Posted on 12/11/2017 3:34:37 PM PST by metmom
‘But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death’ (Heb 2:9)
I noticed in your later replies...
Here you go:
8. "And the angel being come in, said unto her: Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women."
[Luke 1:28]
CONCLUSION:
Mary, the mother of Jesus, was full of grace. How could she be full of grace without being baptized? Answer: She was concieved without original sin, unlike any other human, except Jesus. Protestants claim that Catholics worship Mary which is against the first commandment. However, the first half of the "Hail Mary", which Catholics say, is taken out of the Bible (see 8a below) and the second half is merely asking Her to pray for us.
SUPPORTING VERSES:
8a. "And she cried out with a loud voice, and said: Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb."
[Luke 1:42]
Source:
The apostle John is not wrong, on any point...
The word grace used in this passage in Luke is used in one other place in the Bible and that is Ephesians 1 where Paul tells us that with this same grace, God has blessed us (believers) in the Beloved. IOW, we all have access to that grace and it has been bestowed on us all.
http://biblehub.com/greek/5487.htm
Luke 1:28 And he came to her and said, “Greetings, O favored one, the Lord is with you!”
Ephesians 1:4-6 In love he predestined us for adoption as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will, to the praise of his glorious grace, with which he has blessed us in the Beloved.
Greek word “grace”
charitoó: to make graceful, endow with grace
Original Word: χαριτόω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: charitoó
Phonetic Spelling: (khar-ee-to'-o)
Short Definition: I favor, bestow freely on
Definition: I favor, bestow freely on.
HELPS Word-studies
Cognate: 5487 xaritóō (from 5486 /xárisma, "grace," see there) – properly, highly-favored because receptive to God's grace. 5487 (xaritóō) is used twice in the NT (Lk 1:28 and Eph 1:6), both times of God extending Himself to freely bestow grace (favor).
Word Origin: from charis
Definition: to make graceful, endow with grace
NASB Translation: favored (1), freely bestowed (1).
The apostle John is not wrong, on any point...
Man was made in God's image--angels were not.
But what's that mean??? What is God's image...God doesn't have an image, as such...He is a spirit, invisible...
Jesus' human body was the physical manifestation of God...But not so much, anymore...
1Jn_3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
I think he meant MacArthur.
What of your habit of engaging in plagiarism? And what of what else was posted to you in comment #34?
Being as you offer no rebuttal, can I assume that you concede the point (that the Early Church did not look upon "Mary" as herself singularly being the woman of the Apocalypse)?
Let's clear up those two considerations prior to moving on to something yet else.
After dealing with those issues perhaps we can discuss how the "conclusion" is not Book, chapter, and verses as was requested, but instead is imposition upon the text(s) of things which the Scripture do not indicate (nor did the early, primitive Church teach & believe).
While I can't disagree with the first part, the last part is pretty far out there for me...But then again, God supplies our soul and spirit when we come to life...So who knows...But I can't imagine we are the progeny of fallen angels...
Perhaps it's not meant to be...Maybe it's just instructional in nature...There's a lot of older 'babes in Christ' out there...
I posted the sourcce and the source contained mostly quotes from the Bible.
At the end of the Tribulation you'll likely be standing there while the world is falling down around with your hands raised to your Mary begging her to deliver you from the wrath that Jesus is bringing with him as he returns...
“Perhaps it’s not meant to be...Maybe it’s just instructional in nature...There’s a lot of older ‘babes in Christ’ out there...”
—
Yeah, I suppose that’s the idea behind going over it. I just assume everybody already knows the commonly accepted “spiritual pecking order”.
Though there are some groups, such as the aforementioned Jehovah’s Witnesses that believe Jesus had been an angel (albeit the head angel).
Seventh Day Adventists aren’t very transparent on their theology on the matter, they offer up Jesus as being a human incarnation of the OT angel Michael.
None of those Scripture quotes refer to the mother of God because God has no mother.
SOME of them reference Mary, the mother of Jesus.
Most of those verses do not even apply to Mary and the ones posted do not say what the claim about them makes.
“How could she be full of grace without being baptized?”
—
How could she - or anyone else for that matter - have been baptized, since John The Baptist (her nephew) hadn’t even been born?
“Answer: She was concieved without original sin”
—
Then everyone else who had not been baptized were also born without original sin (remember: John The Baptist was still in the womb).
The titles and attributes you claim for Mary are worthy of worship, and they demand worship...
Romans 5:20 Now the law came in to increase the trespass, but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more,
No sin means no grace needed.
Grace is only needed for sin.
Those who have no sin do not need grace because they are capable of Standing in the presence of God on their own merit.
If Mary was full of grace, then she was full of sin.
Besides, contrary to the Catholic church's incorrect definition of *grace*, grace does not mean *sinless*.
Grace is given to us by God in spite of sin, not because of the absence of it.
We aren't. Unless, maybe you are like 10 feet tall.
There is a difference between the one-third of us, in spirit form, who rebelled in the prior age and those who actually 'fell', so to speak.
The fallen angels are already condemned. Because those are the small fraction that came to Earth without being born of woman and inter-bred with humans and created giants, polluting God's Earthly creation.
This was the reason for the Noah flood - to kill the half-breeds and, perhaps, most everybody else - at least in that area. Noah and his family - in the ever-important Adam to Christ bloodline, were still pure in the genetic sense and were saved to keep that bloodline clean until Christ was born.
The giants/half breed stuff sounds like crazy/alien talk to most people today, but it is what Genesis says. Even many church-going Christians are not taught this stuff nowadays. Which a shame. Too many churches are about filling pews and coffers and making people feel good. They should be teaching, that is the calling of a priest.
And, yes, of course, it is possible some of that interpretation is wrong. Knowing our ancient history exactly correctly is not going to save anybody's soul, but it is something which should be studied along with the full text of the bible.
The salvation-only preachers are those Paul admonished for never getting past the 'milk' and onto the 'meat' of His word.
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