Posted on 08/16/2011 7:16:05 AM PDT by marbren
unfortunately elsie, you’ve been given the wrong info as to what the church was built on....that definition of peter’s ‘confession’ on which the church is built, is simply historically inaccurate....you most likely heard this from a ‘pastor’ who know doubt, would claim to be christ centered, as well...
That has been my experience with Baptist churches I have attended and also with the few non-denominational ones as well. I would stop attending a church if the pastor was treated as the "star" of the church. He is commanded to be the servant, just as Jesus said he came not to be served but to serve. A non-denom I went to about 20 years ago had the most wonderful man as the pastor. It was not a huge congregation so they could not provide a big salary, but he didn't care and he worked at another job during the week and still was one of the best pastors I have ever known. A humble man who loved the Lord and his fellow believers. THAT is the kind of man the Lord intended to shepherd the flock of God.
I agree. The pastor has or should have a board of elders who together lead the congregation. These elders/deacons have a responsibility to be examples to the members as well as to support the pastor in his role of equipping the saints of God. There is accountability. There is sort of chain of command like in the ship example. The pastor is the captain, the elders and deacons the officers and the congregation is the crew. Together, they glorify the Lord in all that they do.
Well said and welcome to Free Republic!
If a pastor or elder’s wife or children die suddenly, is he then removed from that office?
No, why would he be? Even if a Pastor's wife or child were to die suddenly, he still fulfilled the requirements necessary for the office.
But the association is voluntary and does not hold authority over the local congregation.
When those pastors get together and discuss things, there is no rule making body that forces the other churches to change, but I guarantee you that agreed upon consensus items are quickly brought forward in all of the churches of the association.
It is voluntary. A body of believers united by being members of the Body of Christ. You are not describing a top down hierarchy.
I am describing a hierarchy, whether voluntary or not. A hierarchy does not have to be a dictatorship.
James led in Jerusalem, the Council of Jerusalem sent a letter of encouraged instruction to the churches. It was delivered by leading Christians connected to those churches who passed it to the leading Christians within those churches.
That is MORE than a network. It is an authoritative network.
I KNOW independent baptists, and they, too, have an authoritative network.
Yea, The ones I've known that lost a wife just removed themselves, not like the Church removes them.
I Timothy says they MUST be husband of one wife
I Timothy 3:1-7
It is a trustworthy statement: if any man aspires to the office of overseer, it is a fine work he desires to do. 2 An overseer, then, must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, prudent, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, 3 not addicted to wine or pugnacious, but gentle, peaceable, free from the love of money. 4 He must be one who manages his own household well, keeping his children under control with all dignity 5 (but if a man does not know how to manage his own household, how will he take care of the church of God?), 6 and not a new convert, so that he will not become conceited and fall into the condemnation incurred by the devil. 7 And he must have a good reputation with those outside the church, so that he will not fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
Furthermore, if a Pastor can only be a man who is currently married, wouldn't that negate the Apostle Paul from being a pastor since he was single at the time that he wrote 1 Timothy?
I don't know if there's any truth to the matter, but I've heard that Paul was actually either a widower or his wife had left him. The basis for this assumption, I've been told, is that a Jewish Pharisee, such as Paul was, was required by Jewish tradition to be a married man and that because Paul makes mention several times of being single, it's a pretty good indicator that his wife had either died or abandoned him.
Either way, there's something odd here and I'd love to know the truth.
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Yes, 1 Tim. 3 does state that a Pastor must be a husband of only one wife but does her death somehow negate the husband’s commitment to their marriage?
Furthermore, if a Pastor can only be a man who is currently married, wouldn’t that negate the Apostle Paul from being a pastor since he was single at the time that he wrote 1 Timothy?
Can’t remember where in the Bible is the Apostle Paul referred to as an elder, I could be wrong. I view Paul more as a Preacher or Evangelist, not an Elder/Pastor/Overseer, for sure an Apostle
Paul wasn’t married: 1 Cor 7:7
Peter was an elder and Married. 1 Peter 5:1 “I [Peter] ... your “FELLOW elder”
Jesus came to Peter’s house and healed “his wife’s mother” (Matthew 8:14- 5; Mark 1:30-31)
Israel, using common sense, rejected Samuel. Samuel, using common sense, wanted his sons to take over. He was old and His sons were useless. Israel rejected God and God gave them over to their desire to restrain them. David was always God’s Prince to shepherd his People. King Saul was full of fear and no Faith. He was a curse to Israel.
God never wanted for Israel to have a King, God was their leader/king, God had chosen Israel to be his people and God wanted Israel to choose Him to be their leader, but as is the history with Israel they rebelled and forgot all that God had done for them and chose a King against Gods desire, and Samuel the Prophet/preacher simply told them what the king would do to them, which Saul did! I certainly don’t think it is good common sense to choose a man over God, wasn’t a good idea then, and it still isn’t a good idea today!
I agree to a point, But David was always meant to be a Prince of God known as the King of Israel.
Good point. To focus too much on what word is there or not
I am afraid I still have not began to see what is going on around me in the spiritual world however I now see the “world” as much larger then I thought. Everything outside of the Word is a lie from Satan.
Hopefully my eyes will open to the spiritual battle before long
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