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To: left that other site; amorphous; GBA
The world powers are rooted in Edom. Which ties into Rome, Christianity, Western Civilization, and Uncle Sam (the government, the head, the world superpower). The sar (prince) of Edom: the satan, Samael. That would be one Jacob overpowered. It was there he was called/renamed Israel.

God, or mammon; Jacob, or Esav. Israel, or Edom. Or in terms of America's political theatre being a live-action parable, "We the People" vs. Fedzilla.

Genesis 25:27 And the boys grew: and Esau was a cunning hunter, a man of the field; and Jacob was a plain man, dwelling in tents.

Matthew 13:36-40

36 Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field.
37 He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;
38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.

Jacob vs. Esav. Israel vs. Edom. Wheat vs. tares. One healthy and productive; the other choking out the good - void of good fruit. Kind of like seeds of Monsanto. ;)

The distinction between these two individuals could not be any clearer: Eisav, the penultimate rasha, Yaakov, the paradigm tzadik. 

Soon after, the Torah tells us (ibid, 27) that the two became older. Rashi (ibid), again citing a Midrash, offers an interesting analysis:

As long as they were little they were indistinguishable by their deeds and no one could know their exact character. Once they turned thirteen, one [Yaakov] went his way to houses of study and the other went his way to worshipping idols.”

This presents a clear contradiction to the previous statement by Rashi. Before they were even born, Yaakov and Eisav were being identified based on each one’s particular ideological identities. And yet when they were born, and until the age of thirteen, it seems as though there was nothing whatsoever distinguishing the two. Which was it then?

<<<

Read on for the explanation...

http://www.mesora.org/ToldosGinsberg.html

Interesting that is at the sale of the birthright, where Esav is called Edom. The place of making a conscious decision to act out his innate "admoni" traits. From David (the only one other described as admoni), however, comes the Messiah. Admoni is admoni, but out of the dust of the earth (admat aphar) one goes to shame and everlasting contempt, the other to life everlasting..

What was going on such that Esav was named Edom, verses what was going on such that Jacob was named Israel. Something to do with their actions. Note also, that at birth, Jacob was named Jacob for his outward action, whereas Esav was named Esav for outward appearance. Yet catch the paradox, for the root of "Esav" is the verb for action (to make, to do, to act).

Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field:

Empty Heads Held High

The woman is a harlot. The name on her forehead is "the mother of harlots..". The name on her forehead is her mother's. Father, tribe; mother, religion. Well if the daughter is only known by her mother's name, where's the father? The daughter of Babylon has daddy issues. No self-respect for starters. It causes all sorts of problems, for example her hooking up with that bad actor. At least if the daughter of Zion behaves badly, that's not her innate character, and her father loves her, so she can be cleaned up. She just needs a good bath (Isaiah 4).

Micah 4:10-13; 5:1-2

10 Be in pain, and labour to bring forth, O daughter of Zion, like a woman in travail: for now shalt thou go forth out of the city, and thou shalt dwell in the field, and thou shalt go even to Babylon; there shalt thou be delivered; there the LORD shall redeem thee from the hand of thine enemies.
11 Now also many nations are gathered against thee, that say, Let her be defiled, and let our eye look upon Zion.
12 But they know not the thoughts of the LORD, neither understand they his counsel: for he shall gather them as the sheaves into the floor.
13 Arise and thresh, O daughter of Zion: for I will make thine horn iron, and I will make thy hoofs brass: and thou shalt beat in pieces many people: and I will consecrate their gain unto the LORD, and their substance unto the Lord of the whole earth.
1 Now gather thyself in troops, O daughter of troops: he hath laid siege against us: they shall smite the judge of Israel with a rod upon the cheek.
2 But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah [fruitfulness], though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

Zechariah 2:7-10

7 Deliver thyself, O Zion, that dwellest with the daughter of Babylon.
8 For thus saith the LORD of hosts; After the glory hath he sent me unto the nations which spoiled you: for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye.
9 For, behold, I will shake mine hand upon them, and they shall be a spoil to their servants: and ye shall know that the LORD of hosts hath sent me.
10 Sing and rejoice, O daughter of Zion: for, lo, I come, and I will dwell in the midst of thee, saith the LORD.

the tares are gathered and burned in the fire

Obadiah 1:15-20

15 For the day of the LORD is near upon all the heathen: as thou hast done, it shall be done unto thee: thy reward shall return upon thine own head.
16 For as ye have drunk upon my holy mountain, so shall all the heathen drink continually, yea, they shall drink, and they shall swallow down, and they shall be as though they had not been.
17 But upon mount Zion shall be deliverance, and there shall be holiness; and the house of Jacob shall possess their possessions.
18 And the house of Jacob shall be a fire, and the house of Joseph a flame, and the house of Esau for stubble, and they shall kindle in them, and devour them; and there shall not be any remaining of the house of Esau; for the LORD hath spoken it.
19 And they of the south shall possess the mount of Esau; and they of the plain the Philistines: and they shall possess the fields of Ephraim, and the fields of Samaria: and Benjamin shall possess Gilead.
20 And the captivity of this host of the children of Israel shall possess that of the Canaanites, even unto Zarephath; and the captivity of Jerusalem, which is in Sepharad, shall possess the cities of the south.
21 And saviours shall come up on mount Zion to judge the mount of Esau; and the kingdom shall be the LORD'S.

Malachi 4:1 For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.

Revelation 14:1-8

1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.
2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:
3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.
4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.
5 And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God.
6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,
7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.
8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.

Fallen fallen = indeed, surely fallen. Doubled, as is the pattern for that which is certain to occur.

Also from the Mesora link:

It is man’s choice to be the tzadik or rasha, not some sort of pre-determined fate. It is no coincidence that the Midrash focuses on the age of thirteen. As we all know, it is at this age that a young man becomes obligated in all mitzvos. His intellectual and psychological developments are at the point that he can benefit from the ideas of the mitzvos, a monumental step in his life. At this stage in life, the ability to make these decisions, to exercise his bechira, comes to the forefront. So too with Yaakov and Eisav. They were not “forced” to become the future of the Jewish people or the paradigm of evil – they were conscious decisions by each of them.

Goes a long way in explaining Romans chapter 9 (must see the whole chapter).

Romans 9:13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.
Romans 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

Not all Israel is Israel; not all Esav is Esav.

On whom does the Lord show mercy? On the one who repents.

the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God

There's always a remnant. Of Isaac.

As for Babylon, fallen fallen = indeed, surely fallen. Doubled, as is the pattern for that which is certain to occur.

And on the subject of redundancy:

1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads. 2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:

He could have just written "musicians playing harps", but no, he really had to harp on that particular point.

What can I say, these posts just sort of grow. That's always the way with this stuff. :)

13 posted on 08/30/2016 9:55:57 AM PDT by Ezekiel (All who mourn the destruction of America merit the celebration of her rebirth.)
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To: Ezekiel

Pray For the Peace of Jerusalem






Thank You, Ezekiel, For Your Prayers and Interesting Thoughts For the Peace of Jerusalem, For Our FRiends in Need, For Persecuted Believers, and For Our Beloved Nation.


Blessings To All Who Visit This Garden of Prayer.



This Symbol Represents Christians in The Middle East, who desperately need our Prayers.

Hallelujah and Amen

ML/LTOS

14 posted on 08/30/2016 10:06:43 AM PDT by left that other site (You shall know the Truth, and The Truth Shall Set You Free.)
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To: Ezekiel
Thanks,

"But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah [fruitfulness], though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting."

Just one example of WHY evangelists need to study the OT.

BFML,

15 posted on 08/30/2016 10:25:31 AM PDT by amorphous
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