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Vatican Digs in After Gay Marriage Advances
AP ^ | 11/10/11 | Nicole Winfield

Posted on 11/11/2012 6:16:42 AM PST by marshmallow

VATICAN CITY (AP) -- The Vatican is digging in after gay marriage initiatives scored big wins this week in the U.S. and Europe, vowing to never stop insisting that marriage can only be between a man and a woman.

In a front-page article in Saturday's Vatican newspaper L'Osservatore Romano, the Holy See sought to frame itself as the lone voice of courage in opposing initiatives to give same-sex couples legal recognition. In a separate Vatican Radio editorial, the pope's spokesman asked sarcastically why gay marriage proponents don't now push for legal recognition for polygamous couples as well.

Catholic teaching holds that homosexuals should be respected and treated with dignity but that homosexual acts are "intrinsically disordered." The Vatican also opposes same-sex marriage, insisting on the sanctity of marriage between a man and woman as the foundation for society.

The Vatican's anti-gay marriage media blitz came after three U.S. states approved same-sex marriage by popular vote in the election that returned Barack Obama to the U.S. presidency, Spain upheld its gay marriage law, and France pushed ahead with legislation that could see gay marriage legalized early next year.

"One might say the church, at least on this front, has been defeated," L'Osservatore Romano wrote. "But that's not the case."

(Excerpt) Read more at hosted.ap.org ...


TOPICS: Catholic; Moral Issues; Religion & Culture
KEYWORDS: catholicvote; homosexualagenda; idiotsdidntvote4mitt

1 posted on 11/11/2012 6:16:47 AM PST by marshmallow
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To: marshmallow

2 posted on 11/11/2012 6:24:43 AM PST by RC one (Akin/Mourdock-2016)
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To: marshmallow

Onward Christian Soldiers!


3 posted on 11/11/2012 6:25:40 AM PST by Wiggins
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To: marshmallow

“Now, since the family and human society at large spring from marriage, these men will on no account allow matrimony to be the subject of the jurisdiction of the Church. Nay, they endeavor to deprive it of all holiness, and so bring it within the contracted sphere of those rights which, having been instituted by man, are ruled and administered by the civil jurisprudence of the community. Wherefore it necessarily follows that they attribute all power over marriage to civil rulers, and allow none whatever to the Church; and, when the Church exercises any such power, they think that she acts either by favor of the civil authority or to its injury. Now is the time, they say, for the heads of the State to vindicate their rights unflinchingly, and to do their best to settle all that relates to marriage according as to them seems good.”

—Pope Leo XIII, 1880

Freegards


4 posted on 11/11/2012 6:33:32 AM PST by Ransomed
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To: marshmallow

The Catholic Church needs to recognise the fact that 90% of those attending their Church are Cafetaria Catholics.

They look at all of the rules and pick the ones they will obey.

Now I am not in any way saying that they should change all of their rules to adapt to the popular vote on which ones Catholics obey, I am only stating a fact.

Catholics use Birth Control, Catholics have abortions, Catholics live together out of wedlock, Catholics divorce, Catholics take Communion without going to Confession ,Some Catholics are Homosexual,

The Church can and should fight for what is right, the problem is that in todays world, the people are picking and choosing what they think is right. Even the nuns.

The Church lets Pelosi and Biden and other do what they like and say nothing, and then they expect ordinary people to do as the Church says. People see this and they do as they please the same as Pelosi and Biden. The Church cannot continue to allow its people who are in the limelight to do one thing and expect the lay people to not do the same.

So the people pick and choose.


5 posted on 11/11/2012 6:36:38 AM PST by Venturer
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To: marshmallow

The Catholic Church has outlasted every government and every unfaithful internal movement that has tried to coerce it to leave the teachings of Jesus Christ and do what the “world” says. As a child, we prayed for the conversion of Russia - now we need to pray for the conversion of America!


6 posted on 11/11/2012 6:42:46 AM PST by MassRepublican
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To: MassRepublican
"As a child, we prayed for the conversion of Russia - now we need to pray for the conversion of America!"

Amen!
7 posted on 11/11/2012 6:48:34 AM PST by 2sheds
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To: marshmallow

So called “Homosexual Marriage” is like “Unicycle Spaceflight” First, there ain’t no such animal and second, redefining spaceflight to include unicycles can only be done in the minds of the insane.


8 posted on 11/11/2012 6:56:02 AM PST by Happy Rain ("Old White Male Conservative and you can kiss my bleeping bleep!!!")
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To: Venturer
"Catholics use Birth Control, Catholics have abortions, Catholics live together out of wedlock, Catholics divorce, Catholics take Communion without going to Confession ,Some Catholics are Homosexual,"

It is those Catholics that are wrong - not the Church. They choose the wrong path. Jesus said the path would be hard. The Church always has the doors open. Even the worst can be saved, if they choose to take the path Christ has laid out. As far as Pelosi and Biden? God gives us free will - when they receive communion unworthily, they bring judgement upon themselves. What is new about Catholics - or people of any Christian religion - picking and choosing what they want to believe? It has ever been so. We choose to sin or not to sin.

Where I very much agree is about nuns. They take a vow of obedience. They and our priests and bishops should set the example of holiness and obedience.

Just my uneducated and humble opinion.

God Bless

sneaks

9 posted on 11/11/2012 7:00:14 AM PST by sneakers (Go Sheriff Joe!)
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To: marshmallow

Time for the Pope to step up: issue a formal proclamation that all who proclaim support for gay marriage and abortion (pro-choice) are prohibited from taking Holy Communion.


10 posted on 11/11/2012 7:04:29 AM PST by Night Hides Not (The Tea Party was the earthquake, and Chick Fil A the tsunami...100's of aftershocks to come.)
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To: marshmallow

I think the Vatican understands that the democrat party here in the US probably don’t give a hoot about so called “gay marriages”, they are directly attacking Christianity...These are Marxists, they hate Christianity, they hate liberty, they hate morality, hence they hate us.


11 posted on 11/11/2012 7:08:18 AM PST by Wpin ("I Have Sworn Upon the Altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny...")
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To: sneakers

I agree with your opinion, I was just pointing out in my incompetent way that if catholics pick and choose what sins they commit they also pick who they vote for, and they pick the guy that supports their sins.


12 posted on 11/11/2012 7:12:27 AM PST by Venturer
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To: marshmallow

Time to sack up and start Excommunicating these vectors for issues like abortion.


13 posted on 11/11/2012 7:18:25 AM PST by Jake8898
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To: marshmallow

God defines marriage, not the State. Any “marriage” a State defines is just as much as legal fiction as when it tells us that a corporation is a “person” that has freedom of speech.

Jesus tells us in Matthew chapter 19 that from the beginning of humanity, it was God’s intent that marriage would only be one man and one woman. Scripture in many ways and places also tells us that God defines sexual morality and that people who refuse to practice that His morality simply do not qualify for His freely given gift of eternal life. (for example, see Ephesians chapter 5)

The State attempts to force us to recognize its power. One way is to presume the power to define who is married and who is not. We cede this power in part because we allow the State to tax incomes and estates. To administer such taxing power, the State must define who it considers to be “married” and who is not. Just as when it defines a corporation to be a “person”, as silly as this would be to God, the State does not hesitate to define anyone it pleases as being “married, totally apart from how God would define them.

If you review the arguments advanced by supporters of same-sex marriage, you will find that many of them are related to taxation, inheritance and medical issues. But existing law addresses those and any defects in the law can be easily repaired apart from the issue of “marriage”.

I don’t want a government that can tell me what I may or may not do in the privacy of my own home or relationships. In a Constitutional Republic with a provision that prohibits Congress from making any law respecting religion, I have to allow others to have their own beliefs and morality. I can only be an advocate for the morality and beliefs that I think are true. I take my understanding of sexual morality from Scripture and that is where I learn that God considers sodomy to be an abomination to Him.

If a State decides that two (or more) people can marry, if that is all that happened, I could live with that because I don’t have to approve, change my beliefs or what beliefs I pass on to my children.

However, once gays and their supporters have sufficient influence with a State to redefine marriage, they don’t stop there. They use the State to forbid me from acting on my morality and beliefs. In fact, the State in some cases forces me to accommodation in their practices.

If I have children in public school, the State will insist on teaching them that gay marriage is just as normal as the God’s marriage. You will be sanctioned as a parent if you attempt to remove your child from such indoctrination.

If you run a business that could provide services to the public, you will be sanctioned if you decline to treat gays as non-gays. For example, if you run a wedding photography business, you will be sanctioned if you decline to photograph a gay wedding.

In short, gays will demand that non-gays accept them as moral equals, which they are not and cannot be. When the State says they are equal it is forbidden for a private citizen to dissent from that status. In doing so, they seek to force me to give them approval for something that I will never approve of. It is that last point that galls gays the most.

Curiously, when advocates of gay marriage are asked if their policy also would allow polygamy or polyandry, they recoil in horror and insist that it does not. However, logic demands that it does. I would ask how same-sex parents are going to react in the future when, for example, Utah public schools insist on indoctrinating the children that LDS-related polygamy is just as “normal” as same-sex “marriage”. The fact that this will be an issue will show yet again that gay “marriage” is not about marriage at all it is about forcing the rest of us to approve of repugnant sexual immorality, something that LDS polygamists never demanded.


14 posted on 11/11/2012 7:42:03 AM PST by theBuckwheat
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To: theBuckwheat

Followup to my post:

Refusing To Shoot Gay Marriage Is Discrimination, Says New Mexico Appeals Court

http://www.popphoto.com/news/2012/06/refusing-to-shoot-gay-marriage-discrimination-says-new-mexico-appeals-court


15 posted on 11/11/2012 7:50:21 AM PST by theBuckwheat
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To: marshmallow

I prefere a church with strong voice backed by action, not the mealy-mouthed blessings and mumbling from the pope. If you do not want homosexual marriage SAY SO! Loud and clear. Condemn homosexual marriage. God and your followers may actually get behind you and fight for righteousness once again.

Internal homosexuality has weakened the Church’s voice and standing in the world. Here is an opportunity to begin restoring the name “Catholic Church” to once again fight for things good, beautiful, and true like marriage between a man and a woman.


16 posted on 11/11/2012 8:40:04 AM PST by Rapscallion ( OBAMA: You own it now.)
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To: Venturer
The Church lets Pelosi and Biden and other do what they like and say nothing, and then they expect ordinary people to do as the Church says.

That's why the Catholic Church has lost it's credibility.

The Catholic Church 30 or so years ago should have started excommunicating high profile politicians who held and encouraged views contrary to the dogmatic teaching of the Church.

It's a 2 step process, You send a letter notifying the person his views are in conflict with the Church's- if they persist in those views you excommunicate them. The Church hasn't done that and they have lost credibility with the public. -tom

17 posted on 11/11/2012 8:45:56 AM PST by Capt. Tom
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To: Venturer
and they pick the guy that supports their sins

Even though they know in their hearts that the devil is now in the driver's seat of what was once the most moral government on planet earth.

18 posted on 11/11/2012 8:47:00 AM PST by Rapscallion ( OBAMA: You own it now.)
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To: Capt. Tom

Correct.

And every Catholic knows there are no repercussions.


19 posted on 11/11/2012 8:50:26 AM PST by jjotto ("Ya could look it up!")
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To: marshmallow
I don’t think that there has been an Excommunication in the US since Leander Perez in LA in the ‘60’s, the time has come.
20 posted on 11/11/2012 8:52:02 AM PST by Little Bill (A)
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To: Rapscallion
If you do not want homosexual marriage SAY SO! Loud and clear.

I think my priest's voice is still hoarse from shouting the homily saying just that.

And then a strongly-worded position paper was handed out for those hard of hearing.

21 posted on 11/11/2012 8:52:30 AM PST by steve86 (Acerbic by Nature, not Nurture tm)
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To: Venturer

Oh. OK. :-)


22 posted on 11/11/2012 8:58:48 AM PST by sneakers (Go Sheriff Joe!)
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To: Venturer
I am only stating a fact.

Incorrect. You're stating a poorly formed opinion, only.

23 posted on 11/11/2012 9:10:45 AM PST by A.A. Cunningham (Barry Soetoro is a Kenyan communist)
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To: Little Bill
I don’t think that there has been an Excommunication in the US since Leander Perez in LA in the ‘60’s,

Perhaps you should engage in some research before publicly speculating.

24 posted on 11/11/2012 9:16:02 AM PST by A.A. Cunningham (Barry Soetoro is a Kenyan communist)
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To: Rapscallion
"Internal homosexuality has weakened the Church’s voice and standing in the world."

Homosexuality in the Church is but a symptom of the heresy of Modernism that has infected the Church.

More than a hundred years ago the Church recognized the dangers of this modernist view and identified it as a heresy. Pope Pius X wisely dubbed Modernism "the synthesis of all heresies”. Today, Modernism remains a corrosive threat to the Church because it appeals to our vanities and masquerades as enlightenment and tolerance.

Modernism is not identifiable as a dogmatic difference with the Church, rather it is a belief that doctrine and dogma are somehow of secondary importance to its fundamental moral teachings. Arising from within the Protestant reformation, it infects the body of the Church with the notion that the highest truths are those that arise from and or appeal to our reason.

Our “Modern” culture is full of the practice and outright evangelization of Modernism. It has often become the state religion. Every hard decision we are faced with has an easier answer if we succumb to Modernism. We can absolve or diminish every grave and minor sin if we can fabricate a moral construct in which the sinner can remain “a good person”. As a consequence we live in a country in which millions of unborn are killed every year, the institution of the family is being destroyed and our children can expect a standard of living less than ours.

Peace be with you.

25 posted on 11/11/2012 9:17:43 AM PST by Natural Law (Jesus did not leave us a Bible, He left us a Church.)
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To: Capt. Tom

What should Protestant Churches do?


26 posted on 11/11/2012 9:23:46 AM PST by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
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To: D-fendr

Since homsexuality is condemned in the Bible as “an abomination”it seems clear that all Christian churches should condemn homsexuality and not allow those who practice it nay position of authority.


27 posted on 11/11/2012 9:32:17 AM PST by hoosierham (Freedom isn't free)
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To: A.A. Cunningham
Perez and the Catholic Church

In the spring of 1962, the Archdiocese of New Orleans announced its plan to desegregate the New Orleans parochial school system for the 1962–1963 school year. Perez led a movement to pressure businesses into firing any whites who allowed their children to attend the newly desegregated Catholic schools. Catholics in St. Bernard Parish boycotted one school, which the Archdiocese kept open without students for four months until it was burned down. In response, Archbishop Joseph Rummel excommunicated Perez on April 16, 1962. Perez responded by saying the Catholic Church was “being used as a front for clever Jews” and announced that he would form his own church, the “Perezbyterians.”

Leander Perez tomb in Metairie Cemetery, New Orleans
Perez also described himself at one point as “a Catholic, but not an Archbishop's Catholic.”[3] He eventually reconciled with the church before his death after issuing a retraction [7] and received a requiem mass at Holy Name of Jesus Christ Church at Loyola University in New Orleans.

I remember that he and his family groveled;

28 posted on 11/11/2012 9:43:23 AM PST by Little Bill (A)
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To: hoosierham

Thanks, but what should Protestant Churches do regarding politicians similar to your post 17?


29 posted on 11/11/2012 10:50:55 AM PST by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
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To: MassRepublican

“As a child, we prayed for the conversion of Russia - now we need to pray for the conversion of America!”

What a sad, sad commentary. I truly believe that as of Tuesday past, the USA is now a Third World nation. God help us (not that we deserve it).


30 posted on 11/11/2012 11:51:58 AM PST by EDINVA
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To: netmilsmom; thefrankbaum; Tax-chick; GregB; saradippity; Berlin_Freeper; Litany; SumProVita; ...

Catholic ping!


31 posted on 11/11/2012 12:17:27 PM PST by NYer ("Before I formed you in the womb I knew you." --Jeremiah 1:5)
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To: Venturer

The Church is recognizing this. THAT is why, in this Year of Faith, the focus is to be on the evangelization of those in the pews....as well as those who are not often in the pews.


32 posted on 11/11/2012 12:22:54 PM PST by SumProVita (Cogito, ergo....Sum Pro Vita - Modified Descartes)
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To: Venturer

Source for your statistics, please.


33 posted on 11/11/2012 1:48:08 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

I am the source, dispute it if you can


34 posted on 11/11/2012 3:17:31 PM PST by Venturer
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To: D-fendr

Both Catholic and Protestant churches ought to be reminding their epople that Jesus did say go and sin no more and I think there were instructions not to associate with those who will not listen to correction or try to mend their ways.


35 posted on 11/11/2012 10:39:30 PM PST by hoosierham (Freedom isn't free)
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To: Wiggins; marshmallow
One thing to note is that Vatican newspaper L'Osservatore Romano is incorrect. The "L'Osservatore" is a newspaper of the Vatican city-state. it does not purport to be, nor is, the religious voice of the Pope or the Catholic Church as a whole.

I'll wait for a separate pronouncement from the Church for an "official statement"

36 posted on 11/12/2012 3:49:06 AM PST by Cronos (**Marriage is about commitment, cohabitation is about convenience.**)
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To: Rapscallion
with strong voice backed by action,

Pray can you tell us which one has this strong voice and numbers > 1 million congregants? Anything smaller, the voice is not heard

37 posted on 11/12/2012 3:55:38 AM PST by Cronos (**Marriage is about commitment, cohabitation is about convenience.**)
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