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Stone Defends Alexander
Megastar.com ^ | 18 November 2004 | Sid Billington

Posted on 11/18/2004 11:03:39 AM PST by Racehorse

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To: Racehorse

Good for them, we can't get people outraged when some pinhead tries to paint Abraham Lincoln as gay, for God's sale!


41 posted on 11/19/2004 10:13:10 AM PST by 50sDad ( ST3d - Star Trek Tri-D Chess! http://my.oh.voyager.net/~abartmes)
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To: 50sDad

JFK was pure fiction also portrayed as fact.

I think there is much, not only in this movie, implied that Alexander had an affair with one of his generals, whom I believe he later put to death.

nick


42 posted on 11/19/2004 10:48:30 AM PST by nikos1121
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To: yarddog
I might mention that while it was more common and more accepted, (maybe not more than the last few years tho) in ancient Greece, it was still the object of derision and looked down on."

I was trying to recall some old readin I did in school. Didn't the Spartan soldiers take boys into their homes to train them. Didn't the training include having sex with them?

43 posted on 11/24/2004 2:51:26 PM PST by verifythentrust
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To: verifythentrust
I am not familiar with that practice and doubt if it is true for a couple of reasons.

First of all, when boys reached a certain age, (I don't remember what it was off the top of my head but it was pretty young) they were sent to live in barracks.

Secondly, it was Thebes, not Sparta who had a group of homosexual warriors, called the sacred band. I have not heard of any other Greek city state with similar ideas.

I am no expert on homosexuality in ancient Greece but someone else on FR pointed out that it was not the same thing as in modern times, in that it did not involve buggery.

44 posted on 11/24/2004 3:04:50 PM PST by yarddog
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To: yarddog
My source may be shaky, History Channel, 3 hours on the Spartans. I remember it vividly because it was the nickname of my HS. Ouch!

I'm sure someone else will come along with more info.

45 posted on 11/24/2004 3:07:32 PM PST by verifythentrust
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To: Leonine
"Too much education coupled with too little intelligence"

Lets not confuse intelligence with wisdom. Plenty of Ph.Ds are smart..but only 10% are WISE.

46 posted on 11/26/2004 12:15:00 PM PST by Windsong (FighterPilot)
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To: Leonine
Pre-Christian morality, yup the disgust with male homosexuality is definitely not just a Christan thing. The pre-christan Romans were very anti-homosexual, to the point of putting to death any outed homosexuals in their military.
47 posted on 11/26/2004 12:26:06 PM PST by jpsb
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Comment #48 Removed by Moderator

To: jpsb

Actually, the Romans very much tolerated bi-sexual relationships. You might be right, however, that they had a different attitude toward homosexual relationships.


49 posted on 11/26/2004 12:31:14 PM PST by Austin Willard Wright
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To: Manic_Episode
I've hated every movie Stone has ever made

Stone who ?

50 posted on 11/26/2004 12:33:56 PM PST by af_vet_1981
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To: Racehorse
Went and watched it on Thanksgiving day. Pretty bad movie overall. I would rate it 1 star out of 4.

Poor script; hard to follow what is going on. Too much talking and not enough action. 3 hours was way TOO long for this movie. Kept looking at my watch thinking "what else can they do for another 1.5 hours"!

Timeline skips and bounces around too much. There were only 2 real battle scenes and were so confusing. Most of the time, I couldn't tell which side was which. Or what the strategy of the battle was. Seemed like an endless and pointless conquest. Didn't reall feel anything for any of the characters.

The gay/bisexual undertones would have been OK. Not sure if Alexander was bisexual or this was a figment of Oliver Stones wacky mind.

I would put it at the bottom of all the "historical war epic" type movies I've seen. Braveheart, The Patriot, even Troy were much better films of this genre.

51 posted on 11/26/2004 12:35:14 PM PST by gswilder
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To: All; Racehorse

for those of you from Rio Linda:

Helenistic influence means Greek influence.


52 posted on 11/26/2004 12:36:21 PM PST by longtermmemmory (VOTE!)
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To: lilylangtree

actually the "expert" who declared philip was a homosexual had to flee for his life when he presented his paper at a symposium on alexander the great about two years ago.

There is no evidence to support the allege conduct. Especially from a father who records show arranced cortisans of great skill to make sure Alexander understood the pleasures of female companionship.

History Channels documentary also put forth the conspiracy of Olympia aranging the death of philip.

Stone rejected all offers for the actual history when he was in Greece. Instead he produced a "gay" movie based on his own homoerotic delusions.

They will probably be screening this at the San Francisco "gay" film festival.


53 posted on 11/26/2004 12:41:46 PM PST by longtermmemmory (VOTE!)
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To: gswilder

I think all parents should be warned about the homosexual content of the movie so they can make an informed decision.


54 posted on 11/26/2004 12:43:57 PM PST by longtermmemmory (VOTE!)
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To: Racehorse

Don't tell ma Oliver Stone sucks!!


55 posted on 11/26/2004 12:44:47 PM PST by fish hawk
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To: verifythentrust
The Spartans had wives and children, but they also had many many slaves, so many slaves in fact that the Spartans were forced to become a highly disciplined militarist society. Young men, boys really, began training at an early age. Older males did the training, sexual relations were not part of the training, however male bonding was.

The reason we have a difficult time understanding the ancients is because we (westerners) have an entirely different view of women and the role of women in society. In the ancient world women were often thought of as only good for sex and having children. There were not thought of as being very smart, or very trust worthy. Hence, loving a woman was considered a mistake and would surely led to trouble, (hmmmm). Ergo, males tends to form close "loving" relationship with other males. These relationships were NOT sexual. They were platonic (notice the Plato in the word platonic). The queers want you to think that the world was homosexual until the nasty Christan's came along, that is simply not true. Male homosexuality was never been encourage by any society until now. We are in uncharted waters that the previous 10,000 years of human history has warned against.

56 posted on 11/26/2004 12:56:45 PM PST by jpsb
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To: jpsb

Thanx, I was repeating from the History channel special. I'm hip to the skip on the role of women.


57 posted on 11/26/2004 1:00:38 PM PST by verifythentrust
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To: Shqipo

Hey that Tony Curtis scene in Spartacus was a pretty brilliant scene. It showed without showing a thing how rotten Rome was and when Curtis takes off running the audience cheers.


58 posted on 11/26/2004 1:17:47 PM PST by thathamiltonwoman
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To: jpsb
The reason we have a difficult time understanding the ancients is because we (westerners) have an entirely different view of women and the role of women in society.

As always, there were notable exceptions.  Hypatia, mathematician and inventor of the astrolabe, would be one. 

59 posted on 11/26/2004 1:33:31 PM PST by Racehorse
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To: gswilder
Poor script; hard to follow what is going on. Too much talking and not enough action. 3 hours was way TOO long for this movie. Kept looking at my watch thinking "what else can they do for another 1.5 hours"!

Thanks.  Guess Oliver won't be getting my money.  Not directly, anyway.  I'll wait for it to show up on cable.

60 posted on 11/26/2004 1:36:30 PM PST by Racehorse
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