Posted on 05/28/2017 2:44:16 PM PDT by metmom
Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
Have you ever investigated Baptism of Desire?
Baptism of Blood?
Whenever a discussion comes up on a phrase, it must be studied within context. “Baptism...now saves you through the resurrection of Jesus Christ” is a correlated symbol of salvation (by Jesus) just as Noah’s ark was a symbol of God’s patient salvation through the judgment flood. We are to be baptised to make a visual public display of our salvation, just as Noah was doing as he built the ark and was prosecuted for it. It is not the means of our salvation.
No, I hadn’t heard of them. File them under ‘if that doesn’t work, we’ll make up something else.’
FAITH ALONE! I agree!
In ACTS it was Believe, baptized, saved. But later it was Believe, saved, baptized.
Peter at Pentecost, to the Jews...believe, baptized, holy Spirit filled, saved.
To the Samaritans..Believe, baptized, nothing till the laying on of hands, then Holy Spirit filled, saved.
Peter to Gentiles...Believe, saved, Holy Spirit filled, baptized.
Paul to Gentiles... Believe Saved, Holy Sprit filled, baptized.
After the conversion of Saul (Paul), Peter is sent to Cornelius to preach the word to the first Gentile, with which they might be saved.
As Peter barely opens his mouth the Hold Spirit falls on them showing they were then filled with the Holy Spirit, something that always before happened AFTER baptism.
Then after. Peter asks...”Can any man forbid water that these should not be baptized?”
Yet they already had the evidence of salvation with the filling of the Holy Spirit.
Paul keeps making it clear that baptism, in most, but not all, of his letters, is the immersion of the believer into the Body of Christ, not water. He mentions several times that he was “Not sent to baptize but to preach...”
“By GRACE are you saved, through faith. not of works lest any man should boast”
“Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;”
A good study would be the words Nipto, Bapto, Baptizo.
Beautifully said. Thank you. Sacraments are an outward sign of an invisible grace. I am also suffering from the same nasty virus. Rest and peace to you.
There is evidence of Baptismal practices in the old testament in both Ezekiel and Leviticus, just sayin.
John 6:53, perhaps one of the hardest teachings of the New Testament is in the bible too. Based on the Greek and the context of Christ’s words it becomes difficult to rationalize it as symbolic.
If the sacrament of Baptism was unnecessary then what was the purpose of Christ’s Baptism by John?
There you go with that nuance stuff again.
Myself, I keep forgetting that some think Baptism is a “work.” Feels like a gift to me. I’ll have to remember to ask our neophytes if they thought they were working to merit salvation.
Kinda guessing not.
“Baptism saves, Moses with the rebound, pass to David, back to Peter, Jesus with a slap shot — GOAL!!!”
Look up the Parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man. It explains the two compartments of Hell/Hades. Jesus went to the Abraham’s Bosom side which is the Paradise side.
“Is the baptism which doesn’t save you the same as the baptism which 1 Pt 3:21 says very clearly does save you?”
But in what sense does it save? From sins?
1 Peter 3:21
There is also an antitype which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ.
(Some translations use the word “figure” rather than “antitype,” which is a transliteration of the Greek. An antitype is something in the New Testament that is pictured by something in the Old Testament.)
Salvation is a process. Often evangelicals are guilty of treating salvation as merely the spiritual rebirth that takes place when a person first hears and believe the Gospel.
But now is our faith nearer than when we believed (according to Romans 13:11).
Paul told the Roman believers he desired to preach the Gospel to them also. (See Romans 1.) The Gospel is not just for saving the lost. It is for the believer to continue in the path of faith. Salvation requires continuing in the faith because there are many who profess faith but later depart from it.
1 Corinthians 15:1-2
Moreover, brethren, I declare to you the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received and in which you stand, by which also you are saved, if you hold fast that word which I preached to you—unless you believed in vain.
Salvation begins in faith and continues in faith. Baptism is the first commandment after the commands to repent and believe. Faith is the prerequisite of water baptism.
Acts 8:37a
Then Philip said, “If you believe with all your heart, you may [be baptized].”
Peter explained that the baptisms of the Old Testament, specifically Noah’s flood, were pictures of New Testament baptism. How did the baptism of Noah save him? How did the baptism of Israel in the Red Sea save them?
None of these baptisms, including New Testament baptism, save us from sin or the wrath of God. In fact, it was the very waters which were God’s wrath and needed to be saved from. The flood waters of Noah separated Noah and his family from the fallen, corrupted world which remained in rebellion to God. The Red Sea separated Moses and Israel from Pharaoh and his wicked armies. New Testament baptism separates us from the unregenerate world and identifies us as God’s people.
Peter explains that baptism is the “answer of a good conscience toward God.” Answer here means legal demand. And by demand I do not mean that we demand anything from God in a disrespectful sense of the term. It is more like the way a check is a legal demand. We take it to the bank. And, if we have confidence in the person who wrote the check, we ask for the bank to give us the money, fully expecting them to do so. It is a legal demand.
Likewise, baptism is a legal demand, not for forgiveness or justification, but for a good conscience. When a person is baptized, they are separating themselves from the world and identifying as having become part of the church, which is the body of Christ.
We were dead in our sins. When we believe, God gives us new life. Baptism is figurative of this spiritual reality. Going into the water symbolizes burial. Coming out illustrates being given new life. These things are spiritual realities for everyone who believes in Jesus Christ because God places us into Him, making us part of His death, His resurrection, and His righteousness.
God does this through the baptism of the Holy Spirit who is given to all who believe. Water baptism is a picture of the baptism of the Spirit.
Baptism also is a mark of discipleship and public membership in the visible church. It is representative of our pledge to follow Christ, and God placing us into and making us members of the spiritual body of Christ, the church.
Born of water = physical birth.
Born of water = physical birth.
Born of water = physical birth.
Jesus knew what baptism was and yet He did not say *Be baptized and be saved*.
Whatever happened to ONE baptism that the Catholic church teaches about?
Here you guys are making up baptisms never mentioned in Scripture, which is your SOP..
Excellent.
Thank you.
When were these people saved?
37Now when they heard this, they were pierced to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Brethren, what shall we do?” 38Peter said to them, “Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Acts 2:37-38 NASB
When was Cornelius saved?
44While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who were listening to the message. 45All the circumcised believers who came with Peter were amazed, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. 46For they were hearing them speaking with tongues and exalting God. Then Peter answered, 47“Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, can he?” 48And he ordered them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay on for a few days. Acts 10:44-48 NASB
Paul?
10Now there was a disciple at Damascus named Ananias; and the Lord said to him in a vision, “Ananias.” And he said, “Here I am, Lord.” 11And the Lord said to him, “Get up and go to the street called Straight, and inquire at the house of Judas for a man from Tarsus named Saul, for he is praying, 12and he has seen in a vision a man named Ananias come in and lay his hands on him, so that he might regain his sight.” 13But Ananias answered, “Lord, I have heard from many about this man, how much harm he did to Your saints at Jerusalem; 14and here he has authority from the chief priests to bind all who call on Your name.” 15But the Lord said to him, “Go, for he is a chosen instrument of Mine, to bear My name before the Gentiles and kings and the sons of Israel; 16for I will show him how much he must suffer for My name’s sake.” 17So Ananias departed and entered the house, and after laying his hands on him said, “Brother Saul, the Lord Jesus, who appeared to you on the road by which you were coming, has sent me so that you may regain your sight and be filled with the Holy Spirit.” 18And immediately there fell from his eyes something like scales, and he regained his sight, and he got up and was baptized; 19and he took food and was strengthened. Acts 9:10-19
Peter does use the word “save” in context of baptism. But it is not about being saved from sin or God’s wrath. He is talking about being saved from the claims that the world and the Devil have upon the lives of unbelievers.
We receive forgiveness from sin by faith. Water baptism is a public claiming of our right to a good conscience with respect to the world and the principalities. It identifies us publicly with the finished work of Christ.
Evangelicals sometimes minimize the importance of baptism because of some who make it into a work for salvation. It is not that. But it is a very important command of God.
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