Posted on 10/08/2013 7:18:20 PM PDT by RBStealth
A friend passed along a message from someone arguing that recent popes have not really been popes at all—in other words, that the See of Peter is vacant—which conveniently explains all the problems we have. The theory is called sede vacantism (from sede vacante, or empty chair). I wrote out a quick answer, and then decided I might as well publish it in case it would be of use to others. Perhaps it is not as polished as my usual commentaries, but here goes:
Dear Mrs. X –
People who hold the views in the email are already deep into conspiracy theory. They are not rational, and there is nothing to be gained from arguing with them. Catholics need to know when they are being baited, and should refuse to be drawn in unless they want to waste huge amounts of their time. These messages are much like the constant messages you get warning about computer viruses. The message IS the virus. It is designed, in effect, to clog your brain, to waste your time. I don’t mean the individual sender intends this; but the Devil certainly does.
...
(Excerpt) Read more at catholicculture.org ...
Does the current Pope preach this? If he does, he is worthy of the mantel. If he preaches you can be saved by any method except Jesus Christ, he is a heretic. Simple enough for me.
The modernists temper their poison with just enough Orthodox statements to keep the rubes fooled.
Wonder if that is where Eastwood got the idea...
Eastern Orthodox? What? I think you mean “orthodox”.
Yes, it’s much easier to call them irrational rather than actually reading up on what they truly believe and why they believe it.
I know, because I once thought that way about them.
Yep, that is the way the Modernists speak. Pius X explains this in his encyclical Pascendi against the Modernists. Francis speaks as a Modernist. Modernism is a heresy. True popes can not be heretics.
Francis speaks as a Modernist.
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Having read and listened to Jorge Bergoglio even before he became Pope, I heartily disagree with that statement.
AMEN, second it.
In your opinion are JPII and Francis true Popes.
Or are all the Post VatII Popes problematic and invalid?
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"Having read and listened to Jorge Bergoglio even before he became Pope, I heartily disagree with that statement."
Apparently you have neither read nor listened to what Jorge Bergoglio has had to say since becoming Pope:
Vatican II, inspired by Pope Paul VI and John, decided to look to the future with a modern spirit and to be open to modern culture. The Council Fathers knew that being open to modern culture meant religious ecumenism and dialogue with non-believers. But afterwards very little was done in that direction. I have the humility and ambition to want to do something." Pope Francis
"'To open oneself to modernity is a duty.' Pope Francis
What is it about CONTEXT that you don’t get? It is obvious that you do not know what this man has taught for years and years...and it has not changed.
There IS such a thing as good and holy ecumenism...or are you unaware of that? Vatican II was not thoroughly read by many clerics and lay...who then used it in ways it that were never intended....much like you are “reading” Pope Francis.
Are you praying for the Pope and the Church daily?
By the way, the Pope also describes how we ought to be praying...with courage:
“This makes us think, in our prayer: how do we pray? Do we pray like this, out of habit, piously but unbothered, or do we put ourselves forward with courage before the Lord to ask for the grace, to ask for what we’re praying for? Courage in prayer: a prayer that is not courageous is not a real prayer. The courage to trust that the Lord listens to us, the courage to knock on the door . . . The Lord says: ‘For everyone who asks, receives; and the one who seeks, finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened.’ But you have to ask, seek, and knock.”
“Do we get ourselves involved in prayer,” the Pope asked. “Do we know to knock at the heart of God?” In the Gospel Jesus says, “If you then, who are wicked, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will the Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to those who ask him?” This, the Pope said, “is a great thing”:
“When we pray courageously, the Lord gives us the grace, but He also gives us Himself in the grace: the Holy Spirit, that is, Himself! The Lord never gives or sends a grace by mail: never! He brings it Himself! What we ask for is a little bit like [laughing] . . . it is the envelope that grace is wrapped in. But the true grace is Him, Who comes to bring it to me. It’s Him. Our prayer, if it is courageous, receives what it asks for, but also that which is more important: the Lord.”
In the Gospel, the Pope noted, “some people receive the grace and then go away”: of the ten lepers healed by Jesus, only once returned to thank him. Even the blind man of Jericho found the Lord in the healing, and praised God. But we must pray “with the courage of faith” Pope Francis insisted, prompting us to ask even for those things that prayer does not dare hope for — that is, God Himself:
“We ask for a grace, but we don’t dare say, ‘But come Yourself to bring it to me.’ We know that a grace is always brought by Him: It is He Himself who comes and brings it to us. Let us not embarrass ourselves by taking the grace and not recognizing Him who brings it to us, Him who gives it to us: The Lord. That the Lord may give us the grace of giving us Himself, always, in every grace. And that we might recognize Him, and that we might praise Him as did the sick people in the Gospel who were healed. So that, in that grace, we might find the Lord.” ...Pope Francis
Ah yes, “context”, one of the oft repeated excuses.
Did the pre-Vatican II Church teach that Catholics (let alone Popes) should take part in non-Catholic services? Or is that what you call good and holy ecumenism?
I am praying for a true pope.
“He’s (Bergoglio) the one who opened the cathedral of Buenos Aires for interfaith ceremonies, like when we prayed for peace. He’s not one of those who waits for you to call them to participate in these events — he promotes them,” said Avruj, who met Bergoglio after both leaders launched projects in the same slum in a gritty area of southern Buenos Aires.
Bergoglio brought leaders of the Jewish, Muslim, evangelical and Orthodox Christian faiths into the Metropolitan Cathedral to pray for peace in the Middle East last November. “Everything is lost with war, everything is gained through peace,” Bergoglio said then. “With peace wins victory and respect.”
The archbishop also welcomed Jews for a joint service on the 74th anniversary of Kristallnacht, the night in 1938 when nearly 200 synagogues were destroyed, Jewish shops were looted and tens of thousands of Jews were sent to be exterminated in Adolf Hitler’s Germany.
And he also sponsored interfaith prayers after Pope Benedict XVI offended Muslims in 2006 by quoting a Byzantine emperor as saying some of the Prophet Muhammad’s teachings were “evil and inhuman.”
That time, rather than criticize Benedict directly, Bergoglio let a lower-ranking priest lead a service in which he himself did not participate. But leaders of other religions were impressed nonetheless.
Are you kidding? Pope Francis refused to bless his audience with the Sign of the Cross for fear of offending non-believers!
No, not daily; but hourly (during my waking hours) because the latter certainly needs protection from the former. It's not too often a Pope has so viciously attacked the Church; but this is not the first time. However, I fear it may be the last time.
As you can see from my previous post, Bishop Bergoglio sneakily criticized Pope Benedict's authority regarding the Regensburg address by hosting a muslim hug fest in reparation.
More recently he stated his predecessors were narcissists, yet he went on to proclaim he had the "humility" that they did not have to fully embrace the modernism called for by VC II.
What would Jesus have done?
Pope Francis refused to bless his audience with the Sign of the Cross for fear of offending non-believers!
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That’s ridiculous! How can you even say such a thing without any proof? Where do you get such ideas?
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