All About Heresy

http://www.graceonlinelibrary.org ^ | 2014 | Michael S. Horton

[PhilipFreneau]

Witch trials in Salem. The Council of Toulouse in the 13th century, employing men whose sole purpose was to hunt out human kindling for the flames of the Inquisition. These are images evoked by that word, ‘heresy.’ A nasty word, it suggests more about the accuser, who is considered intolerant, bigoted, and ignorant, than about the accused. But while there have been historical events in Christian history to remind us of the dangers of heresy-hunting, very few Christians today realize the debt they owe to those who had the courage of their convictions to call heresy by its proper name, in spite of the repercussions. The Concept of Heresy: Is It Biblical? Judaism began when the nation of Israel rejected the Messiah. After all, our Lord himself asserted that the whole of the Old Testament refers to him (Jn 5:39). He scolded the religious leaders for not even knowing their own Scriptures (Mt 22:29). After his resurrection, Jesus taught the disciples the meaning of it all: ‘And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he explained to them what was said in all the Scriptures concerning himself’ (Lk 24:27). Philip took the same approach with an Ethiopian who was reading the Book of Isaiah. He was reading the fifty-third chapter, concerning the Suffering Servant who would give himself as a sacrifice for many. ‘Then Philip began with that very passage of Scripture and told him the good news about Jesus,’ and immediately the Ethiopian was baptized (Acts 8:26­36). This is why I say that Judaism began in the first century, as the Jewish nation finally rejected Christ. It is not the case that Judaism adheres to the Old Testament, but Christians embrace both. Rather, Judaism rejects the promises of the Old Testament and their fulfillment in Christ...

[PhilipFreneau]

Bio of Michael S. Horton:

http://modernreformation.org/default.php?page=authorbio&var2=1

[PhilipFreneau]

Ping

[PhilipFreneau]

This is an excerpt. The full article can be read at:

http://www.graceonlinelibrary.org/creeds-confessions/all-about-heresy-by-michael-s-horton/

Philip

[Elsie]

All About Heresy

I was walking across a bridge one day, and I saw a man standing on the edge, about to jump off. So I ran over and said, "Stop! Don't do it!"

"Why shouldn't I?" he said.

 

I said, "Well, there's so much to live for!"

He said, "Like what?"

 

I said, "Well...are you religious or atheist?"

He said, "Religious."

 

I said, "Me too! Are you Christian or Buddhist?"

He said, "Christian."

 

I said, "Me too! Are you Catholic or Protestant?"

He said, "Protestant."

 

I said, "Me too! Are you Episcopalian or Baptist?"

He said, "Baptist!"

 

I said,"Wow! Me too! Are you Baptist Church of GOD or Baptist Church of the Lord?"

He said, "Baptist Church of GOD!"

 

I said, "Me too! Are you Original Baptist Church of GOD, or are you Reformed Baptist Church of GOD?"

He said,"Reformed Baptist Church of GOD!"

 

I said, "Me too! Are you Reformed Baptist Church of GOD, reformation of 1879, or Reformed Baptist Church of GOD, reformation of 1915?"

He said, "Reformed Baptist Church of GOD, reformation of 1915!"

 

I said, "Die, heretic scum", and pushed him off.

-- Emo Phillips

[cloudmountain]

Interesting take on heresy.
Not very flattering to Protestants or Baptists.

[xone]

Not very flattering to Protestants or Baptists.

Well the Catholics would have got the shove after the third question, wouldn't have been around for the unflattering part.

[PhilipFreneau]

>>>I said, “Die, heretic scum”, and pushed him off.
— Emo Phillips<<<

ROFL! As always, right on cue, Elsie.

[Thought I was gonna die laughing...]

Philip

[Lee N. Field]

Interesting that this should come up.

Men's group at church is doing a short (6 session) look into the early church fathers. This past week we looked at the Apostles', Nicene, Athanasean and Chalcedonian creeds.

The leader's point was that these were codifying in writing a very, very early core of Christian belief, that was taught by the apostles and can be seen referenced as such in the NT epistles.

In our weekly personal chitchat time at the coffee shop this week, my wife and I talked about this, and how much of what those men wrote was in defense against the heretic of their day. She asked "so, what are the big heresies the church faces today."

To even think about that, we need to define "heresy". There is a quote from Michael Horton that I'd bookmarked years ago: "Heresy is any teaching that directly contradicts the clear and direct witness of the Scriptures on a point of salvific importance."

Now I see that this quote is from this article. (Bookmarked!)

[Elsie]

I suppose I could tinker with some JavaScript code and come up with a random religion/denomination thingy that would place say, Wiccans and Hindus in the text; or Catholics and Eastern Orthodox...

[Elsie]

It ain’t the fall that kills ya; it’s the sudden stop!

[mdmathis6]

“Interesting take on heresy.
Not very flattering to Protestants or Baptists”

Bears false witness...at worst on the count of Mr. Phillips.
At worst, such disagreements caused such Baptist folks to ignore each other and go on their merry way. They didn’t try to burn each other at the stake, torture, maim, or imprison each other over their disagreements the way the Catholics and early Protestant factions did.

A disagreement between Baptist or evangelical protestant factions over doctrine may cause disinvites to fellowship dinners, not bloody mayhem!

[PhilipFreneau]

>>>To even think about that, we need to define “heresy”. There is a quote from Michael Horton that I’d bookmarked years ago: “Heresy is any teaching that directly contradicts the clear and direct witness of the Scriptures on a point of salvific importance.”<<<

That is a good quote. But to most people “a heretic is anyone who doesn’t believe the way I do.” LOL!

Philip

[A child of Yah]

Hi there “Elsie”
I didn’t get to properly thank you quite awhile back when you welcomed me aboard. I was so unfamiliar with this site that by the time I realized how to navigate it all, it was long past due.
This is where we were and what you had replied to me:

Mitt and the White Horse Prophecy
Monday, January 30, 2012 7:21:11 AM · 151 of 176
Elsie to A child of Yah
I’m very new here...

VERY indeed!

Welcome aboard and hold on tight! ;^)

*****************
Thank you so much for such a hearty welcome back then, and I’m so glad that I’m finally able to thank you properly because I have been kicking my butt over it ever since ... smiles and many thanks again dear one.

[Utah Binger]

IBTZ

[redleghunter]

LOL

[cloudmountain]

Bears false witness...at worst on the count of Mr. Phillips. At worst, such disagreements caused such Baptist folks to ignore each other and go on their merry way. They didn’t try to burn each other at the stake, torture, maim, or imprison each other over their disagreements the way the Catholics and early Protestant factions did.
A disagreement between Baptist or evangelical protestant factions over doctrine may cause disinvites to fellowship dinners, not bloody mayhem!

I have a dear old friend who was brought up Baptist then converted to Presbyterian. It really had to do with the church nearer to her and her preferring one minister over another.

I asked her what the difference was between the two, theologically, and she didn't know. It didn't matter to her.
I thought about that and had to agree. We all worship Jesus as the Son of God. She's such a wonderful friend that it wouldn't bother me a bit if she changed denominations 10 more times. She son, of all things, became a Catholic. She thought that was good too.

We never discussed Mary, but she and I went on a tour of the Holy Land with former Baptist minister Steve Ray and his wife. There we SAW and walked in the footsteps of Jesus and her ideas about Mary changed for the positive.
To be honest, that trip in the "footsteps of Jesus" changed ALL of us, for the better. WHAT an uplifting experience. I think ALL Christians should visit the Holy Land, if at all possible.

[cloudmountain]

I suppose I could tinker with some JavaScript code and come up with a random religion/denomination thingy that would place say, Wiccans and Hindus in the text; or Catholics and Eastern Orthodox...

1. I have a cousin whose mother gave him NO religion, no faith whatsoever, thinking that HE should decide when he was an adult. He dabbled in EVERYTHING, including Wicca for about 10 minutes.
I end up feeling badly for him. He's SUCH a wonderful guy. I hope he's finding peace these days. He was given NOTHING as a child and that is what he probably ends up having: nothing.

2. My husband and I lived in Saudi Arabia for five years and saw MANY Indians but there were no Hindus because the Saudis wanted "people of the Book." So Indian Catholics were hired--but NO Hindus.
There was a DESPERATE need for a woman physical therapist for the Saudi women. There were NONE in Kingdom. They ended up hiring an American woman, Jewish, and had no problem with her as she was a person "of the Book."
She stayed for a few years, made a ton of money then went home. Good for everyone all around.

When we returned home for good I got a wonderful job and taught YOGA for 27 years. I had to learn about Hinduism because, at the beginning, yoga WAS a form for worshiping Brahma, Shiva and Vishnu. The Indians have over 330 million gods/goddesses, human, animal, objects and mixtures thereof.
My husband used to say that SOMEWHERE in India SOMEONE is worshiping a '56 Chevy. :o)
One of tantric yoga's form is for wives to worship their husbands as a "god."

I thought that the entire arena of Indian deities was so weird that I just shook my head when I learned about it.

In the Catholic faith Orthodox Catholics ARE allowed to partake of Holy Communion, which we Catholics consider the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus, at our daily Mass.
However, Catholics, though we are ALLOWED to, MAY NOT partake of Orthodox Holy Communion because the Orthodoxies won't permit US to receive THEIR Holy Communion. It is NOT a two-way street.

It's all so ODD.

[Salvation]

The truth about heresy:

Catholic Word of the Day: HERESY, 09-21-13
They Just Won't Go Away: Ancient Heresies in Post-Modern Dress (Ecumenical)
Radio Replies Second Volume - Eutychianism
Radio Replies Second Volume - Nestorianism
Radio Replies Second Volume - Arianism
Radio Replies Second Volume - Manichaeism
Radio Replies Second Volume - Defections From the Catholic Church
Radio Replies Second Volume - Gnosticism
Marcionites

Nestorius on Mary as the Mother of God (Ecumenical)
The Day Nestorius Rocked the Church and an Empire
How Quickly Catholic Heresy Took Over the Church (Immediately)
Hilaire Belloc’s “The Great Heresies” now available in EPUB format
Chapter 6: The Modern Phase [The Great Heresies]
Chapter 5: What Was The Reformation? [The Great Heresies]
Chapter 4: The Albigensian Attack [The Great Heresies]
Chapter 3: The Great and Enduring Heresy of Mohammed [The Great Heresies]
Chapter 2: The Arian Heresy [The Great Heresies
Chapter 1: Scheme Of This Book [The Great Heresies]

Introduction: Heresy [The Great Heresies]
The Great Heresies
John Calvin’s Worst Heresy: That Christ Suffered in Hell
Evangelical Lutheran Church in America Succumbs to Heresy
The Bishop Discovers Heresy?
From Orthodox to Heresy: The Secularizing of Catholic Universities
Progressivism/Liberalism is Heresy [Excellent read & reference]
Is heresy better than schism? [Ecumenical]
Modernism: The Modernist Heresy
THE GREAT HERESIES-THE MODERN PHASE

The Protestant Heresy
The Gospel According to Mary Magdalene
Americanism, Then and Now: Our Pet Heresy (encyclical of Pope Leo XIII)
Heresies then and now: ancient Christian heresies practiced in modern times
The Plain Truth About The Baptist Bride Heresy
Balthasar, Hell, and Heresy: An Exchange (is it compatable with the Catholic faith?)
Know Your Heresies
The Rev. John Piper: an interesting look at "heresy vs. schism"
Pietism as an Ecclesiological Heresy
Heresy
Arian Heresy Still Tempts, Says Cardinal Bertone (Mentions Pelagianism As Well)

Catholic Discussion] Church group stays faithful (to heresy!)
An overview of modern anti-Trinitarian heresies
Where heresy and dissent abound [Minnesota]
Gnostic Gospels - the heresy entitled "Gnosticism."
Christian mavericks find affirmation in ancient heresies
The So-Called ‘Gospel’ of Judas: Unmasking an Ancient Heresy
Benedict XVI Heresies and Errors
Donatism (Know your heresies)
The Heresy of Mohammed (Chapter 4, The Great Heresies)
Father & Son Catholic Writers Tag-Team Old & New Heresies

[Elsie]

How’s the ride been so far?? ;^)

[Elsie]

1. I have a cousin whose mother gave him NO religion, no faith whatsoever, thinking that HE should decide when he was an adult.

Not QUITE my experience; but mighty close. I never went to church as a child with my parents; and only a few times with my cousin.

It wasn't until I was in the service that I ran across Christians who invited me to church.

Keep praying for your cousin.