Posted on 03/14/2010 6:03:40 AM PDT by Kaslin
It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer or the baker that we expect our dinner, but from their regard to their own interest. … Nobody but a beggar chooses to depend chiefly upon the benevolence of his fellow-citizens. -- Adam Smith, The Wealth of Nations
Consider the economics of an organ transplant. Everyone involved gets something of value. The doctors and nurses are paid. The hospital receives money. The organ recipient gets something that will save her life. And the person donating the organ gets a nice, warm feeling inside.
We can all admire the selflessness of the donor. But if pure altruism is such a wonderful motivator, why don't we rely on it to get medical professionals to provide their services?
Simple: Because we would find that there are far more people demanding free care than people supplying it. To make sure that we can obtain the treatments we need, we elect to pay, not hope. It's too important to rely on altruism.
Our approach changes, though, when it comes to procuring kidneys and livers. In fact, since 1984, it has been illegal to pay someone to surrender a body part, even posthumously. Campaigns to browbeat Americans into signing organ donor cards, however, haven't sufficed. The transplant organ shortage has grown.
Since 1989, kidney donations have doubled. But the number of patients in need of them is five times higher than it was then. Last year, 4,456 people died while waiting for a kidney transplant. The story with livers follows the same line.
(Excerpt) Read more at townhall.com ...
Thank you Mr. Chapman! I have, with less public reach, beaten this drum for nealy 20 years.
Everybody else in the “food chain” exchanges money. The doctor is paid, the hospital is paid, the drug makers are paid, patients and their insurers pay, but somehow it is “immoral” to compensate donors? Somehow, since it relates to a purely elective procedure, I can be paid market rate to masturbate for dollars, but a kidney or marrow donation, way more inconvenient, the recipient can’t even give me gas money?
And what of the “donations” that can only come from the deceased, heart, lung, liver etc. ? I’m not talking E-bay auctions, but perhaps a flat payment of enough money to pay for a funeral or asurviving child’s college tuition would encourage donations, save lives, and spread among multiple tranplant procedures, increase the cost minimally. Allocate the money through a self-replenishing fund and payments through the organ bank now existing.
Our pursuit of moral purity in donations is costing thousands of reallives every year.
I heard a strange, but I think accurate analogy, to paid for organ donations. College football, and the absolute unwillingness of colleges to pay student athletes who bring in millions of dollars to their programs.
The vast majority of such students will never become pro athletes, yet face grueling training, injury and disability, resulting in enormous sums of money to their schools. But all of these schools panic when faced with the idea of actually compensating students for these huge profits.
It used to be anathema to pay for blood or plasma donations, but the demand was so high, that a nominal fee was agreed to, just enough for someone desperate for cash to try. The same, on a much larger scale, with human egg donations, which involves real surgery.
So eventually, I can imagine organ donations made for profit, and even people signing agreements that if they die in such a way that their organs become available, that their families receive payment in exchange.
While the government may not permit that at first, eventually *a* government will, which will start “organ transfer tourism.”
Walter Williams has also been an outspoken proponent of this for some time, and I have to agree with his argument. There are three basic tenets to ownership, posession, use and disposal. If a government controls these, do you truly own yourself, and are you truly free? I would much rather my religion (which I voluntarily subscribe to) tell me what I can and can’t do with my body, than a government which I may or may not agree with, and will use force to make me comply with its rules.
With organ transplants, you get the same kind of incentive to get organs where ever you can without worrying about ethics. here.
The libertarian point of view that consensual trade is always positive forgets to note that non-consensual trade is very lucrative.
If people were perfect, or even perfectable, we could live in a Libertarian world. But they aren't.
If you look at any economic exchange there is the potential for robbery and ‘non-consensual trade’ as you put it.
We have factories, and we also have sweat shops where immigrants or kids are forced to work for nothing.
Your argument could be applied to literally anything.
Don’t worry our government will be deciding who is brain dead soon, so they can harvest organs.
Don’t forget they can arm twist the RINOS as well as their own.
Defeat Obamacare call list: List now contains the new MAYBES culled from FR posts. Be sure to call KNOWN RINOS too.
KEEP THE CALLS UP! DC OFFICE LOCAL OFFICE
Code Red” - House Target List on Health Care
The National Republican Congressional Committee has published a target list on health care. In addition to continuing to contact the five Tennessee Democrat Congressmen, you can go http://www.votervoice.net/link/clickthrough/ext/94697.aspx to contact some of these targets. Much of the talk following Obama’s announcement has focused on how to defeat this second bill through reconciliation, but that is misleading because the first step to defeating Obamacare is not by concentrating on defeating the “fixer” bill but by defeating the Senate bill in the House when it goes to the floor for an up-or-down vote on Thursday, March 18th.
Rep. Lincoln Davis 202-225-6831 Columbia office: 931-490-8699
Rep. Jim Cooper 202-225-4311 Nashville office: 615-736-5295
Rep. Bart Gordon 202-225-4231 Murfreesboro office: 615-896-1986
John Tanner (202) 225-4714, Union City, (731) 885-7070, Jackson Phone: (731) 423-4848, Millington (901) 873-5690 TN (MAYBE)
Rep. Steve Cohen 202-225-3265 Memphis office: 901-544-4131
Harry Mitchell (202) 225-2190 (480) 946-2411 AZ 5th District
Gabrielle Giffords (202) 225-2542 (520) 881-3588 AZ 8th District
Ann Kirkpatrick (202) 225-2315 (928) 226-6914 AZ 1st District
Jerry McNerney (202) 225-1947 925-833-0643 CA 11th District
John Salazar 202-225-4761 970-245-7107 CO 3rd District
Jim Himes (202) 225-5541 (866) 453-0028 CT 4th District
Alan Grayson (202) 225-2176 (407) 841-1757 FL 8th District
Bill Foster (202) 225-2976 630-406-1114 IL 14th District
Baron Hill 202 225 5315 812 288 3999 IN 9th District
Mark Schauer (202) 225-6276 (517) 780-9075 MI 7th District
Gary Peters (202) 225-5802 (248) 273-4227 MI 9th District
Dina Titus (202) 225-3252 702-256-DINA (3462) NV 3rd District
Carol Shea-Porter (202) 225-5456 (603) 743-4813 NH 1st District
Tim Bishop (202) 225-3826 (631) 696-6500 NY 1st District
John Hall (202) 225-5441 (845) 225-3641 x49371 NY 19th District
Bill Owens (202) 225-4611 (315) 782-3150 NY 23rd District
James Matheson Toll-Free Number 1 (877) 677-9743 (202) 225-3011Mike Arcuri (202)225-3665 (315)793-8146 NY 24th District
Dan Maffei (202) 225-3701 (315) 423-5657 NY 25th District
Earl Pomeroy (202) 225-2611 (701) 224-0355 ND At-Large District
Steven Driehaus (202) 225-2216 (513) 684-2723 OH 1st District
Mary Jo Kilroy (202) 225-2015 (614) 294-2196 OH 15th District
Zach Space (202) 225-6265 (330) 364-4300 OH 18th District
Kathy Dahlkemper (202) 225-5406 (814) 456-2038 PA 3rd District
Patrick Murphy (202) 225-4276 (215) 826-1963 PA 8th District
Christopher Carney (202) 225-3731 (570) 585-9988 PA 10th District
Paul Kanjorski (202) 225-6511 (570) 825-2200 PA 11th District
John Spratt (202) 225-5501 (803)327-1114 SC 5th District
Tom Perriello (202) 225-4711 (276) 656-2291 VA 5th District
Alan Mollohan (202) 225-4172 (304) 623-4422 WVA 1st District
Nick Rahall (202) 225-3452 (304) 252-5000 WVA 3rd District
Steve Kagen (202) 225-5665 (920) 437-1954 WI 8th District
Bart Stupak (202) 225 4735 MI (MAYBE)
Brian Baird (202) 225-3536, Vancouver, (360) 695-6292. Olympia, (360) 352-9768, (MAYBE)
senator mark begich (202) 224-3004 toll free. (877) 501 - 6275 just became a MAYBE
Jason Altmire 202-225-2565, Aliquippa, 724-378-0928,
Natrona Heights, 724-226-1304 (MAYBE)
On the Bubble (Major developments from the “yes” and “no” columns in the House)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2467046/posts
Congressional Dems on Twitter
http://www.arrghpaine.com/congressional-dems-on-twitter
And here are toll-free numbers we can use to call any Senators or Reps.
At the first number below you must wait through a tape recording urging you to tell your Rep or Senator to vote “yes” for the health care bill. Just hang on and when the recording is over, you will get the Capitol operator. Just ask for your Rep or Senator’s office. Then you will either talk to an aid or have the chance to leave a message for him/her to vote NO on the health care bill.
When you use the second number and the Capitol operator comes on, just ask for your Rep or Senator’s office. Every time I use this number I get the Rep or Senator’s answer machine, so it may be set up that way all the time...to go to their answer machine. Either way you can leave a message to vote NO on the health care bill!
We need to use these toll free numbers that have been set up for the health care/ BO supporters and illegals to use! After all they are FREE!
1-800-828-0498
1-866-220-0044 Defeat Obamacare call list: List now contains the new MAYBES culled from FR posts. Be sure to call KNOWN RINOS too.
KEEP THE CALLS UP! DC OFFICE LOCAL OFFICE
Code Red” - House Target List on Health Care
The National Republican Congressional Committee has published a target list on health care. In addition to continuing to contact the five Tennessee Democrat Congressmen, you can go http://www.votervoice.net/link/clickthrough/ext/94697.aspx to contact some of these targets. Much of the talk following Obama’s announcement has focused on how to defeat this second bill through reconciliation, but that is misleading because the first step to defeating Obamacare is not by concentrating on defeating the “fixer” bill but by defeating the Senate bill in the House when it goes to the floor for an up-or-down vote on Thursday, March 18th.
Rep. Lincoln Davis 202-225-6831 Columbia office: 931-490-8699
Rep. Jim Cooper 202-225-4311 Nashville office: 615-736-5295
Rep. Bart Gordon 202-225-4231 Murfreesboro office: 615-896-1986
John Tanner (202) 225-4714, Union City, (731) 885-7070, Jackson Phone: (731) 423-4848, Millington (901) 873-5690 TN (MAYBE)
Rep. Steve Cohen 202-225-3265 Memphis office: 901-544-4131
Harry Mitchell (202) 225-2190 (480) 946-2411 AZ 5th District
Gabrielle Giffords (202) 225-2542 (520) 881-3588 AZ 8th District
Ann Kirkpatrick (202) 225-2315 (928) 226-6914 AZ 1st District
Jerry McNerney (202) 225-1947 925-833-0643 CA 11th District
John Salazar 202-225-4761 970-245-7107 CO 3rd District
Jim Himes (202) 225-5541 (866) 453-0028 CT 4th District
Alan Grayson (202) 225-2176 (407) 841-1757 FL 8th District
Bill Foster (202) 225-2976 630-406-1114 IL 14th District
Baron Hill 202 225 5315 812 288 3999 IN 9th District
Mark Schauer (202) 225-6276 (517) 780-9075 MI 7th District
Gary Peters (202) 225-5802 (248) 273-4227 MI 9th District
Dina Titus (202) 225-3252 702-256-DINA (3462) NV 3rd District
Carol Shea-Porter (202) 225-5456 (603) 743-4813 NH 1st District
Tim Bishop (202) 225-3826 (631) 696-6500 NY 1st District
John Hall (202) 225-5441 (845) 225-3641 x49371 NY 19th District
Bill Owens (202) 225-4611 (315) 782-3150 NY 23rd District
James Matheson Toll-Free Number 1 (877) 677-9743 (202) 225-3011Mike Arcuri (202)225-3665 (315)793-8146 NY 24th District
Dan Maffei (202) 225-3701 (315) 423-5657 NY 25th District
Earl Pomeroy (202) 225-2611 (701) 224-0355 ND At-Large District
Steven Driehaus (202) 225-2216 (513) 684-2723 OH 1st District
Mary Jo Kilroy (202) 225-2015 (614) 294-2196 OH 15th District
Zach Space (202) 225-6265 (330) 364-4300 OH 18th District
Kathy Dahlkemper (202) 225-5406 (814) 456-2038 PA 3rd District
Patrick Murphy (202) 225-4276 (215) 826-1963 PA 8th District
Christopher Carney (202) 225-3731 (570) 585-9988 PA 10th District
Paul Kanjorski (202) 225-6511 (570) 825-2200 PA 11th District
John Spratt (202) 225-5501 (803)327-1114 SC 5th District
Tom Perriello (202) 225-4711 (276) 656-2291 VA 5th District
Alan Mollohan (202) 225-4172 (304) 623-4422 WVA 1st District
Nick Rahall (202) 225-3452 (304) 252-5000 WVA 3rd District
Steve Kagen (202) 225-5665 (920) 437-1954 WI 8th District
Bart Stupak (202) 225 4735 MI (MAYBE)
Brian Baird (202) 225-3536, Vancouver, (360) 695-6292. Olympia, (360) 352-9768, (MAYBE)
senator mark begich (202) 224-3004 toll free. (877) 501 - 6275 just became a MAYBE
Jason Altmire 202-225-2565, Aliquippa, 724-378-0928,
Natrona Heights, 724-226-1304 (MAYBE)
On the Bubble (Major developments from the “yes” and “no” columns in the House)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2467046/posts
Congressional Dems on Twitter
http://www.arrghpaine.com/congressional-dems-on-twitter
And here are toll-free numbers we can use to call any Senators or Reps.
At the first number below you must wait through a tape recording urging you to tell your Rep or Senator to vote “yes” for the health care bill. Just hang on and when the recording is over, you will get the Capitol operator. Just ask for your Rep or Senator’s office. Then you will either talk to an aid or have the chance to leave a message for him/her to vote NO on the health care bill.
When you use the second number and the Capitol operator comes on, just ask for your Rep or Senator’s office. Every time I use this number I get the Rep or Senator’s answer machine, so it may be set up that way all the time...to go to their answer machine. Either way you can leave a message to vote NO on the health care bill!
We need to use these toll free numbers that have been set up for the health care/ BO supporters and illegals to use! After all they are FREE!
1-800-828-0498
1-866-220-0044
So, build a fence on the southern border.
I'm not aware of true slavery in the sweatshops in the USA, but certainly some pay less than minimum wage.
Are you folks willing to live with a little slavery to get a bit of longer life? How much are you willing to tolerate?
One thing about sweatshops, when you do find them and shut them down, the victims are still alive.
And with the sex trade in England, it looks like a fair percentage of the workers are coerced. You can't say that about the general work force.
I’ll bet the solution to this is quite simple and cheap.
If one agrees to organ donation with one’s drivers license, wave the license fee, or maybe even pay a nominal amount. The actuarial odds that one would actually become an organ donor is commensurate with such a remuneration. The state would be reimbursed by the hospitals for donor licenses issued, not organs actually harvested. The actual rebate amount would be determined by what a statewide hospital pool was willing to pay in the aggregate. It would be like insurance in reverse and not incentivize any Frankenstein scenarios.
All potential donors benefit, the hospitals and recipients benefit and the state would be entitled to a percentage, say 10% or 20% of the hospital pool payments.
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