westminster in recent months has devolved more powers to Edinburgh, those favoring separation say it is not enough. In the final debate Monday night before the September 18
vote (a turnout of 80 percent is predicted), the chairman of the "Better Together" campaign, Alistair Darling, engaged in the rhetorical equivalent of a heavyweight prizefight with Alex Salmond, first minister of Scotland.
Salmond was declared the winner of the debate, decisively defeating Darling on performance, despite numerous interruptions by both men. Darling mostly had the better of it on substance when he noted the uncertainty that would follow separation, especially over the currency that will be used, the debt Scotland could still owe Britain, lost revenue from North Sea oil and gas and "thousands" of jobs that might be lost if U.S. Trident submarines were forced to leave Scottish waters, since presently, the U.S. is allied firmly with Great Britain, who, after separation, would no longer hold sway over Scottish ports.
The referendum generally pits a younger liberal population in favor of separation against older, more conservative Scots. Listening to questions from the Glasgow audience in the nationally televised debate, I was struck by how much the ideological battles here resemble U.S. politics, especially when it comes to defense. The naive argument by one young man, who appeared no older than 30, that ridding Scotland of nuclear weapons will somehow make the country safer might make some liberals feel better in the short term, but it denies the reality of peace through strength and the superior argument that having nuclear weapons serves as a deterrent.
Salmond mentioned the aging and increasingly dysfunctional National Health Service and the thousands of Scots who have come to rely on it. He wondered whether they will become victims of budget cuts, privatization and austerity measures should Scotland remain part of the UK. He's right, of course. NHS is running in the red and cannot sustain itself, but parting ways with Britain won't fix that for Scotland, reports the Daily Mirror, and Salmond has no viable alternative to the NHS. Darling might have pointed this out to him, but he chose not to.
Another similarity with U.S. politics was the failure of both men to challenge the populace to rely less on government and more on themselves. "We can't go on like this" might not sit well with voters who have come to rely too much on government and as a result contributed to the national debt of both countries, but it is reality.
Polls taken before the final debate show the pro-separation side still trailing by 14 percent those who wish Scotland to remain part of Britain, but people are now paying attention. The loudest applause of the night came when Salmond closed with this line: "This is our time, it's our moment. Let us do it now."
Scottish independence would further weaken what remains of Britain's once great "empire." It could also seriously weaken Scotland, which could learn that unlike the young adult who leaves home unprepared and soon has to return, there may be no going back if Scotland leaves the "home" it has lived in for more than 300 years.
On the anecdote level:
I met a couple of middle aged Scots in the ‘90s. Both were big time lefties. They would have wet their pants over our current Sultan and his gang. I hope they were not representative of the majority.
Utter crap, and I am a diehard NO voter and Unionist.
Scotland contributes more to the UK than it gets. The subsidy myth is just that.
Nope, what nonsense.
Then we're cousins.
Oddly though, my family tree also includes Edward I, Longshanks, who subjugated Scotland in the first place.
95% of Scots may get some money from the govt, even if working, like working tax credits, basic child allowance.
But then most British get that.
Is the American media covering this story at all?.
We get Fox News here as well as CNN, MSNBC and some ABC/CBS news coverage. But I haven’t been watching them.
Got it?
You had better check again, or I believe that you are a real Neanderthal
*snicker*
Your questions stinks of ignorance. Shame on you
Wow
I only watch Fox News and don’t recall them covering this story. I haven’t watched ABC, CBS, CNN, NBC, MSNBC or as Rush call it PMSnbc in ages
Hey . . . Anglo-Saxons need an ancestral homeland too, y'know.
Correction: it was Union tyranny, not "English" tyranny. The Jacobite rebellions were never wars for Scottish independence and the Protestant lowland Scots hated the Jacobite Highlanders more than the English did.
BTW, Scottish nationalists are Communists, not conservatives.
ARG!!!
Scottish nationalists are pro-European Union! They're hard leftists!!!
Some people have such a swooning cult of Celtishness they simply refuse to be aware of what's going on.
This is a perfect illustration of one difference between the Western Left and the Third World Left.
When a Third World Leftist country gains independence, it arms itself to the teeth and celebrates its new-found military (even nuclear) might. The Western Left wants to create pacifist hippie states.
But who knows? The Western Left does have the "patriotism for the socialist motherland" going. Maybe they'll eventually become saber-rattling militarists as well.
So, Scotland wants to become independent of England so they can be even more dependent on the EU, victims to the intentions of European bankers, and to rely on Europe/NATO for defense? That’s too weird.
It's also 100% true. You weren't aware of that?
Alex Salmond, the leader of the Scottish National Party, is called "the Trotsky of Scotland." Leftwing nationalism has a long history in Scotland going back to John Maclean, who claimed that the ancient Highland clans practiced Communism, making it as Scottish as haggis. One of his mottoes was "backward to Communism and forward to Communism!"
The same goes for all the other Celtic nationalisms too . . . and the nationalisms of the Spanish minorities as well.
Americans have this foolish notion that a person with pale skin can't be a left-wing nationalist.
From my American opinion, I hope that Scotland does become independent for these three reasons: #1) I SUPPORT self determination, secession (heck our own US Declaration of Independence was based on these principles) so they should get to live under the government they want. #2)It would FORCE socialists to grow up when they CAN’T rely upon the charity of the whole of the UK. And #3) If Scotland becomes independent, since a large portion of Labour’s support is from Scotland, it will leave the rest of the UK (England, Wales, Northern Ire, and the minor territories) MUCH more conservative.
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