Scholar Claims Oldest Jesus of Nazareth Evidence

Jesus had brothers, (James, Jude, Joses, and Simon) and that he also had SISTERS.

Do you NOT read?

I just posted the explanation for the term "brothers", citing biblical scripture and you TOTALLY IGNORE IT! Go back and read my post #54.

Example:

If you will read Gen 29:15, "And Laban said to Jacob, because thou art my brother..." At first you would think Jacob and Laban are blood brothers. Now compare Gen 29:5, "..know ye Laban, the son of Nahor..." Compare Gen 25:21-26, and you will see Jacob was the son of Isaac and Rebekah. Laban was the son of Nahor. They were not blood brothers but fellow citizens.

Get with it, berned!

When listing genealogy in the Bible, you hardly ever list the mother.

Wrong! Until the discovery of DNA, Jews noted birth by the mother because they KNEW WHO GAVE BIRTH. Jesus was a Jew because His mother was Jewish.

I know a family who recently adopted two children. The adoptive mother was Jewish (as was the father, but that didn't count). She had to take a "mikvah" (a ritual bath) to cleanse herself, as is the tradition in the Jewish religion.

Matthew 12:46 While he yet talked to the people, behold, his mother and his brethren stood without, desiring to speak with him.

47 Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee.

Another one who doesn't read. See my post #54. For example:

The word: 'Brethren'...appears over 530 times in the Bible.

'Brother'....appears over 350 times.
'Brothers'...appears only once, in Num 36:11.
'Sister'.....appears over 100 times.
'Sisters'....appears over 15 times.

BRETHREN: This is a plural word for 'brother' as shown in dictionaries. BROTHER: The Hebrew word 'ACH', is ordinarily translated 'brother'. Since Hebrew, and Aramaic in which the Gospel of Matthew was written, had fewer words than our English, the Jews at that time, used it in a broader sense to expresses kinship. The Hebrew terms for different levels and degrees of relationship did not exist. 'Brother' meant the sons of the same father, and all the male members of the same clan or tribe. In Greek, in which the Gospel of Mark was written, 'brother' is Phratry, from the Greek Phrater, meaning a fellow member of a clan. Even today, the word is used in a larger meaning, so that friends, allies, fellow believers, and fellow citizens can be included in the same brotherhood. It was no different in the time of Christ.

Do you NOT read?

I just posted the explanation for the term "brothers", citing biblical scripture and you TOTALLY IGNORE IT!

You've discovered a very important point. This is the primary reason that I rarely engage in scriptural debates here any more.

You can post a thousand prooftexts, as well as the 2000 year history of Christianity's interpretations of the texts, and even the interpretations of the very earliest Christians themselves, who were even taught by the apostles themselves, and it still won't make any difference to them.

They prefer TOIOS which comes from the reformers OIOS.

They don't care about the Truth, only that which supports their anti-Catholic prejudices and bigotry.

The inscription reads:

"James -- SON of Joseph, brother of Jesus.

Complete vindication, confirmation and corroboration of the Fundamentalist teachings on the subject, replete with slam-dunk historical, physical evidence.

That tired ol' Catholic baloney about "cousin" won't fly anymore.

Get with it, Nyer!

It takes quite a bit of work to subvert the plain meaning of scripture, no ?

Not really. Look how often the plain sense of this scripture is ignored:

John 6: 53Jesus said to them, "I tell you the truth, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. 54Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. 55For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink. 56Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me, and I in him.

Complete vindication, confirmation and corroboration of the Fundamentalist teachings on the subject, replete with slam-dunk historical, physical evidence.

1) Prove it refers to the historical Jesus,

2) Prove the translations of the inscriptions are not also part of a fundamentalist agenda (remember, the "scholarly" journal this report comes from also claimed that microphones lowered into deep mine shafts in Russia recorded the voices of the damned in torment in Hell...not much scholarly rigor here, not much more can be expected in this current agenda driven media hysteria),

3) Prove the Joseph referred to was the same Joseph betrothed to Mary.

The text on this empty ossuary can prove NOTHING except that a guy was buried who was named James, was a son of a man named Joesph, and had a close relative, but not necessarily a blood brother, given the scriptural explanation already provided by NYer named Jesus.

Absolutely nothing can be concluded from this report beyond what I stated here.

NOTHING!

But in your puny fundamentalistic mind the entire YOPIOS tradition of the reformers has been proven.

How pathetic. Yer countin' yer chickens before they're hatched. When you are subsequently proven wrong --don't worry, you will be-- will you be so zealous to apologize for your error?

Correction. I always try to double check everything, and correct my own errors (wish others here would do this and admit when they're wrong even on a side issue, but I'm not holding my breath):

This legend is quite popular among Christian groups as it "proves" Hell (and therefore God) exists. Popular endings to the story have it that the scientists ran screaming from the site, or that since the discovery conversions to Christianity are occurring at an unprecedented rate.

Though it's impossible to pinpoint when the news story about a well in Russia transformed into a story about scientists breaking into Hell or who was responsible for that transformation, we do know that in 1989 the Trinity Broadcasting Network (TBN) aired a "Scientists Discover Hell" story and placed the event as happening in the Kola Peninsula. A Norwegian schoolteacher visiting California heard that broadcast and took the story back to Norway with him. He then mailed it to a Christian magazine in Finland. In the form of a letter from a reader, it reached a Finnish missionaries newsletter. From there it returned to the United States, reaching both the TBN people and other evangelists who then claimed they had gotten it from a respected Finnish scientific journal.

In the spring of 1990, the legend as we now know it appeared in both Praise The Lord (February) and Midnight Cry (April). Debunkings of it showed up in Christianity Today (July) and Biblical Archaeology Review (November). Even so, the Weekly World News ran the story in 1992, this time setting it in Alaska and claiming thirteen oil rig workers were killed when the Devil came roaring up out of the ground.

Those of us who love Jesus and revere His Father's Holy Word are today, dancing for joy, that a piece of hard physical evidence has CORROBORATED, for a world desperately looking for Truth amid all the lies, EXACTLY what is written in the Bible!!

But for those duped and brainwashed by the Whore of Babylon, this is a sad, bitter day. But not a day without hope, for God beckons and invites you join with Him!

REv 18:

4 Then I heard another voice calling from heaven, "Come away from her, my people. Do not take part in her sins, or you will be punished with her. 5 For her sins are piled as high as heaven, and God is ready to judge her for her evil deeds. 6 Do to her as she has done to your people. Give her a double penalty for all her evil deeds. She brewed a cup of terror for others, so give her twice as much as she gave out. 7 She has lived in luxury and pleasure, so match it now with torments and sorrows. She boasts, `I am queen on my throne. I am no helpless widow. I will not experience sorrow.' 8 Therefore, the sorrows of death and mourning and famine will overtake her in a single day. She will be utterly consumed by fire, for the Lord God who judges her is mighty."

Obviously you either missed or willfully ignored Black Elk's post #20. Here's an excerpt:

St. James the Greater is buried at Santiago de Compostella in Spain. He was martyred not by stoning but by being put to the sword by Herod Agrippa I (Acts, xii, 2), in 44 AD and not in 63 AD as indicated for the fellow whose lid this may be. The martyrdom of St. James the Greater is the only martyrdom of one of the twelve apostles recorded in the New Testament.

St. James the Greater was the brother of St. John the Evangelist. See also Matthew x, 2, and Luke vi, 14, and Acts i, 13. Collectively, they were known as "Boanerges" or "the sons of thunder" and are sons of Zebedee not Joseph, not Mary (Mark iii, 17) and were, along with Peter and Andrew, the first four apostles called by Christ. The remains were brought to Spain and are no longer buried in Israel.

St. James the Lesser was a son of Alphaeus and another Mary who was at the tomb (Mark xv, 40, xvi, 1; and Matthew xxvii, 56). There is improbable legend that he was martyred at Persia or that he was "the brother of the Lord" when he was more likely a cousin whose parents were Alphaeus and that other Mary.

There was yet a third James who wrote the Epistle of James and died in 62 A.D., known as James "the Just" who was apparently a step-brother of Christ by a previous marriage of Joseph or was actually St. James the Less, son of Alpheus and a Mary not the mother of Christ but related to her, according to St. Jerome. There is apparently some dispute as to the manner of death, some arguing that he was stoned and some that he was thrown from an upper story of a building. While James "the Just" may possibly have been the person whose ossuary lid has been found, it simply begs the question as to the relationship to Mary, the Mother of Jesus. As to that question, this may be an interesting artifact to the "reformed" but it proves nothing but that a man whose father was Joseph and had a brother named Jesus is said to have been buried in the box.

How many Jameses were there in Jerusalem at the time? If Jesus Christ's inner circle is any representative sample, the place must have been crawling with them.

It appears to me to be Hebrew, not Aramaic. The reason I say that is that it appears to use the Hebrew "ben" (bet-nun) for son, rather than the Aramaic "bar" (bet-resh).

I had class with Dr. Fitzmyer today. He talked at some length about it. The inscription is Aramaic, not Hebrew, but there are some unusual characters. I'm looking forward to the article to read more. Personally, I have doubts about the statistics that predict only 20 James/Joseph/Jesus combinations. But we shall see.

When did James get to be known as "the Just?" I'd never heard that before. Who is the James who was the first bishop of Jerusalem? John's brother?

Thanks for posting!

Polycarp, I have high hopes for you. So many of these Freerepublic "professional Catholics" are, frankly, hopeless -- but you have a brain. And I have seen, in the past, flashes of remarkable integrity from you. You have a real chance to escape from the darkness of the Whore and step into the light of Biblical Christianity.

You need some event, or disclosure, (like this one) that will bring you to spiritual rock bottom so that you can finally, at long last, confront the Truth of God, as opposed to the lies of Rome.

I have high hopes for you. You can do it. You just need to think outside the box Rome has put you in, just a little. Eventually, something will click for you. I had hoped it would be this, but your inculcation is very, very deep. God will get you to the place you need to be.

Some minds don't require much to find themselves boggled. According to the Washington Post article the owner is an unidentified Middle Eastern Muslim (hereinafter the Unknown Muslim) nwho modestly wishes not to be identified, bought the hoax in question for the princely sum of $70 from other Muslims who "found" it without bones, vandalized, at an undeclared location. The box or lid or whatever will not be displayed to scientists nor subjected to any objective tests because "it would be too costly to insure". The Muslims who found it and the one who now has it (if it exists at all) claim ignorance of its significance as the excuse for the cheap sale price to Muhammed el Rootie Kazootie or whoever it is who claims to have it.

Berned, can you imagine how much money you could make setting up a toll booth on the Brooklyn Bridge? I can get for you wholesale. How much? How much have you got? The deed has to be a quit claim not a warranty but trust me, after all why would I lie. Why would Rootie Kazootie lie? Well, in the words of that immortal philosopher, Bugs Bunny, what a maroon!

Finally, G. K. Chesterton, himself a convert to the RCC from Unitarianism, wrote something to the effect: "Some believe that those who reject the Truth will believe nothing. Actually, those who reject the Truth will believe anything! Thanks for proving Chesterton a genius and a prophet all rolled into one and for proving him right yet again.

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