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The Problem with Going to Heaven
Glory to God for All Things ^ | Fr Stephen Freeman

Posted on 03/05/2015 5:44:45 AM PST by don-o

“That man might become God…” On its surface this statement simply sounds blasphemous. Interpreted in a wrong manner, it would be worse than blasphemous. When read correctly, however, it is the very essence of salvation itself. “To go to heaven…” from my childhood this phrase has been used as the goal of a Christian life. But, interpreted in its most common manner, it is only a Christianized version of paganism.

The distinction between these two statements can be found in their treatment of the interior life. The first, “to become God,” suggests profound, even transcendent change within a person. The second, “to go to heaven,” suggests only a change of location. It is this change in location that is essentially pagan.

It is essentially pagan, meaning that it differs in no way from the sentiments of the ancient Romans, Greeks and the Norse. For to “become a God” in their pantheon would only mean a change in location. The gods of the ancient pagans differed in no way from human beings, other than being bigger, more powerful and in a larger location. But they had their faults. They could be greedy, angry, vindictive, jealous, lustful, etc. And because this was so, human beings needed to be careful not to offend them or to provoke their envy.

For many people the statement, “to become God,” still carries a pagan meaning. It infers the acquisition of divine power and ability and somehow becoming a rival to the one God. This is the blasphemous meaning of the phrase and we do well to instinctively oppose it. We sometimes say of someone, “He thinks he’s some sort of a god,” and we never mean it as a compliment.

But within the New Testament and in the long history of Christian teaching, there is a perfectly acceptable use of the phrase. In 2 Peter we read:

Grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord, as His divine power has given to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of Him who called us by glory and virtue, by which have been given to us exceedingly great and precious promises, that through these you may be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. (2Pe 1:2-4 NKJ)

This is synonymous with concepts such as being “transformed” into the image of Christ (Ro. 8:29; 2Cor 3:18). But the right understanding of this “divinization” is not a transformation into a pagan deity, nor a rivaling of the One God. Indeed, the Fathers, with later theological precision, are careful to say that we become “by grace” what God is “by nature.”

But it is utterly essential to the Christian telling of the gospel, that our salvation should be understood in terms of transformation, of an inner metamorphosis towards the image of Christ. Salvation is not a mere change in location (going to heaven).

And this makes sense when it is considered thoughtfully. The problems within our existence are not rooted in location. I do not hate, cheat, lie and hurt others simply because I’m living in the wrong place, and my re-location to some ideal paradise will not, in-and-of-itself, make a difference in what must be changed. If you put me in paradise right now, with no change in me, then I’ll ruin the place for others in very short order.

I have observed on a number of occasions that parish Churches are either paradise or a colony of hell. This is true simply because of the state of the heart. Those who carry hell in their hearts make the world hell for all around them. Those who carry paradise within are the bringers of paradise. And so we pray when we approach communion that the Holy Gifts would be “neither for our judgment nor our condemnation,” but “for the healing of soul and body.”

That “healing of soul and body” is measured by “the fullness of the stature of Christ” (Eph. 4:13). Anything less than this is not the salvation promised in the Scriptures. In truth, if heaven is not dwelling in our hearts, then nothing outside of us will seem as heaven. And if hell is dwelling in our hearts, everything around us will seem like hell. In the words of St. Macarius:

The heart itself is but a small vessel, yet dragons are there, and there are also lions; there are poisonous beasts and all the treasures of evil. But there too is God, the angels, the life and the kingdom, the light and the apostles, the heavenly cities and the treasuries of grace—all things are there.

This marks the daily struggle of the Christian – the life of paradise versus the life of hell. These are not external rewards and punishments but simply ways of speaking about the state of the heart – ways of describing what we are becoming.

It has been my experience that those who judge others are almost always inwardly condemning themselves. Those who regularly speak well of all and even excuse others have an inward peace. It is troubling that there are so many of the former and so few of the latter. Will there be many who are saved?


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1 posted on 03/05/2015 5:44:45 AM PST by don-o
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To: don-o

from my childhood this phrase has been used as the goal of a Christian life.


Must have been Mormon, not Christian.

It is not the teaching of Christianity - to become God.


2 posted on 03/05/2015 6:09:42 AM PST by cuban leaf (The US will not survive the obama presidency. The world may not either.)
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To: cuban leaf

Right out’a the chute ... I was thinking in similar ways


3 posted on 03/05/2015 6:12:09 AM PST by knarf (I say things that are true ... I have no proof ... but, they're true)
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To: don-o

Sometimes the flesh and ungodly behaviors come out of the mind, heart and mouth. This is the reason we need a Savior Jesus because flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom. Those who refuse Jesus salvation are just proud and deluded. Although we live righteous at times our salvation is not based on that.


4 posted on 03/05/2015 6:13:26 AM PST by tflabo (Truth or tyranny, dontchyaknow.)
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To: don-o

Who is this guy? Is he a priest like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson are Reverend?

The premise of man becoming God is false. Christians hope that they are worthy to attain Heaven; NOT to become God.


5 posted on 03/05/2015 6:15:57 AM PST by NTHockey (Rules of engagement #1: Take no prisoners. And to the NSA trolls, FU)
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To: cuban leaf
**Must have been Mormon, not Christian.**

_______________________________________________

Nah. That is a Roman Catholic thing too.

For the Son of God became man so that we might become God."80 "The only-begotten Son of God, wanting to make us sharers in his divinity, assumed our nature, so that he, made man, might make men gods."81
Catechism of the Catholic Church

6 posted on 03/05/2015 6:17:10 AM PST by Gamecock (Joel Osteen is a minister of the Gospel like Colonel Sanders is an Infantry officer.)
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To: cuban leaf

It *is* the teaching of Christianity to become more Christlike.


7 posted on 03/05/2015 6:17:14 AM PST by sauropod (Fat Bottomed Girl: "What difference, at this point, does it make?")
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To: NTHockey

To #6.


8 posted on 03/05/2015 6:17:38 AM PST by Gamecock (Joel Osteen is a minister of the Gospel like Colonel Sanders is an Infantry officer.)
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To: don-o

Let’s be frank: If a space alien or any of us today went back to ancient times (heck, even a hundred years ago) with a few samples of modern technology in functional form, we’d be seen as gods.

That’s not really the point of Christianity, though. It’s about “eternity”, which is something other than our current physical realm and more “real”. It’s why I very much like the example of “The Matrix” to describe this world that is made of coagulated energy and is, in essence, made from nothing.

One of the most revealing sentences in the bible is, of course uttered by Jesus. His twist of tense is interesting:

“Before Abraham was, I am.”


9 posted on 03/05/2015 6:17:40 AM PST by cuban leaf (The US will not survive the obama presidency. The world may not either.)
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To: sauropod

See #6.

Little different than what you just said.

Becoming Christ-like is just a little different than becoming God.


10 posted on 03/05/2015 6:19:13 AM PST by Gamecock (Joel Osteen is a minister of the Gospel like Colonel Sanders is an Infantry officer.)
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To: don-o
>>we become “by grace” what God is “by nature.”<<

No, we do not. It's still God through us. Why does Catholicism always want man to get some of the credit?

11 posted on 03/05/2015 6:19:27 AM PST by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus)
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To: Gamecock

The writer is an Orthodox priest. He is reflecting Orthodox theology. Thoughtful readers (and lurkers) may see some things to investigate, consider, meditate and pray about.

The usual suspects will be doing what they usually do.


12 posted on 03/05/2015 6:22:58 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever!)
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To: NTHockey

Your not understanding it.. you do not become God in his power and authority... you change you heart to become like minded in your spirit and thinking


13 posted on 03/05/2015 6:25:08 AM PST by tophat9000 (An Eye for an Eye, a Word for a Word...nothing more)
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To: NTHockey
The premise of man becoming God is false.

Who said that?

The writer addresses that. For the convenience of those who will not read the OP, here is what the writer wrote...

But the right understanding of this “divinization” is not a transformation into a pagan deity, nor a rivaling of the One God. Indeed, the Fathers, with later theological precision, are careful to say that we become “by grace” what God is “by nature.”

14 posted on 03/05/2015 6:30:49 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever!)
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To: don-o
The scripture tells us that there is something called "righteous judgment." - John 7:24. The Apostle Paul said, "he that is spiritual judges all things" - I Cor 2:15 . We all make judgments about people every day. In the gospels, we see Jesus offending certain religious and hypocritical people by judging them. The Lord sees the intention of our heart when we judge others. He knows if we are of the right Spirit when we judge.

Interestingly, when you say, "It has been my experience that those who judge others are almost always inwardly condemning themselves", you are judging those who judge.

15 posted on 03/05/2015 6:31:18 AM PST by JesusIsLord
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To: don-o
**The usual suspects will be doing what they usually do.**

Posting sections of the Catechism of the Catholic Church?

How dare we!

16 posted on 03/05/2015 6:34:43 AM PST by Gamecock (Joel Osteen is a minister of the Gospel like Colonel Sanders is an Infantry officer.)
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To: sauropod; don-o

“...It is the teaching of Christianity to become more Christlike...”

Yes - God equals Christ. We are expected to become Christlike. Since we are sinners, this is not 100% possible, yet grace gives us a boost.

A biblical example to illustrate this concept is to consider the temptations of Christ in the desert. He didn’t need to be tempted, He did it as an example for us sinners on how to resist the devil and become more like Him. (That is, more like God).

The fact that we are to try to imitate Christ is a given for Christians. (or ought to be).

Man doesn’t become God and it is not possible, and that is not the author’s point. At least some of us get it.


17 posted on 03/05/2015 6:57:45 AM PST by stonehouse01
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To: Gamecock

The OP has nothing to do with the RCC. But, that never has stopped some from spamming every single thread posted here.


18 posted on 03/05/2015 6:59:03 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever!)
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To: don-o

Spamming an open thread?

Perhaps if those from other denominations aren’t welcome to comment we could recommend a designation that would prohibit just that. Maybe if something like the word “Caucus” included in the title?

In the mean time I know your indignation will also be directed at those who post inflammatory comments on threads started by Protestants. If you haven’t seen that happen take a peek sometime. For you to do otherwise would do nothing but render your protest invalid.

Have a blessed day.


19 posted on 03/05/2015 7:04:52 AM PST by Gamecock (Joel Osteen is a minister of the Gospel like Colonel Sanders is an Infantry officer.)
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To: tophat9000

Jesus finished the work on the cross. We rest in the faith of that salvation. As the Spirit changes us so are we. We cannot pretend religiosity.
We are who we are and hopefully we are His.


20 posted on 03/05/2015 7:07:21 AM PST by tflabo (Truth or tyranny, dontchyaknow.)
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