Mormon ousted as an apostate

East Valley Tribune—Phoenix, AZ, MSNBC ^ | Sept 23, 2007 | Lawn Griffiths

[colorcountry]

Being excommunicated for apostasy by the Mormon church is one thing, but Lyndon Lamborn is livid that his stake president has ordered bishops in eight Mesa wards to take the rare step of announcing disciplinary action against him to church members today. "I thought if he could go public, so can I," said Lamborn, a lifelong member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, who said his research into church history gave him "thousands of reasons the church can't be what it claims to be."

Stake President R. James Molina acknowledged Friday he intends to have Lamborn's excommunication announced to the wards at men's priesthood meetings and womens Relief Society gatherings, even with Lamborn now taking his case public. Molina, as well as officials at church headquarters in Salt Lake City, call such a public warning about an ousted member extremely rare. They say, however, church members must be protected from what discordant ex-followers may say to damage the church...................

[Elsie]

5 to go!!!

[Loud Mime]

I quit when I realized that the Evil Harry Reid was Temple-worthy.

[DelphiUser]

Tell me I am not a Christian, now you are not telling the truth, problem.

I don't feel any problem with telling you that the Jesus your organizations members worship is not the same Jesus the mass of Christianity worship.

Sad really, I almost think you believe that.

Jesus, son of Mary, Born of a virgin birth, only begotten of the father, creator of heaven and earth, Healed the Sick, caused the lame to walk, cast out devils and raised the dead, how many of them do you think there are?

Do we understand him differently, sure, but he's still the same person.

Honestly, do you think in a half hour of less you could explain to a Buddhist why we don't worship the same Jesus?

Please look up Schism.

IS there a schism between Mormons and say Catholics, sure! Mormons and Baptists? Sure! You are just as wrong as all the people who started the other "Wars between religions" that have happened over the centuries, with Catholics declaring protestants are going to Hell, and vice versa, the differing Protestant churches ganging up on the catholics, or fighting amongst themselves. This is just more of the same, and frankly, Momrons are hoping you guys will grow up a bit.

You make yourself look proud and stupid at the same time when you try to tell us we don't believe in the same Jesus, because we have some differing doctrines about him, and thus you can somehow now judge us and say we are not christian. it shows how little history about Christianity and the schisms that are part of that history you know. You should look up Arius and Arainism What Momrons believe is not exactly "New" you can argue that it's wrong, but you can't argue that we made it up and be behaving in a reasonable manner. Even so, no one said that Arius believed in a "Different Jesus" because that is absurd on the face of it. The term has been used to highlight our differences, but you seem to mean it literally, and that's just silly.

You really should look some of this stuff up b before you post...

See ya.

[Elsie]

You are just as wrong as all the people who started the other "Wars between religions" that have happened over the centuries, with Catholics declaring protestants are going to Hell, and vice versa, the differing Protestant churches ganging up on the catholics, or fighting amongst themselves.

 

 

 

http://scriptures.lds.org/en/js_h/1/19#19

  17 It no sooner appeared than I found myself ^adelivered from the enemy which held me bound. When the light rested upon me I ^bsaw two ^cPersonages, whose brightness and ^dglory defy all description, ^estanding above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the other—This is My ^fBeloved ^gSon. Hear Him!

  18 My object in going to ^ainquire of the Lord was to know which of all the sects was right, that I might know which to join. No sooner, therefore, did I get possession of myself, so as to be able to speak, than I asked the Personages who stood above me in the light, which of all the sects was right (for at this time it had never entered into my heart that all were wrong)—and which I should join.

  19 I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all ^awrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those ^bprofessors were all ^ccorrupt; that: “they ^ddraw near to me with their lips, but their ^ehearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the ^fcommandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the ^gpower thereof.”

  20 He again forbade me to join with any of them; and many other things did he say unto me, which I cannot write at this time. When I came to myself again, I found myself ^alying on my back, looking up into heaven. When the light had departed, I had no strength; but soon recovering in some degree, I went home. And as I leaned up to the fireplace, ^bmother inquired what the matter was. I replied, “Never mind, all is well—I am well enough off.” I then said to my mother, “I have learned for myself that Presbyterianism is not true.” 

 

This 'Father' described here does NOT match what is tradionally taught about Him.

This 'Jesus' described here does NOT match what is tradionally taught about Him.

 

 

 

 

I see nowhere that JS never 'prayed' to GOD to see if his vision was true, for he surely knew the Scripture that warned:

2 Corinthians 11:14
   And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light.

 

 

 

You can see that others thought that mere men were angels or Christ before JS had his vision.

Galatians 4:14
   Even though my illness was a trial to you, you did not treat me with contempt or scorn. Instead, you welcomed me as if I were an angel of God, as if I were Christ Jesus himself.

 

[DelphiUser]

I Said: You are just as wrong as all the people who started the other "Wars between religions" that have happened over the centuries, with Catholics declaring protestants are going to Hell, and vice versa, the differing Protestant churches ganging up on the catholics, or fighting amongst themselves.

You then Quote: http://scriptures.lds.org/en/js_h/1/19#19

17 It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound. When the light rested upon me I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the other—This is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!
18 My object in going to inquire of the Lord was to know which of all the sects was right, that I might know which to join. No sooner, therefore, did I get possession of myself, so as to be able to speak, than I asked the Personages who stood above me in the light, which of all the sects was right (for at this time it had never entered into my heart that all were wrong)—and which I should join.
19 I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: “they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof.”
20 He again forbade me to join with any of them; and many other things did he say unto me, which I cannot write at this time. When I came to myself again, I found myself lying on my back, looking up into heaven. When the light had departed, I had no strength; but soon recovering in some degree, I went home. And as I leaned up to the fireplace, mother inquired what the matter was. I replied, “Never mind, all is well—I am well enough off.” I then said to my mother, “I have learned for myself that Presbyterianism is not true.”

You said: This 'Father' described here does NOT match what is traditionally taught about Him. This 'Jesus' described here does NOT match what is traditionally taught about Him.

So, Either tradition is wrong, or Joseph smith is wrong. Got it.

You said: I see nowhere that JS never 'prayed' to GOD to see if his vision was true, for he surely knew the Scripture that warned: 2 Corinthians 11:14

And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light.

I am not responsible for what you see and where you start reading, but this is just irresponsible reading on your part, the First vision happened in response to a prayer.

14 So, in accordance with this, my determination to ask of God, I retired to the woods to make the attempt. It was on the morning of a beautiful, clear day, early in the spring of eighteen hundred and twenty. It was the first time in my life that I had made such an attempt, for amidst all my anxieties I had never as yet made the attempt to pray vocally.
15 After I had retired to the place where I had previously designed to go, having looked around me, and finding myself alone, I kneeled down and began to offer up the desires of my heart to God. I had scarcely done so, when immediately I was seized upon by some power which entirely overcame me, and had such an astonishing influence over me as to bind my tongue so that I could not speak. Thick darkness gathered around me, and it seemed to me for a time as if I were doomed to sudden destruction.
16 But, exerting all my powers to call upon God to deliver me out of the power of this enemy which had seized upon me, and at the very moment when I was ready to sink into despair and abandon myself to destruction—not to an imaginary ruin, but to the power of some actual being from the unseen world, who had such marvelous power as I had never before felt in any being—just at this moment of great alarm, I saw a pillar of light exactly over my head, above the brightness of the sun, which descended gradually until it fell upon me.
17 It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound. When the light rested upon me I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the other—This is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!
18 My object in going to inquire of the Lord was to know which of all the sects was right, that I might know which to join. No sooner, therefore, did I get possession of myself, so as to be able to speak, than I asked the Personages who stood above me in the light, which of all the sects was right (for at this time it had never entered into my heart that all were wrong)—and which I should join.
19 I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: “they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof.”

So, it was a response to prayer we are talking about, not just Joseph walking along suddenly seeing a vision, and the power of the devil was there, at first, and Joseph knew the difference.

But lets go on with your "nationalization". You can see that others thought that mere men were angels or Christ before JS had his vision.
Galatians 4:14

Even though my illness was a trial to you, you did not treat me with contempt or scorn. Instead, you welcomed me as if I were an angel of God, as if I were Christ Jesus himself.

This is pathetic! OK, Lets talk about the "Traditional view, and it's problems with Scripture, and I am only going to go into a few places here, I've got TONS more.

Lets start with Matthew 17:5

5 While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him.

IF it was word for word, you would say Joseph Smith plagerized it, but this is defiantly not out of character for God the father to introduce Jesus Christ and telling people to "Hear ye him"

Acts of the apostles 7:55-56

55 But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up steadfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God,
56 And said, Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man standing on the right hand of God.

OK, I always think of the stained glass window with Jesus stooped over to stand on his right hand as an illustration of the absurdity that people such as yourself are forced to contemplate when reading this scripture "Traditionally"

Matthew 3:16,17

16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:
17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

In all in the KJV there are 12 instances where God the Father introduces Jesus with "In whom I am well pleased" And 7 where he introduces him as "My beloved son" and that's just in the New Testament. please not that "Atonement" appears only once n the bible, but that doesn't diminish it's importance.

So, lets go back to your original point here Joseph smith's account disagrees with what is "Traditionally Taught about" Jesus, not scriptures, whose traditions are these? Mark 7:8

8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.

3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?

Colossians 2: 8

8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

I note with interest that you have to go to tradition, not to scriptures to debate this essential point of the differences between our two Christian faiths, for it must be frustrating for you to see that the scriptures have much that supports Joseph Smith's first vision. For this reason, we Mormons invite all to come unto Jesus by putting our religion to "The Test" Test us, Get a copy of the Book of Mormon, Get a Copy of the Bible, and Ask God for he giveth to all men liberally, and will answer a faithful prayer.

My Brethren and sisters, who shall read this, I testify to you that an honest prayer to god is never left unanswered, if you wonder whether to even try our faith, pray about it, for God will answer you and will never be angry at an honest prayer.

Go with God, may he bless and keep you safe from Sin, Amen.

[Elsie]

Behold!!! I have gotten the NUMBER!!! In all in the KJV there are 12 instances where God the Father introduces Jesus with "In whom I am well pleased" And 7 where he introduces him as "My beloved son" and that's just in the New Testament. please not that "Atonement" appears only once n the bible, but that doesn't diminish it's importance.

And in NONE of them does the 'Father' have a BODY.

[Elsie]

8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.

I'm amazed that polygamy was so easily done away with, for it seems that it was a 'commandment of God' and it vanished so that Mormons could then do what was 'the tradition of men'.

[DelphiUser]

You said: Behold!!! I have gotten the NUMBER!!!

The mark of the beastly poster is indeed your number.

I said: In all in the KJV there are 12 instances where God the Father introduces Jesus with "In whom I am well pleased" And 7 where he introduces him as "My beloved son" and that's just in the New Testament. please not that "Atonement" appears only once n the bible, but that doesn't diminish it's importance.

You said: And in NONE of them does the 'Father' have a BODY.

The Bible is full of references to God having a body, starting in the Old Testament:

26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

So, God

• has an image, and we (Adam's children) look like God.
• is male.
• gave us dominion over the earth and everything on it.

Exedous 33:11,20-23

11 And the LORD spake unto Moses face to face, as a man speaketh unto his friend. And he turned again into the camp: but his servant Joshua, the son of Nun, a young man, departed not out of the tabernacle.
...
20 And he said, Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live.
21 And the LORD said, Behold, there is a place by me, and thou shalt stand upon a rock:
22 And it shall come to pass, while my glory passeth by, that I will put thee in a clift of the rock, and will cover thee with my hand while I pass by:
23 And I will take away mine hand, and thou shalt see my back parts: but my face shall not be seen.

God:

• has a face and can talk
• has a hand
• has "back parts"

Deuteronomy 4:27-30

27 And the LORD shall scatter you among the nations, and ye shall be left few in number among the heathen, whither the LORD shall lead you. 28 And there ye shall serve gods, the work of men’s hands, wood and stone, which neither see, nor hear, nor eat, nor smell. 29 But if from thence thou shalt seek the LORD thy God, thou shalt find him, if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul. 30 When thou art in tribulation, and all these things are come upon thee, even in the latter days, if thou turn to the LORD thy God, and shalt be obedient unto his voice;

So, since Moses was drawing a picture of the things that would be "Wrong" with the false Gods, we can know that God:

• Sees
• hears
• eats
• Smells

Now, lets move to the New Testament... Luke 24:39

39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

Handle me, Flesh and Bones, no blood, well what did Jesus do with his body if he currently does not have one, remember, you must use scripture, for that is what you insist of of me.

Acts 7:55-56

55 But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God,
56 And said, Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man standing on the right hand of God.

Stephen saw Jesus standing on the right hand which you only have if you have hands.

Hebrews 1:3

3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

How can you be in the "Express Image" of something that has no image and is form less?

Let's see how Joseph describes the body of Jesus...
D&C 130:22

22 The Father has a body of flesh and bones as tangible as man’s; the Son also; but the Holy Ghost has not a body of flesh and bones, but is a personage of Spirit. Were it not so, the Holy Ghost could not dwell in us.

Hmm, Sounds very similar to the way Jesus describes his own body tot he disciples.

Face it Elsie, the scriptures support God having a Body, even if they also interpretations for other definitions, saying God and Jesus both have bodies of "Flesh and Bone" is biblical.

I know how much this hurts, so I have to ask, have you prayed about it yet?

[Elsie]

Simile and methaphor and allegory seems to be an unacceptable answer for these verses, so I'll have to show that GOD is really a bird:

NIV Matthew 23:37
"O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing.

---

26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

I would have to assume, since GOD commanded these words to be written, that 'he' would have to be a 'he/she', for it plainly 'says' Male&Female.

GOD has to have BOTH types of sex organs.

---

Face it Elsie, the scriptures support God having a Body, even if they also interpretations for other definitions, saying God and Jesus both have bodies of "Flesh and Bone" is biblical.

Face it DelphiUser, the scriptures support God having a Body as I've described.

[DelphiUser]

In post #665
I Said: In all in the KJV there are 12 instances where God the Father introduces Jesus with "In whom I am well pleased" And 7 where he introduces him as "My beloved son" and that's just in the New Testament. please not that "Atonement" appears only once in the bible, but that doesn't diminish it's importance.

In Post #666
You Replied: And in NONE of them does the 'Father' have a BODY.

I responded with a lengthly post with Scriptures from Genisis to Acts (I could have gone into Revelations) showing God having a Body.

Then I said: "Face it Elsie, the scriptures support God having a Body, even if there are also interpretations for other definitions, saying God and Jesus both have bodies of "Flesh and Bone" is biblical.

You now say: Simile and metaphor and allegory seems to be an unacceptable answer for these verses, so I'll have to show that GOD is really a bird:

So, when God clearly is speaking in a literal sense, you have to Interpret the scriptures in oder to keep your "Traditions", so in your view, taking scriptures of creation literally is silly, and when God talks of Speaking to Moses Face to face as a man speaketh to his friend is a Simile, for a man speaking to another is some how not to be interpreted the way the lord clearly meant it to be?.

You Quote: NIV Matthew 23:37

"O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing.

Again, I don't think you understand the words you keep using, for this is not a simile, it is a metaphor.

Simile: a figure of speech in which two unlike things are explicitly compared, as in “she is like a rose.”

noun
a figure of speech that expresses a resemblance between things of different kinds (usually formed with 'like' or 'as')

Metaphor, now that is a little harder to spot, but only a little harder.

noun
a figure of speech in which a term or phrase is applied to something to which it is not literally applicable in order to suggest a resemblance, as in “A mighty fortress is our God.”

The metaphor of the "Chicks" is obvious, he is talking to the Jews about trying to lead them in paths of righteousness, and they will not obey. The metaphor will be obvious to all who read it, except for you apparently who thinks God is now a Chicken.

And then you go to: Genisis 1:26 & 27

26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

I would have to assume, since GOD commanded these words to be written, that 'he' would have to be a 'he/she', for it plainly 'says' Male&Female.

GOD has to have BOTH types of sex organs.

Now I have to questions your ability to read and your sincerity.

Lets break down Verse 27 that seems to confuse you so much:

So God created man in his own image

So, God created Adam in his image, Adam, not Adam and Eve.

in the image of God created he him;

So, Adam is in God's image, not Adam and Eve, just Adam, and BTW both Adam and Jesus Christ were created in the "Express image" of God, neither was a hermaphrodite.

male and female created he them.

So, now God is speaking in the plural (sorry if I am moving to fast here) and is saying that he created mankind in both male a female genders, specifically, Adam is the Male and Eve is the Female.

So your interpretation here is at least consistent with your other points; nonsensical and designed to make light of sacred things, not to actually teach or try to make a valid point.

Now, you say: Face it DelphiUser, the scriptures support God having a Body as I've described.

This is funny.
A) You have not described a body (although you did reference chickens).
B) You Denied a Body in Post #666 (Which I thought was appropriate).

Elsie, this is a really silly argument, and I am embarrassed for you that this is all you could come up with.

---

I encourage any who will read this, discerning by the spirit of God that I am sincere while others here are not Now, to put the Book of Mormon to the test?

Get a Book of Mormon, Get a Bible They are both free, pray about both, and try the spirits to see if the Book of Mormon is indeed of God.

If we are wrong, God will tell you so, if we are right, God will tell you that too. What have you got to lose if we are wrong (Nothing, God will tell you, and you can move on), what have you got to lose if we are right? (Salvation)

Think about it, and pray about it. Whatever you do do not rely upon the word of any man, but ask God.

God be with you and lead you into paths of righteousness.

[Elsie]

Any one want to have fun with DU?

God the Father has a body and he’s posted Scripture to prove it.

I am at a loss; I may lose my faith over his evidence.

I may have to join the LDS organization; headquartered in SLC.

(No, wait; them ex-RLDS folks are closer and they don’t have an albatross of polygamy hanging over them.

[Elsie]

If we are wrong, God will tell you so, if we are right, God will tell you that too.

Now you KNOW the response you true believers tell those who've gotten an "It is false" answer.

[Elsie]

I hope this cleared up a long running misunderstanding, and I hope this motivates all who profess to believe in Jesus to learn more about their faith, and it's tenets, history and vocabulary.

And how the same words mean different things...

[Osage Orange]

If we are wrong, God will tell you so, if we are right, God will tell you that too. What have you got to lose if we are wrong (Nothing, God will tell you, and you can move on), what have you got to lose if we are right? (Salvation)

Wow..I guess the Rubicon as been crossed here. Ha!!

So are now saying that mormonism is the ONLY way to salvation?

And you wonder why you get opposition??? ROFLOL!!

You are a hoot, man!

[greyfoxx39]

DU:what have you got to lose if we are right? (Salvation)

OO:So are now saying that mormonism is the ONLY way to salvation?

Of course! That's why all of the apostate Christians keep getting the WRONG answer when praying and studying and the burning in their bosoms is just heartburn!

There is only ONE correct answer! In order to join God the Father and Jesus Christ his Son in the Celestial Kingdom of mormonism, one must (alive or dead) be baptized into the LDS church and accept and follow all the temple ordinances.

What would be the point of sending out gazillions of missionaries to lead the apostate Christians (and others) to the mormon "truth" or the point of gazillions of dunkings of dead souls in the mormon temples if not to offer mormon "salvation" to the entire planet. They want EVERYONE to eventually be as "speshul" as they are, donchaknow? And, coincidentally, bound to follow the doctrines and practices of the LDS church.

It's called "Building up the Kingdom of Zion".

[MHGinTN]

Elsie, God does have a body, and He named Himself Jesus. He also is greater than the universe He created. And He has another personage known as The Holy Spirit. If you could pass a pencil through a sheet of glass, each place where the pencil is part of the sheet of glass would be a manifestation of 'pencil'; taken together all the 'manifestations of pencil' make a pencil, but it is not possible to have all the three-D pencil part of the glass sheet so you would have to 'use your mind to add the parts together.' [John 14:6-9 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him. Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us. Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?]

'Christophanies' (I think that's the correct word) are manifestations of Jesus found in the Old Testament. We are instructed in the Bible that the eyes are the window to the soul ... if Moses had seen the eyes of the Lord Jesus Christ he would have been consumed by the glory of the righteousness thereof. Just being in Hi spresence for a few hours caused Moses' face to glow ... and he wasn't looking into God's/Jesus's eyes during that period!

[Elsie]

So you quote the Bible, which may (since the JST is NOT finished yet) have many 'errors' in it, to bolster your claim that GOD the Father has a mortal body, but in the BoM we find this:

Alma 31: 15 

 Holy, holy God; we believe that thou art God, and we believe that thou art holy, and that thou wast a spirit, and that thou art a spirit, and that thou wilt be a spirit forever.

---

What to believe??

[DelphiUser]

What to believe??

This may also explain why you can't seem to understand how Jesus is God and God the Father is God, but they are not the same person.

Let me put it this way:

I was a boy
I am a boy
I will always be a boy forever

I also am a Man, a father, a husband, and many other things.

One name does not preclude others from being accurate, which is why I did not say that my interpretation was the only possible one from the scriptures, merely a valid one. You are the one saying my interpretation is invalid, as for me, if you want to believe God is a chicken, go ahead and believe it, I will try to keep a straight face in future discussions

"What to believe?" that is easy, Believe all that the Holy Spirit testifies of as Truth, discard the rest.

BTW, I am glad to see you are starting to read the Book of Mormon, when will you start praying in faith and with earnestness of heart to know if it is true?

[greyfoxx39]

BTW, I am glad to see you are starting to read the Book of Mormon, when will you start praying in faith and with earnestness of heart to know if it is true?

RM from your home page: Attributing motives to another poster or otherwise reading his mind is “making it personal

The above remark looks about as personal as you can get IMO.

[MHGinTN]

Just remember, Elsie, if you get a negative you didn’t ask like a faithful Mormon did; there’s something wrong with you, never the heresies at the heart of Mormonism.