I would dispute that assumption................
Posted on 09/19/2007 3:45:17 PM PDT by Dysart
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The earliest-known human ancestors to migrate out of Africa possessed a surprising mix of human-like and primitive features, according to scientists who studied remains dug up at a fossil-rich site in the former Soviet republic of Georgia.
Writing on Wednesday in the journal Nature, the scientists described remains of three adults and one adolescent dating from about 1.77 million years ago, excavated at Dmanisi, about 55 miles southwest of the Georgian capital, Tbilisi.
The remains shed light on a little-understood but critical period in human evolution -- the transition from the more ape-like creatures known as australopithecines to the genus Homo, of which modern humans are a member.
The spines and lower limbs found at the Dmanisi site appear very much like modern humans, suggesting these individuals, which walked fully upright, were highly capable of long-distance treks, the researchers said.
But other aspects of the skeletons had more archaic characteristics. The arms were more like australopithecines than people, and the primitive skulls encased relatively small brains. Their simple stone tools also are less advanced than one might have expected, the researchers said.
They described the remains as "a surprising mosaic" of primitive and modern features.
"These are the earliest humans found outside of Africa. This is the time when our genus spread outside of Africa," David Lordkipanidze of the Georgian National Museum, who led the research, said in a telephone interview. "Their heads are primitive. Their legs are very human-like."
Scientists had previously described skulls found at the site, but in recent years found far more extensive remains of the skeletons of these creatures, giving them a more detailed understanding of these denizens of early human history.
DANGER LURKS
Also found at the site were remains of other animals that lived alongside these human ancestors, including saber-toothed cats that might have feasted on these human ancestors, primitive elephants, ostriches and giraffes.
Evidence at the site, the researchers said, suggested that these creatures were meat eaters, either hunting for their dinner or scavenging carcasses killed by other animals. They were relatively small, about 4.9 feet tall.
The paleontological site at Dmanisi was found during explorations at the ruins of a medieval castle in the 1990s.
There is a dispute over what species these individuals represent -- whether, for example, they are a very primitive member of Homo erectus or their own new species.
"Before these finds, it was considered that the humans who left Africa should have had completely human-like bodies, more human-like proportions and bigger brains," Lordkipanidze said.
Harvard University anthropologist Daniel Lieberman, who wrote a commentary accompanying the study, said the human evolutionary events unfolding at about the time these individuals lived were very important.
"We go from creatures that essentially were chimps that walked upright to creatures that begin to be like us," Lieberman said in a telephone interview.
"That transition to our genus didn't occur really rapidly, all of a sudden, in one great huge burst," he added. "Instead, that transformation wa
I would dispute that assumption................
YEC INTREP
“1.77 million years ago”
How in the heck do they know this? I mean, how long do things really last? Why not say 1 freakin’ million years? Why not 10 thousand years? I just can’t wrap my brain around this.
Ancient Democrats, no doubt.
Because by saying 1.77 million years they think they sound legit. Of course, as they try filling in the gaps they got to squeeze this stuff in somewhere. Guess they put their peer heads together and vote on it.
Nice picture of Sen. Hairy Reid.
Was that an anti-neanderthal epithet?............I am offended!..........Rioting and burning of cars to commence immediately!.............
They know this because radio metric dating is extremely accurate. There isn't the space or the time to go over it in detail here, but you might as well ask how do they know how far away the stars are. Suffice it to say that an understanding of the sciences of chemistry and physics have given us the tools to figure these things out very accurately.
(and no I don't care to debate it right now, and yes I am a devout Christian)
Probably by looking at their place in the geologic column, which has been dated radiometrically. Maybe someone with a Nature subscription can give us a better answer?
I mean, how long do things really last?
At least 1.77 million years, I guess.
Why not say 1 freakin’ million years?
Because that would be about 770 thousand years off. A more technical paper would also give a margin of error, but this is only Reuters.
Why not 10 thousand years? I just can’t wrap my brain around this.
Ten thousand years would be even more off. Wrapping one's brain around big numbers is hard--that's how Congress gets away with spending what they do. Few people have a concept of what a million, a billion, a trillion are. Mathematically, one knows they exist, but the implication of the number is often ignored or rejected--perhaps because it's so difficult to picture, it's so far outside the numbers we usually count and experience in some tangible form.
As for the article, this is curious. Neanderthals are theorized to have had larger brains than us but less useful legs, but this erectus or proto-erectus had good legs and a tiny brain.
This could be a partial explanation for Joseph Stalin.
Humans and Neanderthals separated something like 400,000+ years ago, and in that time they evolved in slightly different directions. Their brain cases were indeed slightly larger than our own. If I remember the details correctly, their muscles seem to have attached slightly differently, providing stronger arms and legs, but they probably sacrificed speed for that extra power.
“Their heads are primitive. Their legs are very human-like.”
Where have I heard this song before? Piltdown, maybe?
What they are talking about is homo erectus that was found in Georgia.
Homo sapiens sapiens, our line, came out of Africa about 90,000 BC. Homo sapiens sapiens did not, evidently, descent from homo erectus but we evolved independently in Africa.
The writer of this article is very confused.
The Oldest Hominid Site Found in Eurasia to Date
Paleontological, archaeological, geochronological, and paleomagnetic data from Dmanisi all indicate an earliest Pleistocene age of about 1.8 MA
Ooh, good point! Somebody perpetrated a fraud! Anytime that happens, it means that all the other discoveries and conclusions in the field are invalid.
Now lets talk about these molecule thingies the "scientists" claim exist. I've never seen one, nor have I ever seen a ruler as small as these guys say these things are. I have no idea how you would measure one, much less determine which kinds are are in different thing ("H2O"... arbitrary gibberish!) so it must be that they don't exist, and those that say they do are just making things up to try and justify their positions.
Obviously the people who believe in these "invisible" components aren't as smart as I am. How I pity them.
Yabba Dabba Dooooo!
My husband and I have been having an ongoing discussion about the whole evolution versus creation thing. These huge, almost unimagineable numbers just don’t register for me, and they never have.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.