There are no knee jerk reactions on the FR religion forum!
Posted on 12/08/2012 2:24:39 PM PST by NYer
Insofar as they claimed being Catholic and taught heresies.
I don’t see how various attributes of Mary deny the sovereignty of Christ, through Whom she has them. Try again; or if you prefer, pick one of these quandaries and I’ll go over it in detail with you. It would be easier if you read the article first, which speaks of false Protestant dialectic very clearly.
Exactly, so neither he or she were free to marry.
Moral cleanness is indelibly stamped upon hundreds of pages of Luther's writings
What does it have to do with him fornicating with a nun? Or are you denying this historical fact?
Years later I read a report about astronomical observations that revealed that newly formed stars, during some stage of their creation, expel vast quantities of water from their North and South poles ~ this water is under tremendous pressure.
There we are ~ that's what we use to structure our form of life ~ double helix molecules ~ created with the stars.
The double helix structure, and water, give rise to sex itself ~
Life literally erupts from the churning cauldrons of the exploding supernova ~
Way down the line from those halcyon times we get hung up on the tab A and slot D business!
The Renaissance, with all its faults did not desecrate monasteries, burn Holy Icons or "marry" nuns; nor did Michaelangelo start his own "church".
Who is denying it. Luther was horny (most of the time). So was his "wife".
I didn't mean to imply that I thought you personally didn't understand something.
The typical Catholic knee jerk reaction to some former Catholic's exposing the inconsistencies in Catholic doctrine is to accuse them of having never *REALLY * understood the Catholic doctrine, usually due to being poorly catechized by the church. (Something which MANY of us former Catholics have been accused)
I think you may be on to something about the knee jerk reaction though. I've heard one too many protestant sermons of late telling me that it's sufficient to KNOW what scripture says but amending my life to DO what scripture says is optional. Doesn't sit too well when some who are willing to set aside portions of scripture tell me I'm the one relying on loopholes and failing to adhere to Biblical teaching ;) Thanks be to God not all Protestants preach that message but it's the one I'm hearing of late.
Sad to say, I couldn't agree more. I think in large part it's backlash against the works based salvation/legalism which has pervaded the church over the decades.
The problem is, holy living is not really an option for the believer and I think too many churches are throwing out the baby (the holy living to which we are called) with the bathwater (legalism).
The government of W. Bush used waterboarding, a form of torture.
Yeah, iconoclasm happened in Byzantium, equally revolting. Raping of nuns, probably, too from time to time. But in neither case was a new sect started for that, certainly not with the air of righteousness and superiority, so laughable in the Protestants. Catholics are fallible; Protestants made a religion out of their ignorance and their sins.
She was free to do whatever she wanted, just like the rest of us.
The RCC can CLAIM that all they want that they have authority over all people and they can try to back it all they want by appealing to the Scripture they claim they wrote, and they can threaten her with her eternal destiny, but Jesus saves, not the Catholic church. And the Catholic church's claims that they are God ordained do not hold up to close scrutiny when one takes a look at it's reprehensible, corrupt, immoral history.
“attributes”
No, they were attributed to her by those who want to worship a Goddess. Thereby totally ignoring that Christianity is NOT about her. Christianity is about being saved through the sacrifice of Jesus.
Mary was a mortal human being. I am not into Shintoism. I do not worship humans or my ancestors, period. It is not part of Christianity to do so.
So humans get together and declare someone a “Saint” with all the mysticism and unChristian theism that involves. God didn’t declare him a Saint or direct us to worship Saints.
The Prophets of the Bible are messengers. MESSENGERS. We do not worship messengers, because it is about the Message - not the conduit God used to deliver it.
Nowhere in the Bible does it tell us that anyone but Jesus is infallable or is to worshipped or prayed to. Nowhere does it tell us to submit to an earthly bureaucracy that declares itself the “One True Church” (A very cultish claim).
Mary and many others were human beings, FLAWED human beings, whom God used to deliver his wisdom and gifts to humankind. They are the chaff, they are the fluff, they are not the REASON.
We need help ~ everything is not clear, and our sector in this part of the universe is rather violent and destructive ~ we barely hang on ~ in the 4 billion years there's been signs of the most primitive life around here, it's only in the last half billion we've been able to find enough stability to work out the code for making brains and eyeballs!
God sends us messengers and moral teachers ~ and as Jesus reported, it's a tough life ~ so it wasn't our imagination. I can easily see a need for God to use a special mechanism so the messenger may arrive intact and ready to do whatever it is a messenger needs to do. This messenger has to live in our world, not just look at it as apparently do the creatures called angels. So, the Immaculate Conception, the Virgin Birth, the Perfect Man ~ the Physical Assumption into Heaven ~ it all sticks together as a great machine that translates the fabric of God's universe to our universe and allows Him to speak to us.
He must think we're pretty special even if we don't think that ourselves.
It is only bad when a new sect is formed from it?
The “crime” against the Church in Rome is much worse to you than all the raping in the world, sounds like. You worship THE CHURCH and not God is what it sounds like.
No one is doing anything to us ~ we do this ourselves, and you can be trained to deal with it. Torture is administered by others. This is not torture.
Sheesh, coming from the church known for it’s pederast priests.....
You know it had to eventually come to this ~ that we'd have Catholics and Protestants and Buddhists and Mormons together, sitting at the same table, figuring out how to convert the Democrats to freedom.
It's a hard job but somebody has to do it, and if not us who, and if not now, when?
The typical Catholic knee jerk reaction to some former Catholic's exposing the inconsistencies in Catholic doctrine is to accuse them of having never *REALLY * understood the Catholic doctrine, usually due to being poorly catechized by the church. (Something which MANY of us former Catholics have been accused)
Ah, I see what you meant. That never crossed my mind actually. You raise an interesting point though. When an exCatholic misstates Catholic doctrine or otherwise misrepresents the Church's position, what are we to conclude? (Not accusing you of doing this, just asking in general as it does happen on this site.) I'm not talking about presenting a position accurately and disagreeing with it. I'm talking about stating something false about the faith. It seems more charitable to say someone wasn't given proper instruction on the topic than to state the other possibility--that it's intentional distortion. Or is there another perspective I'm missing?
Peace be with you.
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