Posted on 06/19/2015 12:34:31 PM PDT by ebb tide
Thank God for our good shepherds who continue to remain faithful, despite the diabolical disorientation in which the Church has been engulfed.
God warned us that this would occur.
"Now the Spirit manifestly saith, that in the last times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to spirits of error, and doctrines of devils" (1 Tim 4:1)
"Woe to the pastors, that destroy and tear the sheep of my pasture, saith the Lord." (Jer 23:1)
And BTW, the problem is not limited to the Catholic Church.
"Goodbye, Good Men"
"Liberals who blame celibacy for the Catholic Church’s pedophilia scandals are missing the real cause: seminaries that actively encourage homosexuality, moral laxity, and theological dissent all in the name of post-Vatican II “renewal.” In Goodbye, Good Men, Michael S. Rose demonstrates that such seminaries are by no means rare. All over the country, gay priests and liberal nuns energetically recruit for the priesthood gay men and others of questionable moral character – while turning away heterosexual orthodox men....
...Nor is this problem restricted to Catholics! The assault on Christian orthodoxy and masculine authority – as well as the aggressive promotion of the gay agenda – that Rose documents in this book are proceeding apace in Protestant denominations too. That makes Goodbye, Good Men essential reading not only for Catholics who want to save their Church, but for everyone who wants to defend Christianity from assault by those who would subvert its message from within..."
The above statement is false. Even bad Catholic priests can consecrate bread and wine into the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus Christ. Something your soap box preachers will never be able to do.
P.S.: Obedience to the Third Commandment is only satisfied by assisting at a Catholic Mass. Where will you be tomorrow?
Got a chapter and verse that says that only a Catholic mass fulfills the commandment to........ what exactly?
Keep the Sabbath? How does *keeping the Sabbath* translate in Scripture to attending only a Catholic mass every Sunday?
Or is it the admonition to not forsake assembling together? And where does not forsaking assembling together translate into *have to only attend a mass at a Catholic church*?
Wrong. A schism happens when the main group falls into error. The group that stands for truth has two choices - reform the main group or break away.
It has nothing to do with what is popular
If, when moving, we find a local congregation that’s closer that preaches the gospel and we like it, I see no reason to be obligated to stay with something further away.
The specific incidence I was talking about was if you were only able to find groups who held fundamental theological principles that were fundamentally different than the ones believe.
I'm glad you have been able to find ones that are compatible with your beliefs.
The one for John 14:26 is a bit of a stretch to claim that it's a promise to protect from doctrinal error.
John 14:26 --
Reply to #47:
And THAT was the mentality which permeated WNY Catholicism.
Sadly, that is a condescending attitude that pervades much.
It also flies against Catholic teaching.
All of Christ’s faithful likewise have the right to a celebration of the Eucharist that has been so carefully prepared in all its parts that the word of God is properly and efficaciously proclaimed and explained in it; that the faculty for selecting the liturgical texts and rites is carried out with care according to the norms; and that their faith is duly safeguarded and nourished by the words that are sung in the celebration of the Liturgy.
Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments, Instruction Redemptionis Sacramentum
Reply to #48:
THAT seems to be quite a disconnect. To allow for differences within your own church that rival Protestants, and yet not let that be a problem for you when it's a problem when it happens outside your church.
No offense here, but that is one of the criticisms that I personally have with my understanding of Protestantism (bear in mind that this is based on my perception): when there are problems, there are splits...rather than trying to bear it and fix matters. Again, based upon my perceptions.
Reply to post #52
The one for John 14:26 is a bit of a stretch to claim that it's a promise to protect from doctrinal error.
John 14:26 But the Paraclete, the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things, and bring all things to your mind, whatsoever I shall have said to you.
John 16:13 But when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will teach you all truth. For he shall not speak of himself; but what things soever he shall hear, he shall speak; and the things that are to come, he shall shew you.
But when you're told that you are not to question the church, the priests or nuns, there is no recourse left. There is no staying and fixing the problem because there is no questioning your betters, those in authority over you.
How do you fix something when challenging what you see as wrong is essentially not permitted?
BTW, how's that fixing things working out for you?
How do you fix a system where the college of cardinals elects the pope who then appoints cardinals? Nice tidy little system they have going there.....
Who's going to break into it to fix things? And who do they answer to?
All, good questions metmom, questions I know I have struggled with for a couple of years now. However, I fall back on my faith in Christ and His words that the gates of Hell will not prevail over His Church. In the midst of this mess, I remain faithful to the Catholic Faith and put my trust in God. He has raised saints before and He will raise saints again...or He will intervene directly.
Then again, we could be in the end times.
Actually, over time I've had some pretty good luck all in all.
In general, I can empathize with those faithful laity who had the bad luck of living in a diocese run by an Arian bishop. Must not have been terribly pleasant for them either.
And there are any number of other examples. For example, to be a faithful Catholic in England during the 16th Century, particularly after one's bishop just burned a pinch of incense at the altar of King Henry. It would have been so much easier to follow the Church of Cromwell.
The Holy Spirit runs this show, not me. He will correct matters. Hopefully sometime during my life, but if not, it's still my job to stay faithful.
good timing. ;-) (see #73)
Ha... :-)
Yes. And they are called apostates of the Catholic Faith.
One of my favorite quotes from St. Athansius:
"May God console you! ... What saddens you ... is the fact that others have occupied the churches by violence, while during this time you are on the outside. It is a fact that they have the premises – but you have the Apostolic Faith. They can occupy our churches, but they are outside the true Faith. You remain outside the places of worship, but the Faith dwells within you. Let us consider: what is more important, the place or the Faith? The true Faith, obviously. Who has lost and who has won in the struggle – the one who keeps the premises or the one who keeps the Faith? True, the premises are good when the Apostolic Faith is preached there; they are holy if everything takes place there in a holy way ... "You are the ones who are happy; you who remain within the Church by your Faith, who hold firmly to the foundations of the Faith which has come down to you from Apostolic Tradition. And if an execrable jealousy has tried to shake it on a number of occasions, it has not succeeded. They are the ones who have broken away from it in the present crisis. No one, ever, will prevail against your Faith, beloved Brothers. And we believe that God will give us our churches back some day. "Thus, the more violently they try to occupy the places of worship, the more they separate themselves from the Church. They claim that they represent the Church; but in reality, they are the ones who are expelling themselves from it and going astray.Even if Catholics faithful to Tradition are reduced to a handful, they are the ones who are the true Church of Jesus Christ."
It seems to me that there were probably a number of Catholics who did not attend mass during the Arian heresy. It's not like they could hop in a car and drive to another parish.
Indeed He has. The Reformation achieved through the Council of Trent was undoubtedly inspired.
As you say, many Catholics have chosen, particularly in the past 150 years, not to follow His leading.
But that has little to do with the division between us.
It’s irrelevant to me if Catholics call me apostate to Catholicism.
I am faithful to Christ, the One who loved me and gave Himself for me.
The one Himself who forgives my sins and seals me with His promised Holy Spirit to guarantee my redemption.
The One who will never leave me or forsake me, whose name is Faithful and True, the Author and Finisher of my faith.
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