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The Disappearance of Hell
ligonier.org ^ | 2/1/14 | John MacArthur

Posted on 02/09/2014 8:05:52 AM PST by SoFloFreeper

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To: SoFloFreeper

I agree! If there is no hell, why did Jesus have to die? What was He saving us from?


21 posted on 02/09/2014 8:30:56 AM PST by Former Fetus (Saved by grace through faith)
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To: SoFloFreeper; All
Over the past 100+ years, many words and terms have been redefined into utter meaninglessness as so-called "progressives" have attempted to accumulate power to themselves and those who think like they think.

John MacArthur, in the above article, mentions the "good news," as well as "glad tidings." Little more than a month ago, Christians celebrated the birth of One called "the Savior"!

That specific term implies, does it not, that a "Savior's" role must be to save from something? Before the idea of "hell" could be minimized, is it possible that another word's meaning needed to be redefined as well?

In 1973, Dr. Karl Menninger, a Psychiatrist, wrote a book called,"What Ever Became of Sin?

In 2008, an article appeared in "Culture Watch" by Bill Muehlenberg, which reviewed Menninger's query, and added commentary about the degree to which redefinition of words and terms had played a part in societal understanding. Here is a small excerpt from this thought-provoking piece (recommend a full read, however):

"A recent story in the Mail on Sunday reports on changes made to the Oxford Junior Dictionary. And it seems it is not just the word ‘sin’ which has got the axe. According to the story, a number of Christian and biblical terms have been deleted, including “abbey, altar, bishop, chapel, christen, disciple, monk, nun, pew, saint”.

"The article quotes one concerned parent: “Lisa Saunders, from County Down, Northern Ireland, compared six editions since the 1970s and was horrified to discover that a whole range of words relating to Christianity, nature and British history had been axed over the years. ‘The Christian faith still has a strong following,’ she said. ‘To eradicate so many words associated with Christianity will have a big effect on the numerous primary schools who use it. We know that language moves on and we can’t be fuddy-duddy about it, but you don’t cull hundreds of important words in order to get in a different set of ICT words’.”

The article also provides the rationale from the publisher: “Oxford University Press said it analysed millions of words from children’s books and the school curriculum and looked at how frequently they occurred in considering how to update new editions. Advice from teachers is also taken before the final choice is made. Vineeta Gupta, head of children’s dictionaries, said: ‘We are limited by how big the dictionary can be – little hands must be able to handle it – but we produce 17 children’s dictionaries with different selections and numbers of words. When you look back at older versions of dictionaries, there were lots of examples of flowers for instance. That was because many children lived in semi-rural environments and saw the seasons. Nowadays, the environment has changed. We are also much more multicultural. People don’t go to Church as often as before. Our understanding of religion is within multiculturalism, which is why some words such as “Pentecost” or “Whitsun” would have been in 20 years ago but not now’.”

So what is one to make of all this? Several thoughts come to mind. Sure, as Western societies become increasingly secular such terms will therefore continue to fall out of use. But the fact that a word may not be used a lot may not be a good reason for pulling it from our dictionaries.

Historical terms were also pulled from the dictionary; words such as “coronation, duchess, duke, emperor, empire, monarch, decade”. But as the years roll on, perhaps many will not know or care about such things as the Holocaust. Does that mean we should feel free to delete that term as well?

Certain terms are simply a part of the Western heritage and are too vital to be left out. Christianity played an enormous role in the establishment and continuance of Western civilisation, so it should not so readily be dismissed from our collective memories.

Theological demolition jobs

But leaving aside for the moment what words we include or exclude from our dictionaries, the gradual disappearance of the notion of sin has far-wider implications and ramifications. For this notion is fundamental to the Judeo-Christian worldview. Take away our understanding of sin, and these two major religious traditions no longer make any sense.

Indeed, biblical Christianity is incoherent without the notion of sin. There can be no good news of the Gospel without first understanding the bad news of sin and the Fall. The mission of Jesus makes no sense if we remove such concepts from our thinking.

Jesus made it clear that the reason he came to earth was to save sinners. For example, as he said in all three Synoptic Gospels: “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners”. Take away the doctrine of sin and we take away the doctrine of the Incarnation. Indeed, we take away the entire message of the New Testament.

But of course very liberalised versions of Christianity are quite happy to dispense with the notion of sin altogether. They think it has no place in the believer’s vocabulary or theology. Plenty of examples come to mind here."

(End of Excerpt)

In America, we have seen similar semantic maneuvers and outright censorship of the very ideas of liberty upon which our Constitution's protections were built.

At the time of the report titled "A Nation at Risk" was published, there were warnings about the degree to which the public schools in America had failed in teaching students about their nation's historical foundations, one observing that there had been an effecting "erasing" of the national memory.

So-called "progressive" imposition of coercive control by political elites, as a substitute for self-government and an ignoring of what the Founders acknowledged to be the "Supreme Judge of the World" in their Declaration of Independence may have led us to where we are today.

Semantics and hidden meanings have played a large part in the current Administration's promotion of its idea of "hope and change." Citizens, in their ignorance, supplied their own sometimes uninformed meanings, and now we see some consequences of an uninformed electorate.

A Memorial and Remonstrance. . . . - James Madison (Excerpt)

"Because we hold it for a fundamental and undeniable truth, “that Religion or the duty which we owe to our Creator and the Manner of discharging it, can be directed only by reason and conviction, not by force or violence.”

"The Religion then of every man must be left to the conviction and conscience of every man; and it is the right of every man to exercise it as these may dictate. This right is in its nature an unalienable right. It is unalienable; because the opinions of men, depending only on the evidence contemplated by their own minds, cannot follow the dictates of other men: It is unalienable also; because what is here a right towards men, is a duty towards the Creator. It is the duty of every man to render to the Creator such homage, and such only, as he believes to be acceptable to him. This duty is precedent both in order of time and degree of obligation, to the claims of Civil Society. Before any man can be considered as a member of Civil Society, he must be considered as a subject of the Governor of the Universe: And if a member of Civil Society, who enters into any subordinate Association, must always do it with a reservation of his duty to the general authority; much more must every man who becomes a member of any particular Civil Society, do it with a saving of his allegiance to the Universal Sovereign. We maintain therefore that in matters of Religion, no man’s right is abridged by the institution of Civil Society, and that Religion is wholly exempt from its cognizance."

-----

"Although all men are born free, slavery has been the general lot of the human race. Ignorant--they have been cheated; asleep--they have been surprised; divided--the yoke has been forced upon them. But what is the lesson?...the people ought to be enlightened, to be awakened, to be united, that after establishing a government they should watch over it....It is universally admitted that a well-instructed people alone can be permanently free." - James Madison


22 posted on 02/09/2014 8:31:48 AM PST by loveliberty2
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To: DManA

You are not a serious Christian, you sound like maybe a cultural Christian


23 posted on 02/09/2014 8:32:50 AM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: DManA

re: “I’m a Christian. Hell is a myth.”

How did you come to that conclusion? Just curious, because Jesus speaks of Hell (gehenna) several times, and both James and Peter speak of it. In Revelation, the “lake of fire” is referred to several times and is traditionally viewed as another description of hell.

So, again, just curious as to your statement - or, are you just attempting to provoke?


24 posted on 02/09/2014 8:33:24 AM PST by rusty schucklefurd
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To: LostInBayport

“Fair warning: I’m only on my first cup of coffee. But didn’t someone somewhere once say something to the effect of “The devil’s greatest and most effective deception is convincing people he doesn’t exist”

C.S Lewis among others


25 posted on 02/09/2014 8:33:28 AM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: Rennes Templar

“I think there is a devil, or devils, but not hell. I don’t think it’s God’s plan to have billions of souls burning in a physical fire for eternity. I think He is more merciful, and he has other ways to punish us.”

Well you are wrong.


26 posted on 02/09/2014 8:34:31 AM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: SoFloFreeper

“Don’t know how you square that notion of no hell with the Biblical teaching. Your assertion of “billions of souls burning in a physical fire for eternity” is noted—and some teachers certainly look at that as a metaphor,”

You’ere getting into dangerous territory. Either there is strict Biblical teaching, or there is metaphorical interpretation of it. And if hell is open to metaphorical interpretation, what isn’t, or who is to say what is or isn’t?


27 posted on 02/09/2014 8:38:33 AM PST by Rennes Templar
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To: LostInBayport
The devil's greatest deception is convincing people that God is just like himself. Shouldn't this topic really be in the religion forum anyway?
28 posted on 02/09/2014 8:38:45 AM PST by eclecticEel ("The petty man forsakes what lies within his power and longs for what lies with Heaven." - Xunzi)
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To: SoFloFreeper

I’m about half way through listening to the book “Erasing Hell” by Francis Chan and Preston Sprinkle. They make many of the same points.


29 posted on 02/09/2014 8:42:57 AM PST by Pan_Yan (Who told you that you were naked? Genesis 3:11)
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To: DManA
I’m a Christian. Hell is a myth.

Hell is real. Your version of "Christianity" is a myth.

Jesus spoke at length about Hell and warned everyone of the wrath of God to come.

Was He just kidding?

30 posted on 02/09/2014 8:45:01 AM PST by P-Marlowe (There can be no Victory without a fight and no battle without wounds)
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To: SoFloFreeper

Has anyone ever read the Book of Revelation?


31 posted on 02/09/2014 8:48:43 AM PST by Pajamajan (Pray for our nation. Thank the Lord for everything you have. Don't wait. Do it today.)
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32 posted on 02/09/2014 8:52:35 AM PST by RedMDer (are sHappy with this, America? Make your voices heard. 2014 is just around the corner. ~ Sarah Palin)
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To: Don Corleone
As I said, I'm a Christian. Jesus is my savior. So I don't need to worry about it anyway.

But what if you are wrong? What then?

33 posted on 02/09/2014 8:54:05 AM PST by DManA
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To: MIchaelTArchangel

Does that thought give you a little thrill? You will answer for that.


34 posted on 02/09/2014 8:59:22 AM PST by DManA
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To: DManA
The unsaved need to worry about that, and that should concern you. I am sure you have family or friends who are not saved and because of that, the reality of hell should worry you.

Your other comment does not sound too Christ like either, you seem assure of your salvation, but then stand in judgment of another's assured salvation.

35 posted on 02/09/2014 9:02:28 AM PST by LukeL
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To: LostInBayport

Kaesar Sosay (Kevin Spacey)in “The Usual Subjects”. A gem!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnGo6Qm0Wt8


36 posted on 02/09/2014 9:04:19 AM PST by Makana (Self-esteem is the new intelligence. - Greenfield)
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To: LukeL

I have to worry about how God deals with my family? Not MY God.


37 posted on 02/09/2014 9:07:43 AM PST by DManA
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To: LostInBayport

That was Professor Von Helsing telling people about Dracula: “The greatest strength of the vampire lies in the fact that so few people believe he exists.”

(Please don’t get me wrong, I am not promoting vampires).

Regarding the devil, the ridiculous images used to portray him help achieve the same purpose - who could believe in someone who is all red, has horns and a long tail?


38 posted on 02/09/2014 9:08:19 AM PST by Overwatcher
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To: LukeL

The saved will be be held to account too. You didn’t know that?


39 posted on 02/09/2014 9:10:46 AM PST by DManA
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To: P-Marlowe

I’m a Christian, Jesus is my Savior, and yet I’m scared to death of winding up in Hell. My life’s anything but virtuous & perfect, I ask G-d’s forgiveness many times daily yet I’m told that sins repeated are sins unforgiven.

Hell is real and it’s reserved for the afterlife. There are terrible truths and this is one of them.


40 posted on 02/09/2014 9:12:18 AM PST by elcid1970 ("In the modern world, Muslims are living fossils.")
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