Posted on 05/14/2016 8:48:31 AM PDT by Salvation
Monsignor Pope Ping for OSV column.
Amen. Thanks, Salvation!
That was very clearly and well stated. Thanks for posting it!
But if this is the case, wouldn't that affirm the Orthodox assertion that filioque should not be in the Nicene Creed?
The problem is that almost noone dares to question the premise. It's settled science er doctrine, after all. Hence the perpetual fog of confusion. Truth welcomes honest inquiry and rewards the seeker with abundant blessings and peace. Trinity "deniers" are reviled much more than global warming "deniers".
If rain falls on a parade, participants and observers may choose to curse the rain. Those whose lawns and gardens thirst may, however, see things from... a different perspective.
From the article: Hence, Jesus proceeds from the Father from all eternity. He is eternally begotten of the Father. In effect, Jesus is saying, “I delight that the Father is the eternal principal or source of my being, even though I have no origin in time.”
While I am a Christian, I don’t believe in the traditional Trinity.
It is inconceivable to me that Christ while on the Cross would cry out “My God my God, why has thou forsaken me?” ...and later “It is done, into thy hands I commend my spirit”
The trinity makes no sense in this instance, Why would god talk to himself in this in his greatest agony almost as if he were a person with a multiple person disorder.
Of Course, if Christ was calling upon God his literal Father in Heaven instead of the mysterious containing one in three, three in one, but never one, but never three requirement of the Trinity.
Welcome to the wide world of heresy.
Now when "the truth" is Special Revelation which by definition can not be discovers by natural means.
Now when "the truth" is Special Revelation which by definition can not be discovers by natural means.
Actually, that makes you a non-Christian, by definition.
I see where you’re coming from, teppe.
In Revelation 20:11 John writes, “And I saw a great white throne, and HIM (not THEM) that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them”
The Father is not the Son. They are one divine substance, but not one identity. It makes perfect sense for the Son to pray to the Father; he's not "talking to himself" by definition.
"Let us make man....."?
Now when “the truth” is Special Revelation which by definition can not be discovers by natural means.
- - - - - - -
As it turns out, there is a recent Universal Quantum Field Theory, that the Infinite, Timeless Creator of the Universe, Ein Sof to the Kabalists, created the Universe as three books or concentric spheres, a long, long time ago. The Heavens and the Earth, as it were.
All that is required to deduce this is to assume that all dimensions are quantized in pairs. Interestingly enough one gets a seventh degree algebraic equation for the initial state that has three real solutions. Thus we have the number seven, and the number three identified as important though general revelation, i.e. things we can deduce from observing the Universe and reasoning about how it works.
Since the trinity of spheres figures significantly in the observed structure of sub-atomic particles, it is not unreasonable to accept that it figures significantly in the way the external, infinite Creator manifests Himself in His creation.
If you want to argue with the Creator, then please re-read the Book of Job and find out how that works out.
Remember: He is the Potter, we are the clay!
Let's try the classical Christian answer: Given the proviso that you accept that a universal highest power exists according to the Thomist view God is the un-created, first moving necessary being. He lives outside of time and space. So technically the terms before and after having no bearing on the origin of the Son.
Gods first thought was of Himself and that thought was so powerful and perfect that it resulted in the Son. Not as a created being, but rather as a reflection of the Father with all of His divinity. Since the Father already existed the Son's first thought was of Him This first thought was of the perfect love He had for the Father. The Father also immediately had a perfect love for the Son. This love resulted in the third person was the Holy Spirit.
Plenty of people have, and continue to, "dare" question the premise of the triune nature of Almighty God. It came up in the first few centuries of Christianity. It was defined, proved and defended through the Divinely-inspired Holy Scriptures which is why we as Christians believe and defend it to this day. Read John 8 for the words of Jesus on this.
Why do you think mere humans could possibly comprehend all that the doctrine of the Trinity is about? Some things we accept by faith because God said it. Jesus said repeatedly He was God. Old Testament Messianic prophesy says the Messiah would be “God with us”. That He would be “Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace” (Isaiah 9:6). So, either we accept what He said or we call Him a liar. I don’t have to understand how it all works, I just have to believe His word.
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