Posted on 08/16/2004 12:41:06 PM PDT by topcat54
Q: I often hear premillennialists, especially dispensationalists, talk about a new temple being built in Israel. Where do they find this in Scripture, and why would it be necessary?
A: Dispensational premillennialists need a future "tribulation temple" so their idea of antichrist can take his seat (2 Thess. 2:4), place a statue for people to worship (Rev. 13:14-15), and proclaim himself to be god (2 Thess. 2:4). But what the dispensationalists really need is a verse that states that there will be another rebuilt temple since there's already been one. Rebuilt-temple advocates Tommy Ice and Randall Price admit the following in their book Ready to Rebuild: "There are no Bible verses that say, 'There is going to be a third temple'" (197-198). Having admitted this, they go on to claim "that there will be a Jewish Temple in Jerusalem at least by the midpoint of the seven-year tribulation period" (198). As we will see, the Bible says no such thing.
(Excerpt) Read more at americanvision.org ...
Ping!
Can you give me a brief review of preterism?
:-)
In other words, I'm a theological oddity.
I like amillenialism -- but I choke up every time I have to conclude Satan is bound today. I just can't buy that. I have been meaning to ask OP to explicate that position, since I know he will do an able job.
The New Jerusalem/El-HEJERA Pilot Project - Summary
The Proposed Pilot Project will:
1. 1. Present the New Jerusalem Vision as feasible solution to the Jerusalem deadlock, beneficial to all parties. It will also introduce this Vision as the one practical means for peaceful realization of the future Temple.
2. 2. Promote the Plan as to elicit respectable interfaith endorsements.
3. 3. Prepare a respectable mass-appeal, probably over the Internet (e.g.: 144 million letters), with administration and website tools to launch and handle its responses.
4. 4. Draw a complete technical proposal for realizing the full virtual-Heavenly Jerusalem model for presentation to potential funding agencies.
5. 5. Make a Demo in Cyberspace, most likely as a multi-user game, of the (staged) operation of the Old City as "New Jerusalem"/Temple, with two key foci operative at this stage. (See section 5.4 below, more foci will be added gradually).
6. 6. Draw a concept for organization plan of the volunteer welfare work and the development agency – (e.g. "The HEJERA").
Costs: A budget of $22,000 will serve for investigating the application of "The New Jerusalem" concept for the Old City of Jerusalem and checking its viability (items 1-3 above). Another $40,000 will allow a minimal working WWW facility for administering the process of building the New Jerusalem constituency, for forming "cyber-pilgrimage" to Jerusalem as a universal Temple and for drawing a complete plan for the virtual New Jerusalem, with assessed costs and feasibility (items 4-6 above).
(Note: The submitted proposal included detailed specification of these tasks, which is not given here.)
Go to the overall New Jerusalem/El-HEJERA Project Summary
Go to the New Jerusalem/El-HEJERA Project Index
Back to TheHOPE Home Page
What do you make of Ezekiel chapters 40 - 48?
Preterism: An eschatological viewpoint that places many or all eschatological events in the past, especially during the destruction of Jerusalem in A.D. 70. (R.C. Sproul, The Last Days According to Jesus, p. 228)
Preterism is divided into two main camps; Partial or orthodox preterism and full or consistent or hyper preterism. Full preterism has also been referred to as Pantelism and Hymanaeanism.
The main difference between the two groups is that orthodox preterists see a future, visible second coming of Christ, while hyper preterists see the second coming as being in the past. We agree with the creeds of the church which consistently speak of future events surrounding the return of Christ.
Hyper preterism is considered a heresy by most Christians. It's represented on the web by such sites as International Preterist Association. They say, "We believe Scripture teaches Christ would come again in His generation to judge the quick and the dead." They teach the resurrection as being totally spiritual. They say, "Jesus never promised them a physical paradise and materialistic, sensual delights. He promised soul salvation. That is here now. It is reality. When these physical bodies die we continue on in His presence in our spiritual body."
The arrangements as to the land and the temple are, in many particulars, different from those subsisting before the captivity. There are things in it so improbable physically as to preclude a purely literal interpretation. The general truth seems to hold good that, as Israel served the nations for his rejection of Messiah, so shall they serve him in the person of Messiah, when he shall acknowledge Messiah (Isaiah 60:12, Zechariah 14:17-19; compare Psalms 72:11). The ideal temple exhibits, under Old Testament forms (used as being those then familiar to the men whom Ezekiel. a priest himself, and one who delighted in sacrificial images, addresses), not the precise literal outline, but the essential character of the worship of Messiah as it shall be when He shall exercise sway in Jerusalem among His own people, the Jews, and thence to the ends of the earth. The very fact that the whole is a vision (Ezekiel 40:2), not an oral face-to-face communication such as that granted to Moses (Numbers 12:6-8), implies that the directions are not to be understood so precisely literally as those given to the Jewish lawgiver. The description involves things which, taken literally, almost involve natural impossibilities. The square of the temple, in Ezekiel 42:20, is six times as large as the circuit of the wall enclosing the old temple, and larger than all the earthly Jerusalem. Ezekiel gives three and a half miles and one hundred forty yards to his temple square. The boundaries of the ancient city were about two and a half miles. Again, the city in Ezekiel has an area between three or four thousand square miles, including the holy ground set apart for the prince, priests, and Levites. This is nearly as large as the whole of Judea west of the Jordan. As Zion lay in the center of the ideal city, the one-half of the sacred portion extended to nearly thirty miles south of Jerusalem, that is, covered nearly the whole southern territory, which reached only to the Dead Sea (Ezekiel 47:19), and yet five tribes were to have their inheritance on that side of Jerusalem, beyond the sacred portion (Ezekiel 48:23-28). Where was land to be found for them there? A breadth of but four or five miles apiece would be left. As the boundaries of the land are given the same as under Moses, these incongruities cannot be explained away by supposing physical changes about to be effected in the land such as will meet the difficulties of the purely literal interpretation. The distribution of the land is in equal portions among the twelve tribes, without respect to their relative numbers, and the parallel sections running from east to west. There is a difficulty also in the supposed separate existence of the twelve tribes, such separate tribeships no longer existing, and it being hard to imagine how they could be restored as distinct tribes, mingled as they now are. So the stream that issued from the east threshold of the temple and flowed into the Dead Sea, in the rapidity of its increase and the quality of its waters, is unlike anything ever known in Judea or elsewhere in the world. Lastly, the catholicity of the Christian dispensation, and the spirituality of its worship, seem incompatible with a return to the local narrowness and "beggarly elements" of the Jewish ritual and carnal ordinances [emph. added], disannulled "because of the unprofitableness thereof" [FAIRBAIRN], (Galatians 4:3,9, 5:1, Hebrews 9:10, 10:18). "A temple with sacrifices now would be a denial of the all-sufficiency of the sacrifice of Christ. [emph. added] He who sacrificed before confessed the Messiah. He who should sacrifice now would solemnly deny Him" [DOUGLAS]. These difficulties, however, may be all seeming, not real. Faith accepts God's Word as it is, waits for the event, sure that it will clear up all such difficulties. Perhaps, as some think, the beau ideal of a sacred commonwealth is given according to the then existing pattern of temple services, which would be the imagery most familiar to the prophet and his hearers at the time. The minute particularizing of details is in accordance with Ezekiel's style, even in describing purely ideal scenes. The old temple embodied in visible forms and rites spiritual truths affecting the people even when absent from it. So this ideal temple is made in the absence of the outward temple to serve by description the same purpose of symbolical instruction as the old literal temple did by forms and acts. As in the beginning God promised to be a "sanctuary" (Ezekiel 11:16) to the captives at the Chebar, so now at the close is promised a complete restoration and realization of the theocratic worship and polity under Messiah in its noblest ideal (compare Jeremiah 31:38-40). In Revelation 21:22 "no temple" is seen, as in the perfection of the new dispensation the accidents of place and form are no longer needed to realize to Christians what Ezekiel imparts to Jewish minds by the imagery familiar to them. In Ezekiel's temple holiness stretches over the entire temple, so that in this there is no longer a distinction between the different parts, as in the old temple: parts left undeterminate in the latter obtain now a divine sanction, so that all arbitrariness is excluded. So that it is be a perfect manifestation of the love of God to His covenant-people (Ezekiel 40:1-43:12'); and from it, as from a new center of religious life, there gushes forth the fulness of blessings to them, and so to all people (Ezekiel 47:1-23) [FAIRBAIRN and HAVERNICK]. The temple built at the return from Babylon can only very partially have realized the model here given. The law is seemingly opposed to the gospel (Matthew 5:21,22,27,28,33,34). It is not really so (compare Matthew 5:17,18, Romans 3:31, Galatians 3:21,22). It is true Christ's sacrifice superseded the law sacrifices (Hebrews 10:12-18). Israel's province may hereafter be to show the essential identity, even in the minute details of the temple sacrifices, between the law and gospel (Romans 10:8). The ideal of the theocratic temple will then first be realized. (Jamieson, Fausset, Brown, Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible)In general I agree with these comments.
Sounds like the Catholic Church tends towards orthodox preterism... One way I was taught to evaluate prophecies:
1. Identify what is being discussed, using history and scripture itself. (the preterist part of it) For instance: Nero's destruction of Rome and Jerusalem amidst perescution of the Christians.
2. Identify how that prophesy reflects the present challenge of a Christian. For instance: The spiritual warfare present in our daily lives, leading to our own mortal death.
3. Recognize the eternal condition of the soul implicit from these challenges. For instance: As Nero's persecution and our own struggles indicate, Christianity is not about avoidance of suffering, but transforming suffering into a redemptive quality.
4. Look forward into the future to reveal the nature of the penultimate confrontation: For instance: As in ancient Rome and Jerusalem, Satan will attack Christianity, bringing the destruction of our materialist strongholds but also the purification of humanity and the establishment of a just reign of Christ.
Bound does not mean destroyed. Satan is still alive in our hearts, even while we constrain our consciences to obey the law. When Satan is ultimately destroyed, we will no longer have to constrain our impulses, for their shall be nothing evil left within us.
Would you happen to have a link to a good orthodox preterism site? That IPA bunch seems to take the concept too far to be credible.
Thanks, TC.
I didn't know about the hyper-preterist group and the lack of resurrection bodies. I would certainly agree that that would be heretical.
I agree wholeheartedly. There are certain points that commend it, but that one has proved difficult for me to overcome.
In their recent, and excellent book, How Now Shall We Live, (1) authors Charles Colson and Nancy Pearcey make the strong point that followers of Christ need a sound and complete Biblical worldview. We are commanded to do this by the Bible itself when we are told to always be ready to give a reason for our hope, to divide the Word correctly, and to watch our doctrine closely. Paul told Timothy the Scripture was all that was needed for a man to be thoroughly equipped for every good work.
This, however, is not what Christians usually do today. While a lot of people go to church, it seems few know the Bible and fewer still take following Christ seriously. Secularized Christianity (Country-Club Christianity) has watered down both the truth and the impact of God's Word and its meaning. As a result, there is deep division and confusion concerning many sections of the Bible.
Questions about the nature of God, the nature and purpose of man, the reasons for Israel, the promise of salvation through an incarnate Messiah, God's laws and rules for men, and what the future holds are all answered in the Bible. But to find these answers, the Bible must be read -- not in bits and pieces, but cover to cover. One cannot look up "key" verses and find doctrine and explanations. Life itself is too complex for that, and God's Word does not shortchange us in our lives.
The Bible is the book where the answers to these and many more questions are given. But the Bible is not an encyclopedia or a handy reference guide. It opens its secrets only to the humble and pure in heart. Its treasures escape the arrogant, the proud and the self-righteous. The Bible teaches truth "here a little, there a little, line upon line, precept upon precept." This means we can only understand a given subject well if we first know the whole Book. Truth on any subject in the Bible unfolds gradually chapter by chapter in an always-consistent manner. The Author intended His book to be straightforward and easy to understand.
In reading the Bible, the clear, literal sense of the Word is always to be preferred. Allegories and parables are clearly presented as such, symbols used in one section are explained in others, and poetry is clearly marked. God is a master teacher. Even children can understand the basic message. When allegory, parable, or symbolic material is presented it is clear from the context and from similar passages elsewhere in Scripture how we are to proceed with interpretation. God seeks personal and intimate relationships with His people, He is a Master teacher, and His style is such that even children can grasp the basic message. God means what He says and says what He means; He announces, or prophesied the future and then acts accordingly. God announces what He is going to do in advance, then He acts and does exactly what He has said He would do. Though the Bible is a supernatural book, penned by different men who lived over a time span of at least 1500 years, it is self-consistent, accurate and authoritative from cover to cover. Since the Author backs what He has written with His own character, the Word of God is weighty, life-changing, dependable and infallible.
In the writings of the early church fathers, we can see how they wrestled with various issues. Some important issues were, however, never widely resolved. The second and third centuries saw a move towards treating the Bible as completely allegorical. In Alexandria, Egypt, Origen (185-254 AD) and his followers, desiring to accommodate neo-Platonistic philosophy among the intelligensia of the day, adopted the view that the Bible was mostly allegorical and need not be taken as literal, historic truth. In due time this view of the Bible as allegory was rejected as heresy, but damage had been done. Augustine (354-430) headed the church back towards a straightforward reading of Scripture--except for the book of the Revelation, which he considered allegorical.
Thus the Roman Catholic Church was led into the same theology concerning Biblical prophecy (eschatology). Catholicism became "amillennial" -- denying the coming thousand year reign of Christ on earth spoken of in Revelation 20 and referred to many times in Isaiah. In the process another strange theological twist appeared known as "replacement theology." This view claims that the church has replaced Israel in the plan of God. Clear refutation of this heresy is presented in Isaiah 48-52, among other places. The entire book of Hosea ought to be enough to settle the issue of God's enduring commitment to his wife, Israel, in spite or her spiritual adultery. Though Yahweh is seen as divorcing his wife Israel under the terms of the Old Covenant, yet the story ends when God buys back His wife and restores her forever under the terms of the New Covenant. In Scripture, there is a clear distinction between Israel and the Church as well as in regard to God's calling and God's plans for these separate entities. The Apostle Paul spends three full Chapters in his letter to the Romans (9-11) to make this distinction clear to all who are willing to hear.
Although Martin Luther (1483-1546) and the other Protestant reformers of the 16th century brought Christianity enormous strides back to accepting the Bible's full authority, these leaders did not try to deal with, or reform, their eschatology. Today, as a result, few Christians consider the Bible literally true and historically accurate. And when men consider the Bible's history as allegorical, what happens to prophecy is even worse.
Within a century of the Reformation's beginnings a view of the prophecies of Revelation was becoming popular which denied the clear intent of this book. This view, referred to as "preterism" has been picked up in our time by some notable theologians such as R.C. Sproul. (2) Preterist theology states that the prophetic statements referring to the endtimes as presented in Revelation were fulfilled in the first century of Christendom. Preterists feel this wrapped up God's plan for Israel and that the church has now inherited all that God promised Israel.
According to Sproul, Preterism is, "an eschatological viewpoint that places many or all eschatological events in the past, especially the destruction of Jerusalem in A.D. 70." This school of Bible prophecy actually teaches that the second coming of Jesus (the parousia) really occurred nearly 2000 years ago, and the "last days" are over and done with. When the Romans under Titus destroyed the Second Temple prophetic history was completed and fulfilled, especially with regard to Israel. All that is left is God plus Christ's church.
Preterism takes its clue from Revelation 1:1 which says these things will "soon take place." From there it valiantly defends itself against all sorts of theological difficulties, point by point. However, in doing so, it effectively excises the Lord from management of history, claiming He has abandoned His promises to Israel. Preterism allows great sections of the Old Testament to be relegated to allegory, thus denying New Testament teaching the foundation it was built on. It ends up claiming that much of the Bible is not relevant for us today. Then all we have left is a few rules for living and the promise that we can "believe on Jesus" and go to heaven. This "Christianity Lite"--as a friend of mine refers to it--is deadly, lulling people into complacency in dangerously troubled times and denying them the assurance of God's complete knowledge and control and love as the world situation and personal lives crumble.
Dr. John F. Walvoord in his book Every Prophecy of the Bible (3) has taken the time to examine a thousand individual Bible verses and to analyze 500 specific prophesies from both the Old and New Testaments. His work is meticulous and reverent. He notes that fully half the examined prophecies have been fulfilled in minute detail in history so far. Should we then not expect God to continue in that same way, fulfilling His prophecies literally, accurately, and historically?
Not many Christians today look at Genesis and believe it means what it says. Not many Christians look at Revelation and understand or believe what it says. But the symbols are explained by the prophets of the Old Testament. The entire Bible is not only relevant for today, it is completely indispensable as we move towards the final act of the human drama. The events in Revelation are what wrap up ALL of human history, not just history to 70 A.D. Knowing this we can take comfort that God is completely in control and we can trust Him. It takes humility to turn away from pride and our natural human reasoning when trying to "make sense" of the parts of God's Word we don't understand. But it is that humility God looks for in His people, as God tells Isaiah in 66:2,
References:
1. Tyndale House, Wheaton, IL 1999
2. R. C. Sproul, The Last days According to Jesus, (Baker Books, Grand Rapids 1998)
3. John F. Walvoord, Every Prophecy of the Bible, Chariot Victory Publishing, Colorado Springs 1999.
January 24, 2000. Special thanks to Helen Fryman.
See also "Progressive Dispensationalism" from Zola Levitt's newsletter. 3/00.
Hrm. I'd think that if Christ's Second Coming happened around AD 70 we'd all agree on it, unless one resorts to the "it was a spiritual coming, not physical" a la the Jehovah's Witnesses doctrine regarding the year 1914. :)
Thanks for the ping!
Excellent line from your post.
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