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Rick Warren Says Late Son Got Illegal Gun on Internet
ABC News ^ | April 12, 2013 | Arlette Saenz

Posted on 04/12/2013 5:00:21 PM PDT by yongin

Pastor Rick Warren said Thursday that his son, Matthew, purchased an unregistered gun over the Internet. It was that weapon that he used to take his own life last week after years of battling mental illness. "Someone on the internet sold Matthew an unregistered gun. I pray he seeks God's forgiveness. I forgive him. #MATTHEW 6:15," Warren tweeted Thursday. The Orange County Sheriff's Department told the Associated Press it is trying to identify the seller, but the gun's serial number was unreadable, making it difficult to trace the firearm.

(Excerpt) Read more at abcnews.go.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: California
KEYWORDS: banglist; guncontrol; rickwarren; rickwarrenagenda; rickwarrenguns; rickwarrenlost; rickwarrenplatform; rickwarrensonsuicide; secondamendment; wastenotime
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To: Lancey Howard

I think this may be in California...where they register guns.

Odd, their laws didn’t stop this from happening.


51 posted on 04/12/2013 5:27:08 PM PDT by lacrew (Mr. Soetoro, we regret to inform you that your race card is over the credit limit.)
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To: JRandomFreeper

I’ve always wondered, why couldn’t a ne’er-do-well stamp new numbers over the old numbers in the same manner as the original numbers were stamped, thereby leaving authorities unsure which stamp is the original? Or is that equipment unavailable to the general public? You’d think organized crime, at least, could grab hold of it. Or is it simply not worth the trouble, and the stamps don’t mean much if you’re the tenth person, or whatever, down the line to possess the gun?


52 posted on 04/12/2013 5:27:53 PM PDT by Tublecane
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To: yongin

“It was that weapon that he used to take his own life”

Dude offed himself. All I need to know.


53 posted on 04/12/2013 5:28:34 PM PDT by APatientMan (Pick a side)
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To: JRandomFreeper
The FBI has had the ability to read serial numbers that have been ground off with a power grinder, based on the metal deformation in the metal by the number stamps. And they've had that ability for years.

Yep. But what's scary is that anybody gives a rat's ass what the serial number is on a freaking shotgun!?! Maybe it's the same shotgun my Dad carried over his shoulder when he was 12 and walked down his neighborhood street to Pennypack Park to hunt, as passing drivers beeped their horns and waved.

54 posted on 04/12/2013 5:28:43 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: muir_redwoods
I’m pretty sure Cheaper Than Dirt won’t ship w/o an FFL.

Absolutely not!

In fact, here in Michigan, I can't even purchase an air rifle without having it shipped to an FFL dealer here........

55 posted on 04/12/2013 5:29:07 PM PDT by Hot Tabasco (This space for rent)
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To: Lancey Howard
What makes Warren so scary is that he actually believes his own patter, and so do a lot of so-called "conservatives" who are in his Church. That's their idea of being "Christian." Read his "Purpose Driven Life." At bottom, cold and calculating.

It's a showy, ostentatious version of Christianity with a leftist tinge of do-gooder superiority.

56 posted on 04/12/2013 5:34:52 PM PDT by Finny (Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path. -- Psalm 119:105)
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To: SandyInSeattle
was unregistered, had its serial numbers scratched off and was purchased online,

Shotguns do not need to be registered.............

As for purchasing over the internet, I suspect that's bogus too. But what better argument to use if an agency wishes to pursue an agenda to cut down on all internet gun sales?

57 posted on 04/12/2013 5:35:06 PM PDT by Hot Tabasco (This space for rent)
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To: yongin

The media is disgusting? Of course they are, but did you read the part where it states that Rick Warren tweeted
that ‘his son bought an unregistered gun on the internet’?

Mr. Warren I think, would like a place in the media circus
that is “gun violence”.

Many families keep a suicide private. Media whores don’t.


58 posted on 04/12/2013 5:35:25 PM PDT by americas.best.days... ( I think we can now say that they are behind us.)
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To: yongin

Registering a firearm isn’t required if the following is correct:

http://oag.ca.gov/firearms/pubfaqs

State of California Department of Justice
Office of Attorney General

26. How do I know if my firearms need to be registered?

There is no firearm registration requirement in California except for assault weapon owners and personal handgun importers. However, you may submit a Firearm Ownership Record to the DOJ for any firearm you own. Having a Firearm Ownership Record on file with the DOJ may help in the return of your firearm if it is lost or stolen. With very few and specific exceptions, all firearm transactions must be conducted through a firearms dealer.


59 posted on 04/12/2013 5:36:05 PM PDT by deport
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To: Charles Martel
They've gone from the old acid etch to much higher tech, from what I understand, and are getting better and better.

/johnny

60 posted on 04/12/2013 5:36:18 PM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: SandyInSeattle
I believe California requires registration.

It didn't used to, but all purchases by law had to go through licensed dealers. No gun show loophole in that State. Private transfers prohibited. Guns through the mail or shipped, if not to a licensed gun dealer prohibited, intrastate, and both into and out of State, if memory serves well enough.

Since when has the government been able to legally retain gun-buying application info? The USED to have to dispose of it, back when we had enough Senators with spine that demanded it, even as FFL's by law had to retain records.

We need a new President, and a new Senate, with both unafraid to kick the asses of enemies to the Constitution, but with more focus on the domestic enemies. Throw those [expletives deleted] UNDER the jail. Make it painful.

61 posted on 04/12/2013 5:37:02 PM PDT by BlueDragon (...and then i says, "jim"... "he's dead, jim" and we all set our beebers on "stune"...)
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To: yongin

If the kid could have walked into any store in the state and legally purchased a gun (he was 27 with no record), then went home and blew his brains out with it, would we be seeing this story? I don’t think so. Therefore the only purpose in this story is to sway public opinion toward gun control/registration - to create the impression that doing something he could do with any gun is somehow really bad because he did it with an “unregistered” gun (note they are now using the term “registration” frequently instead of “control”). If that is the only purpose, why is Warren, less than one week after the suicide, deeming it so important that he needs to stress the unregistered/Internet connection? Talk amongst yourselves.


62 posted on 04/12/2013 5:37:17 PM PDT by majormaturity
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To: yongin

Who wrote the check for the credit card???? There is the guilty party....


63 posted on 04/12/2013 5:38:35 PM PDT by ptsal (E)
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To: Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America

You are correct. Blame the gun, blame the seller, blame, everyone and everything, but; never face facts reality that you failed,and/or your son failed, or this generation is a failure. My wife’s son and daughter are 28 and 33. The bastards will steal and have stolen everything that it not locked up in our house. I will not let the punks in this house. Some know exactly what I am speaking of as these punks will steal a gold W off a Thai two baht aviator necklace. One stole the W last week.


64 posted on 04/12/2013 5:38:50 PM PDT by Lumper20 (`)
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To: yongin
who cares anymore...who f’king cares...i have had it with this country, our leaders and all of them liars!!!!!!!
where is “A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.”
65 posted on 04/12/2013 5:38:57 PM PDT by ldish (Give me Freedom and Liberty or let's kick some a**!)
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To: yongin

Rick is crazier that an out house rat! He has absolutely no Idea how loony he is.


66 posted on 04/12/2013 5:39:00 PM PDT by JamesA (You don't have to be big to stand tall)
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To: yongin
Although they were required on military firearms and many manufacturers did it anyway, I don't think serial numbers on guns were required by law prior to the Gun Control Act of 1968. The .38 Special cartridge was introduced in 1898. So it's possible the purchase an antique firearm with no serial number that shoots a modern cartridge.

AFAIK, the FBI labs can retrieve practically any serial number unless it's drilled out. I don't believe that "scratching it out" would stop the FBI labs from getting it. So if that is correct, it probably just means the gun was stolen or the seller was naive enough that he thought he could remain unidentified. There are a lot of details to this story that really don't make sense.

67 posted on 04/12/2013 5:39:57 PM PDT by Sooth2222 ("Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of congress. But I repeat myself." M.Twain)
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To: yongin

Next thing we know, the parents of people who slit their wrists are going to be forgiving the sellers of the knives they used to commit suicide.


68 posted on 04/12/2013 5:40:02 PM PDT by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: xrmusn
I am NO fan of the media, but it looks like Warren is ‘using’ the media for this own agenda, of course my BS sensor is going off like a Klaxon Horn on a Crash Diving Submarine. I think if my son had just shot himself one of the last things on my mind would be ‘tweeting’ information pertinent to maybe catching the guy that supplied the gun

Perty much. Warren is a putz, his son's misfortune notwithstanding.

69 posted on 04/12/2013 5:40:36 PM PDT by Finny (Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path. -- Psalm 119:105)
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To: yongin

Could it have possibly been better if the gun was legal?


70 posted on 04/12/2013 5:43:33 PM PDT by RetiredTexasVet (Who you gonna believe .... your lying eyes or the Bureau of Lies & Statistics?)
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To: Marcella
If you decide to kill yourself, it is not your father’s fault.

And it's not the fault of some poor shlub who sold a freaking shotgun over the internet. But it was nice of Rick Warren to "forgive" him.

71 posted on 04/12/2013 5:44:30 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: yongin

Obama Invites Warren to Lead Nation in 2009 Inaugural Prayer

In mid-December 2008, Democratic President-elect Barack Obama invited Rick Warren, conservative evangelical pastor and an ordained Southern Baptist Convention minister, to lead the nation in the January 20, 2009 Inaugural Day Invocation.

Obama bestowed this sacred and historic honor on Warren because, “... a couple of years ago, I was invited to Rick Warren’s church to speak, despite his awareness that I held views that were entirely contrary to his when it came to gay and lesbian rights, when it came to issues like abortion. Nevertheless, I had an opportunity to speak.”

I just put this up here to show how Obama and Warren are friends.So to me that friendship has the liar Warren claiming his son bought the gun the way he did..I don’t trust Warren as far as I can spit and it isn’t far..Warren has a lot of people fooled..

http://usliberals.about.com/od/barackobama/a/ObamaWarren_2.htm


72 posted on 04/12/2013 5:44:33 PM PDT by PLD
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To: yongin

Ok, if it was illegal, then he broke the law, how could more laws help if the ones we have are not enforced. Maybe make it illegal to buy an illegal gun illegally? Makes sense to me.


73 posted on 04/12/2013 5:46:00 PM PDT by ThePatriotsFlag ( EVERY DIME Obama Spends is given to him by the Republicans in the House.)
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To: yongin

Ok, if it was illegal, then he broke the law, how could more laws help if the ones we have are not enforced. Maybe make it illegal to buy an illegal gun illegally? Makes sense to me.


74 posted on 04/12/2013 5:46:00 PM PDT by ThePatriotsFlag ( EVERY DIME Obama Spends is given to him by the Republicans in the House.)
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To: Hot Tabasco

Rick isn’t saying that’s what happened. The police department is saying it.

Apparently I wandered onto the wrong thread. I’ll remedy that now and sign off.

Later.


75 posted on 04/12/2013 5:46:37 PM PDT by SandyInSeattle (The Cardinals chose wisely.)
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To: majormaturity

Gun or rope, about the same on the suicide lethality indexes.


76 posted on 04/12/2013 5:47:32 PM PDT by Chickensoup (200 million unarmed " people killed in the 20th century by Leftist Totalitarian Fascists)
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To: Finny

Thanks for the heads up on Warren. I have heard of the book, but it never crossed my mind to read it. I simply have never trusted televangelists, and I don’t trust Rick Warren. Fact is, I never heard of Rick Warren until reading about him here at FR a few years back. I guess he’s a California phenomenom? I forget, is he the guy with the “Crystal Cathedral” church?


77 posted on 04/12/2013 5:48:19 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: yongin

Totally illegal to buy a gun over the internet without going through an FFL holder, and in California, the sale must be made face to face, both buyer and seller, at the FFL holders business for the transfer to be legal.


78 posted on 04/12/2013 5:49:17 PM PDT by Inyo-Mono (NRA)
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To: AppyPappy
The same way people arrange transactions on Craigslist, except Craigslist is off-limits to weapon sales. Like I said, it may be a forum somewhere such that they arranged to meet and exchange goods for cash. For the seller to avoid being identified by the cops, he would have had to set up a temporary ID and used a disposable phone. All-in-all, too much trouble for a basic shotgun. I suspect they'll locate and identify him in no time, just as the government can locate every single freeper who's posting on these forums while not using a disposable phone from multiple random locations. If the serial numbers were filed off, the seller might be in a world of trouble. Of course, there's no telling who filed the serial number off - the suicide or the seller.
79 posted on 04/12/2013 5:50:13 PM PDT by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: yongin

Simple question if he does “testify.” How would the gun control law in question have prevented the situation your son found himself in?


80 posted on 04/12/2013 5:50:40 PM PDT by ican'tbelieveit
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To: Zhang Fei

If it was a cash transaction, how do they know it happened on the Internet?


81 posted on 04/12/2013 5:51:56 PM PDT by AppyPappy (You never see a massacre at a gun show.)
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To: Tupelo
Actually there is a website (not Gun Broker.com)that allows you to post firearms for sale. I have purchased a couple from people advertising there. One was a dealer, the other a deputy sheriff. I went to the dealer's shop to buy the weapon and met the deputy at a truck stop, where we exchanged information and I purchased the weapon. He showed me his badge and ID card and I showed him my CCW license. All above board.

Not legal in California.

82 posted on 04/12/2013 5:52:29 PM PDT by Inyo-Mono (NRA)
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To: yongin
"Someone on the internet sold Matthew an unregistered gun. I pray he seeks God's forgiveness. I forgive him. #MATTHEW 6:15,"

Why is selling an unregistered gun a sin? If this guy's son bought a friend's car without a title exchange to intentionally drive off a cliff, would the friend be sinning?
83 posted on 04/12/2013 5:56:01 PM PDT by rollo tomasi (Working hard to pay for deadbeats and corrupt politicians.)
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To: AppyPappy
If it was a cash transaction, how do they know it happened on the Internet?

Unless Warren's son crushed his computer's hard drive, there will be a trail of all the websites he visited, along with all the searches he did and the links to all his forum postings. By default, the link to every single one of your forum postings is logged in your browser unless you deliberately turn it off. Even when deleted, they might be recoverable, unless care is taken to overwrite that data with new data (i.e. a zero fill operation).

84 posted on 04/12/2013 5:56:45 PM PDT by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: Zhang Fei

Then I would think it would be easy to trace who sold him the gun.


85 posted on 04/12/2013 5:57:54 PM PDT by AppyPappy (You never see a massacre at a gun show.)
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To: umgud

That is true in CA. Not true in Idaho.


86 posted on 04/12/2013 5:58:58 PM PDT by Myrddin
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To: AppyPappy
Then I would think it would be easy to trace who sold him the gun.

I would think, unless the seller took the precautions I mentioned earlier, which seem a little excessive (and expensive) for selling a basic shotgun, unless he was selling it for many times the legal market price.

87 posted on 04/12/2013 6:00:32 PM PDT by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: Myrddin

Sorry, I was refering to CA. Even sorrier I live with this crap.


88 posted on 04/12/2013 6:02:26 PM PDT by umgud (2A can't survive dem majorities)
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To: Inyo-Mono
the sale must be made face to face, both buyer and seller, at the FFL holders business for the transfer to be legal.

Wow, they are harsh. And stupid.

I've bought firearms from people that didn't know me from Adam, and who I didn't know. My best deals were the .30-30 that I had to re-blue and the double barrel shotgun someome tried to use for a prybar on a stump, and I converted it into a coach gun.

/johnny

89 posted on 04/12/2013 6:02:39 PM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: yongin

The whole idea is to make people think, at least people who don’t think very well, it never would have happened if he had not bought an unregistered gun.

The media pulled the same crap after the JFK assassination. The fact that Oswald bought his gun through the mail was totally irrelevant. He could have bought it legally many other ways but the average idiot thought the whole thing hinged on Oswald buying his rifle through the mail.


90 posted on 04/12/2013 6:05:32 PM PDT by yarddog (Truth, Justice, and what was once the American Way.)
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To: yongin

Well. ask Robert Blake how well filing off the S/N of a gun works?

May God grant Rick Warren, his family including Mathew, forgiveness and peace and understanding after this horrible event.

Mu God have mercy on all their souls.


91 posted on 04/12/2013 6:07:54 PM PDT by Lx (Do you like it, do you like it. Scott? I call it Mr. and Mrs. Tennerman chili.)
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To: deport
Thanks for the link and information.

More gun laws wouldn't have saved the kid, obviously. Besides, if guns are not available, there are numerous other methods just as irrevocably deadly.

92 posted on 04/12/2013 6:08:28 PM PDT by BlueDragon (...and then i says, "jim"... "he's dead, jim" and we all set our beebers on "stune"...)
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To: yongin

I call bullshit, too. You don’t go to the Internet to find a gun with the serial number illegally defaced.


93 posted on 04/12/2013 6:09:47 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (The founding fathers didn't form this country by compromising.)
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To: SandyInSeattle

Wrong. Read rick’s tweet.


94 posted on 04/12/2013 6:12:18 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: SandyInSeattle

“I believe California requires registration. “

Semantics.

Background check results in a de facto registration; paperwork that was supposed to last 90 days, but now lasts “for the life of the gun”.

Long guns are only “long guns”; handguns are identified by serial number, make, caliber, barrel length, color, and more.

This story is full of bogus.


95 posted on 04/12/2013 6:15:54 PM PDT by Scrambler Bob ( Concerning bo -- that refers to the president. If I capitalize it, I mean the dog.)
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To: Lancey Howard
No, the Chrystal Cathedral was IMO a fun televangelist, Robert Schuller, who started out preaching what seems to me a fairly straightforward and honest Gospel to people at a drive-in theater (very big in the 50s) in Southern California in 1955. He made a ton of dough with a wealthy church and built the Cyrystal Cathedral in Anaheim, which has been plagued with misfortune ever since! Ironic because Asian feng shui I think would take one look at that building and say, "What did you expect?" Robert Schuller was, in my opinion, fine with the Gospel.

Warren is a different animal. He presumes to insert himself into politics all the while making it look as if others had made it happen. A very large contingent of politically active "conservatives" belong to his Saddleback Church in Orange County, so you're talking money. Not that Warren spends it on himself -- on the contrary, he's big on Good Works. I read Purpose Driven Life because fate put it in front of me at a perfect time. I read it expecting to find insight into God. I hadn't yet figured out his church's "conservatives" (for example, national talk show host Hugh Hewitt) of Warren's ilk were in fact statists who mistook themselves for conservatives, with all the smug superior "grown-up" uprightness of liberals.

Sure gave me an appreciation of my King James Bible!

96 posted on 04/12/2013 6:18:31 PM PDT by Finny (Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path. -- Psalm 119:105)
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To: yongin

Warren has no credibility with me on any subject. I believe he would lie to support an agenda.


97 posted on 04/12/2013 6:18:41 PM PDT by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, a Matter of Fact, Not a Matter of Opinion)
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To: SandyInSeattle

You have a choice, he’s either lying, or he’s an idiot. You can’t “buy guns” over the internet from any type of dealer without having a check and PROBABLY having it pass through an FFL shop in your state if it’s interstate or in a state requiring a wait.

You could, of course, get in touch with someone on a forum and then meet them FTF and conduct a transaction, for which I find absolutely nothing wrong personally, but which in California would be illegal.

The mere fact that he brought this up publicly indicates some type of willingness to throw this out there to the advancement of someone’s agenda...


98 posted on 04/12/2013 6:21:04 PM PDT by Axenolith (Government blows, and that which governs least, blows least...)
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To: SandyInSeattle

These threads have been a shame.

The man lost his son. Where is the mercy?


99 posted on 04/12/2013 6:22:16 PM PDT by Winstons Julia (Hello OWS? We don't need a revolution like China's; China needs a revolution like OURS.)
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To: SandyInSeattle

No, you just have to do the usual 4473/background check and wait 10 days but that includes individual sales.


100 posted on 04/12/2013 6:26:17 PM PDT by Axenolith (Government blows, and that which governs least, blows least...)
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