Posted on 01/18/2009 6:08:09 AM PST by greyfoxx39
| In Search of Book of Mormon Geography | |
| The Book of Mormon is supposed to be a history of real people living in a real place. For the first 150 years of Mormonism's existence, everyone thought it was a story about a people who left the Middle East and came to South or Central America, and who fought wars clear up into New York state where their history was hidden in a hillside, inscribed on gold plates. Joseph Smith, in 1830, translated those plates, he said, by "the gift and power of God," into 1611 English from "Reformed Egyptian Hieroglyphics." Or so the story goes. However, one needs to look no further than New York, Pennsylvania, and Ohio to find the setting of the Book of Mormon. Whoever pieced the Book of Mormon together had a land in mind which was very similar to the Northeast United States and Southeast Canada. My friend, the late Vernal Holley, originally published these maps in his book Book of Mormon Authorship: A Closer Look in the early 1980s. I was fascinated with them then and remain so today. Basically, the two maps compare a "proposed map" constructed by Vernal from the internal descriptions of the Book of Mormon and comments, over the years by Latter-day Saint scholars, with a map showing actual place names on maps of the area around Palmyra, New York, where to the Book of Mormon originally was published. Vernal gave me permission to put the whole book on line. I just need the time to do that. In the meantime I hope you enjoy this. |
|
| The first map is the "proposed map," constructed from internal comparisons in the Book of Mormon. Throughout the Book of Mormon we read of such features as "The Narrow Neck of Land" which was a days and a half's journey (roughly 30 miles) separating two great seas. We read much of the Hill Onidah, the Hill Ramah, and the city of the City of Angola—all place names in the land of Joseph Smith's youth. We read, in the Book of Mormon of the Land of Desolation named for a warrior named Teancum who helped General Moroni fight in the Land of Desolation. In Smith's era, an Indian Chief named Tecumseh fought and died near the narrow neck of land helping the British in the War of 1812. Today the Canadian city Techumseh (near the narrow neck of land) is named after him. We see the Book of Mormon city Kishkumen located near an area named, on modern maps, as Kiskiminetas. There are more than two dozen Book of Mormon names that are the same as or nearly the same as modern geographical locations. See below |
|
| Below is the modern Map of the area of Smith's Youth | |
| Book of Mormon place names compared to actual Northeast US/Southeast Canada place names Canadian locations are marked with an asterisk and appear in the Book of Mormon as lying in "The Land Northward" |
| ACTUAL PLACE NAMES *Agathe, Saint Alma Angola Antrim Antioch Boaz Jerusalem Monroe Noah Lakes |
BOOK OF MORMON PLACE NAMES Ogath Alma, Avlley of Angola Antum Anti-Anti Boaz Jerusalem Moroni Noah, Land of |
| Copyright 1989, 1992 by Vernal Holley Used by permission. |
|
http://www.uwec.edu/geOGrApHY/Ivogeler/w188/utopian/mormon-place-names.htm
Ping
Here is some video explaining the book of Mormon. The music that goes with this video is superb.
http://www.southparkstudios.com/guide/712/
Ping
Ugh, this isn’t going to be pretty.
Book of Mormon geography, New World
http://en.fairmormon.org/Book_of_Mormon_geography:New_World
Judaism and Christianity has survived the scrutiny. Not this predecessor to Scientology.
Hemispheric Geographists
Some Mormon scholars refuse to budge from the traditional view that the Lehites and Jaredites were the primary American colonists. To them, the Book of Mormon narrative leaves insufficient wiggle room to include hoards of non-Israelite “others”. These scholars find it hard to dismiss numerous statements in support of the hemispheric view by former prophets including Joseph Smith. Moreover, they cannot stomach the strained re-interpretations of the Book of Mormon that Limited Geographists make in order to accommodate the millions of non-Israelites who have lived in the New World for tens of millenia.
Limited Geographists
Most apologists now shun popular LDS views of the scale of the Book of Mormon story in New World prehistory. Overwhelming scientific evidence that American Indians are essentially all descended from Siberian ancestors and have lived in the Americas for about 20,000 years has led many apologists to shrink the Book of Mormon geography to limited territories in Mesoamerica. Rather than the Lehites entering a continent “kept as yet from the knowledge of other nations,”8 we have them entering densely populated pre-existing civilizations and their DNA being diluted away to undetectable levels. Numerous other problems such as a requirement for a second Mesoamerican Hill Cumorah and the transportation of the gold plates over 3000 miles to the New York Hill Cumorah are swept under the carpet in the apologetic rush. Another awkward problem is that the God, speaking to Joseph Smith in LDS scripture, frequently refers to American Indians in North America as the Lamanites (See Doctrine and Covenants 28:8-9, 14; 30:6; 32:2; 54:8).
North American Geographists
A new group of apologists is breathing a new lease of life into a geography theory that has long been regarded with suspicion by mainstream BYU apologists. Spearheaded recently by Rod Meldrum,27 a non-scientist with a background in marketing, this resurging theory argues that Book of Mormon events did not take place in Central America, but rather in the northeastern United States in the vicinity of the Ohio Valley and Great Lakes. Meldrum is joined in his campaign by fellow Mormon Wayne May, editor and publisher of Ancient American,28 a magazine produced largely by Mormons. The editorial position of the journal is that it “stands firmly on behalf of evidence for the arrival of overseas visitors to the Americas hundreds and even thousands of years before Columbus.” These visitors are believed to have contributed to the “birth and development of numerous and sophisticated civilizations which flourished throughout the American Continents in pre-Columbian times.”
Alternative Geographists
It may come as a surprise to some readers that there are many apologists who see the Book of Mormon events as having occurred outside the Americas. The weight of scientific evidence against the possibility of an American setting has been sufficiently compelling, and their faith in the historical claims of the Book of Mormon sufficiently rigid, that they have looked elsewhere. Ralph Olson, a retired chemistry professor, has argued that the narrative can be more comfortably situated on the Malay Peninsula than in Mesoamerica.32 In his book, A More Promising Land of Promise, he presents an eclectic array of evidences to back up his theory, interspersed with criticism of the Limited Geographists, including the challenge created by DNA studies. In Olson’s defence, positioning the Book of Mormon narrative in Asia neatly overcomes such anachronisms as the lack of Old World horses, cattle, and goats and crops such as wheat and barley. I will not dwell on Olson’s theories as mainstream LDS apologists have shown no interest in them. Insufficient DNA research has been conducted on native people of the Malay Peninsula; however, Cambodians were shown by Noah Rosenberg to be closely related to other East Asians, who are only distantly related to Middle Easterners.
Hemispheric Geographists
Some Mormon scholars refuse to budge from the traditional view that the Lehites and Jaredites were the primary American colonists. To them, the Book of Mormon narrative leaves insufficient wiggle room to include hoards of non-Israelite “others”. These scholars find it hard to dismiss numerous statements in support of the hemispheric view by former prophets including Joseph Smith. Moreover, they cannot stomach the strained re-interpretations of the Book of Mormon that Limited Geographists make in order to accommodate the millions of non-Israelites who have lived in the New World for tens of millenia.
Limited Geographists
Most apologists now shun popular LDS views of the scale of the Book of Mormon story in New World prehistory. Overwhelming scientific evidence that American Indians are essentially all descended from Siberian ancestors and have lived in the Americas for about 20,000 years has led many apologists to shrink the Book of Mormon geography to limited territories in Mesoamerica. Rather than the Lehites entering a continent “kept as yet from the knowledge of other nations,”8 we have them entering densely populated pre-existing civilizations and their DNA being diluted away to undetectable levels. Numerous other problems such as a requirement for a second Mesoamerican Hill Cumorah and the transportation of the gold plates over 3000 miles to the New York Hill Cumorah are swept under the carpet in the apologetic rush. Another awkward problem is that the God, speaking to Joseph Smith in LDS scripture, frequently refers to American Indians in North America as the Lamanites (See Doctrine and Covenants 28:8-9, 14; 30:6; 32:2; 54:8).
North American Geographists
A new group of apologists is breathing a new lease of life into a geography theory that has long been regarded with suspicion by mainstream BYU apologists. Spearheaded recently by Rod Meldrum,27 a non-scientist with a background in marketing, this resurging theory argues that Book of Mormon events did not take place in Central America, but rather in the northeastern United States in the vicinity of the Ohio Valley and Great Lakes. Meldrum is joined in his campaign by fellow Mormon Wayne May, editor and publisher of Ancient American,28 a magazine produced largely by Mormons. The editorial position of the journal is that it “stands firmly on behalf of evidence for the arrival of overseas visitors to the Americas hundreds and even thousands of years before Columbus.” These visitors are believed to have contributed to the “birth and development of numerous and sophisticated civilizations which flourished throughout the American Continents in pre-Columbian times.”
Alternative Geographists
It may come as a surprise to some readers that there are many apologists who see the Book of Mormon events as having occurred outside the Americas. The weight of scientific evidence against the possibility of an American setting has been sufficiently compelling, and their faith in the historical claims of the Book of Mormon sufficiently rigid, that they have looked elsewhere. Ralph Olson, a retired chemistry professor, has argued that the narrative can be more comfortably situated on the Malay Peninsula than in Mesoamerica.32 In his book, A More Promising Land of Promise, he presents an eclectic array of evidences to back up his theory, interspersed with criticism of the Limited Geographists, including the challenge created by DNA studies. In Olson’s defence, positioning the Book of Mormon narrative in Asia neatly overcomes such anachronisms as the lack of Old World horses, cattle, and goats and crops such as wheat and barley. I will not dwell on Olson’s theories as mainstream LDS apologists have shown no interest in them. Insufficient DNA research has been conducted on native people of the Malay Peninsula; however, Cambodians were shown by Noah Rosenberg to be closely related to other East Asians, who are only distantly related to Middle Easterners.
As the article states - this is not officially approved by the GA
Where are the archaeological artifacts that would support this piece of fiction?
Is that the best you can do?
Tee Hee
1) Lies
2) Damned lies; and
3) Statements by Mormon apologists.
“Joseph Smith, in 1830, translated those plates, he said, by “the gift and power of God,” into 1611 English from “Reformed Egyptian Hieroglyphics.”
Placing them in a hat and then burying his face in the same hat. God certainly has a sense of humor.
UtalkintaME???
Three things that are amazing - no, astounding!! - about mormonism:
1. mormonites can overlook the OCEAN of facts that contradict
mormonism’s claims
2. that mormonites can overlook the ABSENCE of any facts
supporting the purported history of mormonism
3. that mormonites can plug both ears, sing “na na na na” to
drown out this evidence and still claim that the pizza
they ate the night before gave them a burning that tells
them - despite the evidence against and lack of evidence
for - that mormonism must be true.
Mormonism’s history is equal to scientology. Each had an
author who wrote fiction. Each has legions of followers
who believe that fiction is true. Each are willing to jump
on couches to demonstrate their “true faith”. Each is an
authentic American Cult...
... and each has followers who are in desperate need of
the simple truth of Christ.
ampu
Placing them in a hat and then burying his face in the same hat. God certainly has a sense of humor.
____________________________________
“god” was doing a “new thing”
Err, I guess I mean a “restored thing”
LOL
You are hereby forgiven! Know any good Cardiac Surgeons in the Northern Utah area? Looks like a quintuple bypass is coming my way in the next week.
It wasn't coffee, tea, alcohol and I quit the tobacco over thirty years ago...
Damn Snelgrove Ice Cream! Laird Snelgrove was my neighbor in SLC. He would bring two quarts of the Bear Lake Raspberry every month so I would let him do his home teaching. An ice cream bribe always worked.
Anyway, I'll be across the street from CC at the big new IHC in the next five or six days.
Think good thoughts.
What I find most amusing is that the translations were in King James english. I guess Joseph Smith thought that’s how God talked.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.