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Happy Reformation Day
Esler.org ^
| October 31, 2012
| Ted
Posted on 10/31/2012 2:40:55 PM PDT by Alex Murphy
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The Catholic Church, in the early 1550s, demanded not only spiritual obedience but was a mark of citizenship. The act of separating oneself from the Church was an act of disloyalty to the European order. It was a radical act but one that cemented the newly forming Protesting Church into what sociologist call a densely packed social network. Benjamin Franklin captured what these types of no return acts do for a movement at the signing of the American Declaration of Independence: We must all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately.... ....There are few eras that have been as ripe for change as the 1500s. Luther walked into a century that would give us Da Vinci, Galileo, the first globe, incredible intercontinental adventures, flush toilets, and bottled beer. The list goes on and on! The religious culture of Western Europe had become a fusion of folk mysticism blended with Catholicism. People were searching for more substantial answers to the problems of life and Luthers Bible translation was ready to fill that void.
One could argue that the Reformation has affected global Christianity more than any other historical event since the New Testament era. I find it telling that today we celebrate Halloween, a part of that mystical folk religion of Europe, on this day rather than Luthers unknowing act of bravery. Instead of teaching our children to say trick or treat perhaps they should learn to say, Happy Reformation Day.
To: Alex Murphy
“Reformation Day” is not in my Bible.
2
posted on
10/31/2012 2:53:05 PM PDT
by
Campion
("Social justice" begins in the womb)
To: Alex Murphy
It occured to me that what Islam is missing is a “Martin Luther”. The Reformation Movement brought much needed change to a monolithic religion and opened discussion about the role of the church.
3
posted on
10/31/2012 3:09:26 PM PDT
by
Makana
To: Alex Murphy
“...a relatively unknown German monk pounded a proclamation of sorts onto a church door in Wittenburg, Germany.”
I never heard of Reformation Day before you started posting, but now that you remind me, you Lutherans owe us Catholics for a new church door.
4
posted on
10/31/2012 3:30:57 PM PDT
by
Owl558
("Those who remember George Satayana are doomed to repeat him")
To: Campion
Neither is “Christmas” or “Easter.”
5
posted on
10/31/2012 3:32:50 PM PDT
by
bubbacluck
(I'll pay more for tomatoes...or lettuce.)
To: Makana
It occured to me that what Islam is missing is a Martin Luther. The Reformation Movement brought much needed change to a monolithic religion and opened discussion about the role of the church.
There have been many Islamic Martin Luthers
6
posted on
10/31/2012 3:33:59 PM PDT
by
GraceG
To: Owl558
I never heard of Reformation Day before you started posting, but now that you remind me, you Lutherans owe us Catholics for a new church door.
To: Alex Murphy
Too bad he didn’t look to the East. Many of his complaints would have been answered by Orthodoxy. However, transubstantiation would have been one sticky wicket.
8
posted on
10/31/2012 3:53:58 PM PDT
by
firebasecody
(Orthodoxy, proclaiming the Truth since AD 33)
To: liege; Campion
Nor is pope. The word reverend is mentioned once but only in reference to God.
9
posted on
10/31/2012 3:55:02 PM PDT
by
BipolarBob
(Willie Stark for president.)
To: Alex Murphy
Eventually, he would come to fame as part of a Paul McCartney song (along with Bill and Dawn/Don).
10
posted on
10/31/2012 3:56:03 PM PDT
by
freedumb2003
(We canÂ’t just leave it (food choice) up to the parents. -- moochele obozo 2/12/2012 (cnsnews))
To: GraceG
Luther, at least to my knowledge, never killed anybody.
To: Jacob Kell
Did he at least sell indulgences to finance his ministry?
12
posted on
10/31/2012 4:39:12 PM PDT
by
BipolarBob
(Willie Stark for president.)
To: Owl558
***you Lutherans owe us Catholics for a new church door.***
And you will have it for sale on E-Bay before the new door has it’s hinge pins driven in! ;-D
To: firebasecody
***Too bad he didnt look to the East. Many of his complaints would have been answered by Orthodoxy.***
I remember reading here on FR many years ago that Luther DID try to contact the Patriarch of Constantinople several times.
As for transubstantiation, I believe Lutherans do believe in it.
To: Jacob Kell
Luther, at least to my knowledge, never killed anybody.
I was referring tot he poor guy who was missing his body...
Lot of Islamic Luthers have been missing wither their heads or their bodies....
15
posted on
10/31/2012 5:39:46 PM PDT
by
GraceG
To: Ruy Dias de Bivar
To: ReformationFan; Ruy Dias de Bivar; firebasecody
Not quite right, we call it the Doctrine of the Real Presence:
"Luther's position (particularly as developed by subsequent Lutheranism) is referred to as a "real physical presence" of Christ in the elements. The bread is still bread, but it is also truly the body of Christ. And while the wine does not lose its "wine-ness", it is very much the actual blood of Christ. Luther found Jesus' words "This is my body" (Hoc est corpus meum) as a mandate for such an understanding. This view is often conflated with consubstantiation, which is a philosophical rather than a theological view."
17
posted on
10/31/2012 6:50:43 PM PDT
by
stayathomemom
(Beware of kittens modifying your posts.)
To: GraceG
I don’t understand the significance of the artwork - sword slicing off head.
18
posted on
10/31/2012 7:18:32 PM PDT
by
Ciexyz
To: GraceG
I don’t understand the significance of the artwork - sword slicing off head.
19
posted on
10/31/2012 7:19:07 PM PDT
by
Ciexyz
To: Alex Murphy
Perhaps the time is ripe for a new movement.Yup -- the problem is the motto "semper reformanda" -- always reforming. There are new directions being found, new interpretations everyday.
Each new bunch of Reformatters reformats the old.
- You have the first generation namely Lutheran sticking close to orthodoxy with the Lutherans holding to the True Presence in the Eucharist, to Baptismal regeneration etc.
- Generation 2: Then you have the Calvin-Zwingli crowd rejecting these two as well as other aspects of orthodoxy
- Generation 3: Knox and the Anglican compromise
- Generation 4: The Unitarians like Michael Servetus who went from being Catholic to Lutheran to Reformed to denying the Trinity.
- Generation 5: the Baptists who now rejected infant baptism (quite unlike their namesakes the Anabaptists (now called Mennonites)) and said that there was a great Apostasy in the first centuries of Christendom (Gen 1-3 took later centuries as the dates of their "Great Apostasy")
- Generation 6: the Restorationists at the Great Awakening, like
- The Millerites, to become the Seventh DayAdventists -- with Ellen G White saying that Jesus was the same as the Archangel Michael and that Satan woudl take the sins of the world at the end of time and other beauties. They came up with their own version of the Bible
- The Unitarians and Universalists -- reborn and reinvigorated by this reformatting, they tossed out the Trinity and eventually they end up as they are today where they believe in nothing
- Jehovah's Witnesses: they tossed out the Trinity too and came up with their own version of the Bible
- The Mormons: they took the Trinity and made it three gods. They too came up with their own version of the Bible
- Generation 7: the Orthodo Presbyterian C, the FourSquare Ahoy! Pentecostalists, the Raelians, the Branch Davidians, the Creflo-Dollar crowd, the Jesse Dupantis (I went to visit Jesus in heaven and comforted Him) etc -- one step further beyond generation 6
- Generation 8: ... any one of the new sects formed since 1990
20
posted on
11/01/2012 12:21:59 AM PDT
by
Cronos
(**Marriage is about commitment, cohabitation is about convenience.**)
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