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Rick Santorum's 'Involuntary Euthanasia' Claim Outrages Dutch
The International Business ^ | February 20, 2012 | MELANIE JONES

Posted on 02/20/2012 4:56:52 PM PST by BarnacleCenturion

Rick Santorum's claim that the Netherlands advocates mass murder through involuntary euthanasia has prompted a furious backlash from the Western European country, with local news sources calling the Republican a "crazy extreme" candidate making up facts to stir up his political base.

"Rick Santorum Thinks He Knows the Netherlands: Murder of the Elderly on a Grand Scale" fumed the headline of the newspaper NRC Handelsblad on Saturday.

The article references an interview, barely played up by the American press, in which Santorum claims that euthanasia makes up "10 percent of all deaths" in the Netherlands," and that many of those people were essentially murdered by the state.

(Excerpt) Read more at ibtimes.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: cultureofdeath
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To: BarnacleCenturion

The Emperor’s New Clothes. It’s not just a children’s story.


101 posted on 02/20/2012 6:32:42 PM PST by LibWhacker
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To: muawiyah; Christie at the beach; All
"Seriously, are you trying to defend involuntary euthanasia?"

Now if you don't support Sanitarium you support involuntary euthanasia. Get it?

102 posted on 02/20/2012 6:33:10 PM PST by Mariner (War Criminal #18)
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To: BarnacleCenturion
Euthanasia Statistics from 2009 Sharp Growth in Dutch Euthanasia Deaths
103 posted on 02/20/2012 6:34:38 PM PST by Girlene
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To: CainConservative

I wasn’t anti anybody...but that is changing.

Santorum doesn’t have what it takes and he doesn’t ‘get it’.

Gingrich keeps hammering at current issues that are happening daily.


104 posted on 02/20/2012 6:34:38 PM PST by Outlaw Woman (When does the shooting start?)
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To: muawiyah
"Nederland (sic!) is not a place to visit."

I understand you've never visited it. It's a wonderful tourist place to see: Amsterdam, Hague, Delft. Been there, saw them all.

But don't worry, no one will put a gun to your head to visit Netherland.

105 posted on 02/20/2012 6:38:43 PM PST by Marguerite (When I'm good, I am very, very good. But! When I'm bad, I'm even better)
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To: Rational Thought

Good points.


106 posted on 02/20/2012 6:38:43 PM PST by Eric in the Ozarks (Beware the Sweater Vest)
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To: Toespi
That's you ~ not them. Did you realize that until recent times most of our dead were set up in their front room for a viewing ~ and in some groups lots and lots of alcoholic beverage and sandwich consumption.

Imagine that, dead bodies, right in the home!

My great grandfather had a small infant graveyard next to his house where close family members who had an infant die would bury their child.

Mexicans, God bless them, hold picnics in graveyards!

107 posted on 02/20/2012 6:39:15 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: ConfidentConservative
"NOW, after reading the NASTY, Attitudes coming from the Santurom followers on Threads today...."

Santorum and all his followers are all the same. Believe as they do or you are toilette scum.

Personal attacks are their hallmark. They have only the severe lever of moral superiority.

They're the people you endeavor to avoid in your day to day life.

108 posted on 02/20/2012 6:40:16 PM PST by Mariner (War Criminal #18)
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To: dforest

I really am trying to follow you in your last post.

The electric car didn’t bankrupt us. If the Dems where in such a frenzy about throwing our money away the electric car “could” have been a GREAT DREAM.

And the Choo choo’s as you called them ;) are what brought us to the west, for real, and made this country able to expand.
(and there were those calling the idea outrageous at the time)

Newt also talked about the “Wright Brothers” and the Airplane, they had a HUGE DREAM and had many failures, people called them ‘strange’ too. But look what we have today!!!

The point and you actually said it...
We can still think big.

THAT was Newt Gingrich’s point. Obama does not inspire us to think Big when he has shown over and over how much he hates this country.

THAT is where Newt was showing us the difference between him and the big “O”.

The Media, Romney took “the Moon” out of context, completely. BUT Hey! That is what they do!
Now they don’t want Newt Gingrich to debate because they KNOW he will Kick their ARSE!


109 posted on 02/20/2012 6:41:16 PM PST by ConfidentConservative (If my people shall humble themselves and pray,I will hear from Heaven and heal their land.)
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To: chris37
The Obama response to yout' was to extend unemployment benefits. That doesn't work well for folks earning barely above minimum wage in part time seasonal jobs.

Then he gave GM and a cashbonus to the UAW ~ again, not much of a message to yout' who are not union members, nor even eligible to be in a union (most of them have closed entry to unemployed people).

The Republican response has been much more positive. Every candidate has said something about it, and Newt has a solid plan ~ Mitt less so.

Right now the battle is for Republican votes ~ not Democrat votes.

By Mid-summer Republicans will all be campaigning with a unified JOBS script.

110 posted on 02/20/2012 6:44:08 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: Mariner

NO,

“Now if you don’t support Sanitarium you support involuntary euthanasia. Get it? “

Wrong.


111 posted on 02/20/2012 6:45:11 PM PST by ConfidentConservative (If my people shall humble themselves and pray,I will hear from Heaven and heal their land.)
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To: WorkingClassFilth
Netherland's Groningen Protocol Gains Acceptance In America

Yes, it has. According to the Remmelick Report, 8% of patients were euthanized in the Netherlands.

They own this horror. Why are they screaming about it?

112 posted on 02/20/2012 6:47:19 PM PST by TheWriterTX (All in now for Newt Gingrich)
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To: WorkingClassFilth
Netherland's Groningen Protocol Gains Acceptance In America

Yes, it has. According to the Remmelick Report, 8% of patients were euthanized in the Netherlands.

They own this horror. Why are they screaming about it?

113 posted on 02/20/2012 6:47:41 PM PST by TheWriterTX (All in now for Newt Gingrich)
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To: Marguerite
"Most of the reported cases concerned terminal cancer patients."

You mean like when a son gives his father that one last boost of morphine and his father lies wasting away from Pancreatic Cancer? When he's delirious and begging to die? 94lbs a p!ssing black tar into a tube?

Is that euthanasia too? Or is it just plain murder to these folks?

114 posted on 02/20/2012 6:47:57 PM PST by Mariner (War Criminal #18)
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To: Marguerite; BarnacleCenturion; onyx; b9

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2848393/posts ~ Euthanasia is an issue in current French Presidential Race. It is apparently something the big dogs there see as having vote getting value! They will be using Nederland as a bad example ~ both sides of the issue in fact.


115 posted on 02/20/2012 6:48:50 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: Berlin_Freeper
There are a lot of Dutch in Michigan where he is running for the primary. I don't see where he gets elected or even voted for by picking a fight with Holland.
116 posted on 02/20/2012 6:50:59 PM PST by hinckley buzzard
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To: Berlin_Freeper

No, most of the Dutch are in Michigan — the “Pennsylvania Dutch” are more of German (Deutsch) decent.


117 posted on 02/20/2012 6:51:52 PM PST by 353FMG
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To: ConfidentConservative

Apparently the voters didn’t get it because he didn’t win Florida.

I am aware that Romney fights dirty. He has the money to keep it up too. There are things I like about Newt. When he says something that I agree with I am not going to slam him.

Same should be done for Santorum. it is far easier to agree as a conservative that euthanasia is a bad thing than to try to slam the guy for making a point in favor of life. I would assume Newt would agree with him on that as he is a Catholic.

In the end, it will be one of these guys and hopefully not Romney. All this sniping at both of them for not being the other guy is going to take them both out.


118 posted on 02/20/2012 6:52:15 PM PST by dforest
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To: BarnacleCenturion

Was the man born with his foot in his mouth or is it an acquired talent. Geez could we pick a worse candidate to run against OBama in a year dominated by horrible economic issues. Let’s nominate Saint Rick and then run a completely crazy, over the top social issues campaign. That should win us maybe 2-3 states. The OBama people must feel they are the luckiest people in the world. Their two most likely opponents are either the liberal, architect of Obamoney Care or a sanctimonious twit who doesn’t engage his brain before opening his mouth. Sometimes it’s better to be lucky than good and right now OBama looks pretty lucky.


119 posted on 02/20/2012 6:54:48 PM PST by redangus
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To: The Great RJ
Dear Great RJ:

On one point your are mistaken. Dr. Ezekiel Emmanuel is one of the few bioethicists out there arguing AGAINST the "life without life" (Groningen Protocol) being adopted here in the US.

I know Glenn Beck went on a tear over this guy two years ago. Dr. Emmanuel was given a set of parameters for a proposed report, and created that useful life chart. Glenn's reporting overlooked the fact that he didn't advocate for it - but went 100% against it. That was some selective editing on Glenn's part and overlooked the majority of Emmanuel's work advocating FOR LIFE.

Like the Newt Gingrinch "death bed divorce," years later the misinformation remains in the public mind.

120 posted on 02/20/2012 6:56:43 PM PST by TheWriterTX (All in now for Newt Gingrich)
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To: The Great RJ
Dear Great RJ:

On one point your are mistaken. Dr. Ezekiel Emmanuel is one of the few bioethicists out there arguing AGAINST the "life without life" (Groningen Protocol) being adopted here in the US.

I know Glenn Beck went on a tear over this guy two years ago. Dr. Emmanuel was given a set of parameters for a proposed report, and created that useful life chart. Glenn's reporting overlooked the fact that he didn't advocate for it - but went 100% against it. That was some selective editing on Glenn's part and overlooked the majority of Emmanuel's work advocating FOR LIFE.

Like the Newt Gingrinch "death bed divorce," years later the misinformation remains in the public mind.

121 posted on 02/20/2012 6:57:19 PM PST by TheWriterTX (All in now for Newt Gingrich)
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To: Marguerite
“Actually the assisted suicide cases represent 1.2% of all deaths in Netherlands”

Marguarite, that number ( wherever you happened to pull it from) does not include euthanasia deaths or deaths without explicit request or consent. Those numbers are higher than assisted suicide.

Here's a link if you actually want to know the truth.

These statistics are from 2009, so wth the trend that was occurring prior to 2009, I imagine the numbers are higher by now.

Sharp Growth in Dutch Euthanasia Deaths

........."The number of reported euthanasia deaths has grown significantly. In 2008 there were 2331 reported deaths, in 2007 there were 2120 reported deaths, in 2006 there were 1923 reported deaths, and in 2003 there were 1815 reported deaths.

The number of deaths by euthanasia continues to escalate. Consider the fact that the 2005 official study of euthanasia in the Netherlands indicated that 7.1% of all deaths were by sedation and dehydration. These are often euthanasia deaths because the death is direct and intentional and the method of death is dehydration. A 2007 report suggested that up to 10% of all deaths in the Netherlands were by sedation and dehydration."...............

Santorum was right.
122 posted on 02/20/2012 6:59:10 PM PST by Girlene (Parlez-vous francais?)
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To: Toespi

So... you’ve never been to a wake or an open casket funeral?

Nothing fundamentally different about what Rick did when his family lost a child.


123 posted on 02/20/2012 6:59:37 PM PST by rwilson99 (Please tell me how the words "shall not perish and have everlasting life" would NOT apply to Mary.)
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To: Marguerite; BarnacleCenturion; onyx; b9

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/8466996/Fearful-elderly-people-carry-anti-euthanasia-cards.html ~ the assisted suicide debate in United Kingdom was underway at the time this article was published. The thing is EUTHANASIA is not Assisted Suicide. Nederland has 2700+ ACTS OF EUTHANASIA ~ which is where your doctor or nurse just flat out kills you like an animal. They had 21 cases of EUTHANASIA that didn’t involve any sort of permission, implied or otherwise last year. Don’t try to trick us by confounding Suicide, Assisted Suicide, Euthanasia, Involuntary Euthanasia and Murder when reporting these statistics.


124 posted on 02/20/2012 7:00:53 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: Marguerite
“Actually the assisted suicide cases represent 1.2% of all deaths in Netherlands”

Marguarite, that number ( wherever you happened to pull it from) does not include euthanasia deaths or deaths without explicit request or consent. Those numbers are higher than assisted suicide.

Here's a link if you actually want to know the truth.

These statistics are from 2009, so wth the trend that was occurring prior to 2009, I imagine the numbers are higher by now.

Sharp Growth in Dutch Euthanasia Deaths

........."The number of reported euthanasia deaths has grown significantly. In 2008 there were 2331 reported deaths, in 2007 there were 2120 reported deaths, in 2006 there were 1923 reported deaths, and in 2003 there were 1815 reported deaths.

The number of deaths by euthanasia continues to escalate. Consider the fact that the 2005 official study of euthanasia in the Netherlands indicated that 7.1% of all deaths were by sedation and dehydration. These are often euthanasia deaths because the death is direct and intentional and the method of death is dehydration. A 2007 report suggested that up to 10% of all deaths in the Netherlands were by sedation and dehydration."...............

Santorum was right.
125 posted on 02/20/2012 7:01:18 PM PST by Girlene (Parlez-vous francais?)
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To: Mariner
I have a question to Santorum and YOU:

HOW is relevant to the present Republican nomination campaign in America what's happening in far away Netherlands?

FYI, here's a journalistic scoop: Santorum is not running either for Pope or for president of Netherland!

I have yet to hear him presenting his plans for redressing the economy and create jobs in America.

126 posted on 02/20/2012 7:01:31 PM PST by Marguerite (When I'm good, I am very, very good. But! When I'm bad, I'm even better)
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To: austinaero
We began worrying about it a lot when the Dutch slipped down just a little bit more on the slippery slide ~ by approving INVOLUNTARY EUTHANASIA!

This problem has been brought up in the French Presidential race as well.

127 posted on 02/20/2012 7:03:34 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: dforest

NOW we are on the same page! And I agree with you!

Why do some posters feel it is necessary to call other Good Freepers “Liberals, baby killers, and for killing the elderly” because they are not voting for “their guy”.

That kind of thing causes people to not want to vote for that “guy” later because of the hard feelings being created.

And I think there are real “trolls” that show up to cause discord. (not saying anyone on this thread is one.)
I have read one TODAY though, on another thread, that I am sure was doing that exact thing.

Be Sure, dforest, I am willing to share my point of view and do my very best not to “Bite” the person communicating to me.


128 posted on 02/20/2012 7:04:00 PM PST by ConfidentConservative (If my people shall humble themselves and pray,I will hear from Heaven and heal their land.)
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To: Marguerite
The new protocol (from 2002) came about as a result of the Remmelick Report, which showed that 8.9% of patients were involuntarily euthanized.

Google the Groningen Protocol, which outlines the steps for purposefully withholding treatment from newborns and preemies to ensure their demise.

In short, Santorum was correct.

129 posted on 02/20/2012 7:05:21 PM PST by TheWriterTX (All in now for Newt Gingrich)
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To: Girlene

I’m not going to start a war on numbers.

Whatever you say, whatever Santorum says, it has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the primary campaign. Rick is going crazy, that’s all I see.


130 posted on 02/20/2012 7:05:43 PM PST by Marguerite (When I'm good, I am very, very good. But! When I'm bad, I'm even better)
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To: chris37

Young folks don’t vote.

The Tampa Campus of the Univ. of South Florida has over 1100 registered voters.

Fewer than 20 voted in the midterm elections.


131 posted on 02/20/2012 7:06:38 PM PST by rwilson99 (Please tell me how the words "shall not perish and have everlasting life" would NOT apply to Mary.)
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To: Mariner
You need to knock the corners off that block head of yours. EVERYONE here knows I'm supporting Gingrich ~ but that doesn't mean I approve of your argument that struck me as support of Euthanasia ~ and in this case INVOLUNtary Euthanasia.

That's what this is about ~ not assisted suicide ~ but the case where the doctor does the killing.

BTW, never, ever trust anyone to treat you who ever practiced in Nederland or Belgium. Supposedly only 66% of their physicians refuse to kill people ~ which means the odds are real good the Nelanderishe Physician treating you might well murder you.

132 posted on 02/20/2012 7:09:26 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: Marguerite
It matters because if Obamacare stands, bioethics panels will be determining your life and death in the exact same manner.

67% of Doctors here in the US are now finding the Groningen Protocol an acceptable standard for determining patient care.

But, hey, since you don't care, just pray that you don't get sick.

133 posted on 02/20/2012 7:11:33 PM PST by TheWriterTX (All in now for Newt Gingrich)
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To: Outlaw Woman

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2849048/posts

Ok Outlaw woman. This is why I think having morals is important. This is in England but it happens ALL THE TIME in America too. I just will not support a candidate who does not speak out against the evils of the devil. I just won’t. Social issues are EXTREMELY important. Santorum is fine in his economics but his social issues are superior and that is gratifying in todays cess pool.


134 posted on 02/20/2012 7:11:59 PM PST by napscoordinator (A moral principled Christian with character is the frontrunner! Congrats Santorum!)
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To: Marguerite

“Actually the assisted suicide cases represent 1.2% of all deaths in Netherlands

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euthanasia_in_the_Netherlands";

Yes, and unemployment is 8.3 % and Obama is going to cut the deficit in half and the Stimulus created 300 billion jobs.

You believe everything you find on FactCheck and Wikipedia?

You think the Dutch government would admit that 10% of the deaths are euthanasia? If the Dutch government admits 1.2 % you can be darn sure the real amount is much higher.

My guess is that a qualifier was missing — 10% of hospital deaths, perhaps. Santorum may have goofed but not in any significant way. That the Dutch are angry at him only indicates who much they’ve invested in lying to themselves about how principled and limited their euthanasia program really is.

Santorum probably was basing himself on an estimate by pro-life analysts trying to get to the real number through the fog of Dutch government stats.


135 posted on 02/20/2012 7:13:11 PM PST by Houghton M.
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To: Marguerite
Spent an awful lot of time there ~ believe it or not ~ and had two American friends there on business who had minor heart attacks and died on the way to the hospital. All of us suspected they didn't just die.

You have a mess there. No rational human being should visit the place.

What's going on is you make it look pretty and peaceful, but lurking beneath the polite exterior is a seething cauldron of death and destruction seeking out the innocent.

136 posted on 02/20/2012 7:13:57 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: Mariner

I am really concerned with Rick’s apparent inability to walk away from or even see the trap being laid for him. In fact, he just walks further into it while they shut and lock the door behind him.

I think he needs to be politically wiser than this if he intends to win the general election. Certainly, he can get conservative support on issue such as these, but I personally do not know how this stuff will aid him in the general.

If his interviewers continue to direct him down this path, then he needs to redirect the interviewer. He is being painted as a zealot.


137 posted on 02/20/2012 7:15:26 PM PST by chris37 (Heartless.)
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To: Marguerite

I have a question for YOU.

Why are you so interested in meddling in our US elections, Marguerite? It’s one thing to be interested, it’s another to come on EVERY Santorum thread and ridicule him.....post after post after post.


138 posted on 02/20/2012 7:16:01 PM PST by Girlene
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To: muawiyah
"BTW, never, ever trust anyone to treat you who ever practiced in Nederland or Belgium. Supposedly only 66% of their physicians refuse to kill people ~ which means the odds are real good the Nelanderishe Physician treating you might well murder you. "

Spend some time around the cancer wards of the VA hospitals. There's a lot of guys in there that say they always believed they'd be able to "take care of it myself if it comes to that". Problem is many find themselves in a hospital with no gun.

The problem is USUALLY solved by a family member in the final hours...when all restrictions on "the button" are removed...almost ceremoniously... by the nurse.

If folks count this as euthanasia then it's likely 10% or more of all deaths in the USA are euthanasia. And very, very few people would eliminate this protocol.

139 posted on 02/20/2012 7:16:49 PM PST by Mariner (War Criminal #18)
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To: Girlene

Instead of wasting your time online counting the dead in Netherlands, WATCH THIS to learn what’s to be done in order to redress America’s prosperity, personal freedom and the country greatness:

http://electad.com/videos/newt-gingrich-town-hall-at-oru-tulsa-oklahoma-february-20-2012/


140 posted on 02/20/2012 7:17:04 PM PST by Marguerite (When I'm good, I am very, very good. But! When I'm bad, I'm even better)
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To: Houghton M.
You are hitting it on the head when it comes to the Dutch government hiding statistics. They even lie to themselves in their census ~ has to do with the subtle way they count "white folks" ~ if your mother is of East Asian origin, you are counted one way. If your father is of East Asian origin, you are counted another way.

Most Dutch are blissfully unaware of that differentiation in their laws regarding ethnic counting. Their immigration laws for Indonesians differ depending on whether or not your pa was Dutch or Indonesian.

Here we have a Dutch defender who does not want anybody to notice that EUTHANASIA is a considerably different act than ASSISTED SUICIDE, and certainly of a whole different order from INVOLUNTARY EUTHANASIA.

No civilized nation should allow involuntary euthanasia (aka MURDER) to go unpunished. Actually no nation that wants to be thought civilized should allow physicians to kill their patients.

141 posted on 02/20/2012 7:19:52 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: Girlene

He’s ridiculing himself. It makes easier for anyone to laugh at him.


142 posted on 02/20/2012 7:19:52 PM PST by Marguerite (When I'm good, I am very, very good. But! When I'm bad, I'm even better)
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To: Marguerite

‘Schadenberg also said a 2007 report showed about 10 percent of all deaths in The Netherlands were related to terminal sedation. “Many of those deaths were caused by dehydration, due to the physician sedating the patient and then withholding hydration until death occurs, which usually takes 10 [to] 14 days,” he said.’

http://erlc.com/article/life-digest-dutch-euthanasia-cases-increase/

From a prior post... these must be the HOMICIDES Santorum is referring to.


143 posted on 02/20/2012 7:19:52 PM PST by rwilson99 (Please tell me how the words "shall not perish and have everlasting life" would NOT apply to Mary.)
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To: Mariner

This is precious, coming from someone who knows how do do nasty better than most.

Kiss your man Newt for me, next time you see him.


144 posted on 02/20/2012 7:20:34 PM PST by Houghton M.
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To: muawiyah

None of the people I am speaking of need jobs. My brother and his circle of friends did things right, and they are well to do as a result, they are in the 1%.

What they are looking for is someone they are comfortable voting for, and as much as I HATE to say this, that person right now is Mitt Romney. However, it doesn’t look like Romney is going to get the nomination at this time, so if it’s Rick, he is going to have to do something to calm their concerns about how he comes across on social issues.

I’m not sure how that is done, but I know he isn’t doing it now.

I am still holding out hope that Newt pulls this out somehow, because to me he comes across as the most well reasoned person able to best communicate conservative principles at this time, but for whatever reason, he is struggling.


145 posted on 02/20/2012 7:20:58 PM PST by chris37 (Heartless.)
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To: TheWriterTX

Because the majority cannot, or will not, recall what has been documented. You have and FR has but little else in our information system has the brains, integrity or interest. They’re killers and they have the amnesia of the public going for them.

BTW, can’t side with you on Newton.


146 posted on 02/20/2012 7:22:00 PM PST by WorkingClassFilth (I'm for Churchill in 1940!)
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To: Mariner
Euthenasia is when your doctor (or nurse) shoots you up with a drug intended to kill you.

There's a line between pain control and euthanasia. Trained professionals (and the control unit behind that little pain medication button) know the difference.

What we are talking about is how many people are killed by their doctors.

147 posted on 02/20/2012 7:23:03 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: Marguerite
I’m not going to start a war on numbers.

No one declared war; you're numbers weren't correct regarding euthanasia. If you don't want to discuss numbers, don't quote them.

Rick is going crazy, that’s all I see.

When all else fails, slander the candidate?

Again, I ask, why are you meddling in our elections?
148 posted on 02/20/2012 7:24:10 PM PST by Girlene
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To: BarnacleCenturion

Piss off, Hans. GO RICK GO!!!


149 posted on 02/20/2012 7:26:34 PM PST by Frank_2001
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To: chris37

Has it not once occurred to you that you are getting Santorum filtered through MSM?

That there is a coordinated effort underway by the Democrats to highlight what their liberal contracepting aborting euthanizing death-lover base fear most?

Did it not occur to you that Romney is making common cause with the Dims in order to get Santorum?

Did it not occur to you that Santorum just migt NOT be a one-trick social-issues pony but that he is being portrayed that way by his enemies
and
that
you
fell
for
it?

There was a time when FReepers prided themselves on being able to cut through the excrement and figure out “the rest of the story.”

But Newt-bots on this thread are swallowing the MSM line on this without hesitation.

What a bunch of naifs.


150 posted on 02/20/2012 7:27:05 PM PST by Houghton M.
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