Jesus died of blood clot - Israeli researcher

Yahoo - Reuters ^ | June 8, 2005

[evets]

[WKB]

Just how did you come to know
you were one of the elect?

[Protagoras]

I'm not a hard core Christian

What's the difference between a hard core Christian and a "not hardcore" Christian?

[WKB]

Yes, I am one of those who believes that God is not a failure.




BTW How did I, by posting a verse from the Bible
say God was a failure???

[GGpaX4DumpedTea]

Yes, Fr Calvin...

[rwfromkansas]

Anybody who believes on the Lord Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior must be saved, and therefore, must be elect. Every Christian is elect.

Paul wrote in his epistles by greeting them all as elect, which means chosen.

[Pharmboy]

Actually, a pulmonary embolus can be quite painful. As a matter of fact, it is often mistaken from a heart attack. Bleeding to death is, on the other hand, presumably painless.

[WKB]

You didn't answer my question

[rwfromkansas]

You didn't.

But, by neccessity, if God desires all to be saved, and not all are, He is.

I prefer to think of a God who can accomplish his will.

[rwfromkansas]

Yes I did. Because I am a Christian and love the Lord Jesus Christ and received Him as my savior, I must be among the elect.

Just as you are for the same reason. You are a believer, so you must be elect.

People like to attack the doctrines of sovereign grace by saying what if somebody wants to come but they can't. Well, that's not possible because we are dead in sin and hate God in our natural state. Only the Holy Spirit can turn us toward him, and he graciously does so for his elect. Not that we deserve it; we certainly don't.

[WKB]

Do you know who will be saved and who won't?

[rwfromkansas]

No. Do you?

But, obviously since Revelation shows people will be in hell, not all will be saved.

[WKB]

No. Do you?



No I don't. Do you believe in evangelism?

[GGpaX4DumpedTea]

"...failure..."

?

[frgoff]

Well, he died for his elect; the whole world is a general statement and does not mean every single person in the entire world.

I always find it fascinating when people take a plain statement and make it have a hidden meaning to fit their personal theology.

[WKB]

Amen bump

[NavyCanDo]

Maybe this Professor would like to test his stupid hypothesis by giving it a try on himself, using his own body in the experiment. We can have those crazy Myth Busters guys test his theory on live TV.

I have heard, and believe the cause of death by crucification was usually a slow suffocation. As your body eventually went limp due to loss of blood or exhaustion, it would choke off your ability to get oxygen. In Jesus case he was stabbed with a spear to either quicken his death, or as assurance that he was dead. If he was still alive at that time, then the loss of blood from the puncture wound could of been the cause of his physical death. Well at least he admitted he died on the cross. I have heard worse theory's coming from non-Christians, like he was just passed out or in a coma, later reviving in the tomb.

[frgoff]

You didn't.

But, by neccessity, if God desires all to be saved, and not all are, He is.

I prefer to think of a God who can accomplish his will.

Well, according to that logic, Christ was just a patch job to fix the original mistake: Adam and Eve taking the forbidden fruit.

So, God messed it up the first time, but fixed it the second time?

Don't bother answering; I already know the answer. It's very clearly spelled out in the Westminster Confession of faith.

Adam and Eve were made to eat the fruit (because God is sovereign, he makes everyone do what He wants), because He wanted to damn the majority of humanity to hell to glorify his justice. The rest he saves to glorify his mercy.

Calvin's God is a sick and twisted individual.

[WKB]

You Go frgoff

[rwfromkansas]

I am not doing eisegesis.

I suggest you look at the meaning of world in Scripture. It can mean all people across the entire world. It also can mean a general reference to the Earth and people from all nations. Even in the great commission, I assume you know that the Apostles did not travel through the entire world, just the world they knew at that time. Do a search for world's usage. There are cases in which it does not refer to literally everybody in the entire world.

Scripture doesn't contradict itself. This meaning meshes well with the verse in 1 Timothy that says God wants all to be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth. At first, that seems to be a universal statement. I used to think so when I used to still believe in Christ dying for everyone. But, actually the context of the verse is limited to all types of people when you see we are to pray for kings and all in authority as well as those in "lesser" status. The context of how people are used in that verse is limited to types of people, just like world is limited. In that verse, it means not only will we in this part of the world be saved, but people elsewhere as well. Christ died for people in every nation of the Earth. That is what it really is meaning. If it meant every person in the entire world, it would conflict with other verses that say Christ would be a ransom for "many," or that Christ would "save His people from their sins."