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New ID on Jack the Ripper [Artist Walter Richard Sickert, 1860 - 1942]
This is London ^ | December 7, 2001 | Unattributed Standard Reporter

Posted on 12/07/2001 9:42:10 AM PST by SlickWillard

New ID on Jack the Ripper

by Standard Reporter

Crime writer Patricia Cornwell claims to have unearthed proof that Jack the Ripper was in fact the painter Walter Sickert.

The best-selling American novelist spent almost £3million in her investigation, flying US forensic experts to London to examine the notorious Ripper letters. She claims they bear the same distinctive water mark as Sickert's stationery.

Ms Cornwell also bought 30 of the artist's works, ripping one of them up completely in her hunt for clues.

Twenty years after the 1888 crimes Sickert painted a series of gruesome pictures of a murdered prostitute. Ms Cornwell says certain elements in the paintings match scene-of-crime details.

She said: "I do believe 100 per cent that Sickert is the Whitechapel murderer. I am staking my reputation on this." Sickert is regarded as a key link between British art and the growth of Impressionism. But Ms Cornwell claims he led a secret double life as a serial killer - and that the five prostitutes named as the Ripper's victims were not the only women he killed.

She says Sickert had three secret studios in Whitechapel, giving him somewhere to run to as police arrived.


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; News/Current Events; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS: aaronkosminkski; aaronkosminski; art; blametheimmigrant; catherineeddowes; dukeofclarence; helixmakemineadouble; jacktheripper; jarilouhelainen; london; poland; princealbertvictor; russelledwards; unitedkingdom; waltersickert; whitechapel; williamgladstone
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Princeton University Press: Walter Sickert, by David Peters Corbett

wetcanvas.com: Walter Richard Sickert

The Getty Museum: Walter Richard Sickert

ARTCYCLOPEDIA: Walter Richard Sickert

       
Summer afternoon, c.1908-9     The Beribboned Washstand     A French Kitchen, about 1910 - 1920

Portrait of a Woman, possibly Therese Lessore

   
Ennui
The University of Michigan Museum of Art
    Ennui, c. 1914
Tate Gallery, London

               
Music Hall at the Bedford     The Old Bedford Music Hall     Noctes Ambrosianae (Spectators in the theatre balconies), 1906     The Hanging Gardens, 1929     Cheerio, 1929

Noctes Ambrosianae, 1906

Brighton Pierrots

   
The Harbour Steps, Dieppe, c.1910     Bathers at Dieppe

The Rue de la Boucherie with the Church of St Jacques, Dieppe, 1903

   
The Facade of Saint Marcos, 1896-97     Interior of St Mark's, Venice, 1896

       
View of Port St Denis, 1932           The Station at Queen's Road, Bayswater

       
Portrait of 2nd Lord Faringdon, c.1935     Oil Sketch of Aubrey Beardsley     Portrait of Rear Admiral Lumsden,
C.I.E., C.V.O., 1927 - 1928

1 posted on 12/07/2001 9:42:11 AM PST by SlickWillard
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To: SlickWillard
If one of the pictures won't load, then right click on it, and scroll to "Show Picture".
2 posted on 12/07/2001 9:42:48 AM PST by SlickWillard
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bump
3 posted on 12/07/2001 9:45:21 AM PST by Non-Sequitur
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To: SlickWillard
wetcanvas.com seems to be down at the moment. When it comes back up, more of the pictures should load.
4 posted on 12/07/2001 9:47:32 AM PST by SlickWillard
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To: SlickWillard
This was featured on Prime Time last night. Interesting. Cornwell is putting her reputation on the line for this and has spent $4 million of her own money in her investigation. So far, no DNA has been extracted from any of his letters or paintings, but the evidence does point toward him.
5 posted on 12/07/2001 9:50:35 AM PST by stanz
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To: SlickWillard
I was surfing last night and watched this 40 minute segment too. I'm not a Ripper buff but, her take was interesting and made as much sense as anything else out there.

It would have been nice to get the DNA evidence off of the stamps and envelopes to compare with living-next-of-kin though. Too bad it was degraded. Also, the coincidences with his moving back and forth to France brought a "Hmmmmmmmmm" out of me. I was also surprized at the mountain of material that is still archived at Scotland Yard on this case.

6 posted on 12/07/2001 9:51:10 AM PST by DoctorMichael
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To: SlickWillard
Very interesting. I was under the impression that Ripperologists had pretty much narrowed the field down to three, one American, and two Eastern Europeans. These throws a wrench into that whole idea.
7 posted on 12/07/2001 9:53:31 AM PST by Mr.Clark
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To: SlickWillard
Sickert figured prominently in the graphic novel FROM HELL, but did not appear in the motion picture version.
8 posted on 12/07/2001 9:59:08 AM PST by motexva
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To: motexva
Sickert figured prominently in the graphic novel FROM HELL, but did not appear in the motion picture version.

I haven't seen it yet, so don't post any spoilers.

9 posted on 12/07/2001 10:01:28 AM PST by SlickWillard
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To: SlickWillard; watson; Holmes
Interesting. What do you make of it, Holmes?

-archy-/-
10 posted on 12/07/2001 10:05:48 AM PST by archy
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To: stanz
Hard to imagine how a secret of this magnitude could have been kept for over 100 years.
11 posted on 12/07/2001 10:08:44 AM PST by Warren
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To: Warren
It could be that methodology was not inclusive of the psychological workups we have today. Cornwell mentioned that no one really got immersed in it because the "Ripper" mystique gained such popularity during those days and remained above the kind of scrutiny it deserved- - - kind of like the Clinton mystique- - - Teflon.
12 posted on 12/07/2001 10:19:08 AM PST by stanz
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To: Warren
She may be right, but she did admit in the inteview that in addition to having no DNA to match, that the handwriting of Sickert and the Ripper letters didn't match either.
13 posted on 12/07/2001 10:20:20 AM PST by ZGuy
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To: SlickWillard
The transcript of an online chat with Patricia Cornwell made at 9 AM PST today can be found at Mystery Solved? Author Patricia Cornwell on the Case of "Jack the Ripper"
14 posted on 12/07/2001 10:29:00 AM PST by ZGuy
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To: SlickWillard
The graphic novel is far superior to the movie, but the movie isn't bad. If you're into Ripper lore you'll realy enjoy FROM HELL, especially author Alan Moore's extensive appendix explaining a lot of the Victorian references in the work, plus a sort of overview of all the different theories about the ripper's identity over the past 100 years plus. But be warned - FROM HELL is very, very dark.
15 posted on 12/07/2001 10:32:31 AM PST by motexva
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To: SlickWillard
I thought "The Ripper's" letters to the police and media were sealed and not available for public or private inspection.

Oh, my wife and I went on "The Ripper Tour" while were were in London over the summer. Nothing special and not highly recommended, but it was interesting. The guide takes you to all the spots, except for one, where the victims were found. The one no longer exists as they have built a factory over it. He explains each of the murders and tells about the victims and other stuff. Don't expect too much from it though.

16 posted on 12/07/2001 10:35:23 AM PST by Phantom Lord
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To: SlickWillard; Fred25
Fascinating. If the evidence supports what she says in the chat, I think she is on to something.
17 posted on 12/07/2001 10:41:16 AM PST by mlo
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To: SlickWillard
As someone who has recently taken the Jack the Ripper Tour Walk in London, and seen the movie "From Hell", I highly recommend both.

NOTE: WARNING TO THE "TUPPERWARE" CROWD (THE ANTI-TIN FOIL HATTERS) THE EVIL MASONIC SECRET SOCIETY IS EXPOSED IN ALL ITS TREACHERY!!!

18 posted on 12/07/2001 10:46:17 AM PST by DrLiberty
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To: ZGuy
From http://www.abcnews.go.com/chat/cornwell1206_intro.html:
Mystery Solved?
Author Patricia Cornwell on the Case of "Jack the Ripper"


Patricia Cornwell
For more than a hundred years, law enforcement officials and crime buffs have tried to crack the case of "Jack the Ripper," the serial killer who brutally murdered five prostitutes in the East End of London in 1888.
     On this week’s PrimeTime, best-selling crime fiction writer Patricia Cornwell says she thinks she's solved history’s most famous murder mystery. "I’m a hundred percent certain that this case is closed," Cornwell tells ABCNEWS' Diane Sawyer.
     You can chat with Cornwell today at noon ET. Read our PrimeTime report and post your questions for Cornwell in the space below.
ABCNEWS.COM at 11:04am ET
Has best-selling novelist Patricia Cornwell solved the case of "Jack the Ripper"? Stay tuned for our live chat with Cornwell, today at noon ET.

Please post your questions in the space below. Keep in mind that our guests can't answer every question. We will make every effort, however, to select a broad range of questions. Thanks.


ABCNEWS.COM at 11:57am ET
Patricia, welcome! Thanks for joining us.

What sparked your interest in this case?


PATRICIA CORNWELL at 11:58am ET
I began spending time in Scotland Yard last May and became introduced to the case at that time. I decided it would be interesting to try to apply modern investigation and forensic science to a case that old and see what happens.
ABCNEWS.COM at 11:59am ET
At what point did you become convinced Walter Sickert was responsible for the 'Ripper' murders?
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:00pm ET
It was not exactly one point. It was cumulative. The more I learned about his habits, his personality and some of his very strange and inappropriate behavior, the more convinced I became.

For example, he had a habit of wandering the streets of Whitechapel very late at night in the deep fog. He chose prostitutes as his models. And throughout his entire life, he was a master of disguise.


ABCNEWS.COM at 12:01pm ET
Tell us about motive.
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:05pm ET
It's very difficult to pinpoint exactly what the motive of a pyschopath is. But he had a very abusive father and he had a serious physical anomaly which would likely have rendered him sexually dysfunctional.

Women were nothing but objects to him. He was also very jealous of the painter Whistler to whom he was apprenticed during the "Ripper" crimes.

Whister was everything Sickert aspired to be. He was dashing, handsome, always the center of attention and most of all, he was a genius. He was a remarkable painter that Sickert could only wish to be -- rather much like Salieri's envy of Mozart. It's interesting that Whistler fell madly in love and got married on Aug. 11th, 1888, mere weeks before the first woman was mutilated on the Whitechapel streets.

This is simplistic and I will go into more detail when I write about the case.


ABCNEWS.COM at 12:05pm ET
Karen Paradine writes: "How do you explain the fact that almost all of the women murdered were done so with such medical precision? From my understanding, it was originally thought that it had to be a doctor or surgeon who was responsible for the crimes. What is your take on this? How could an artist so precisely remove a woman's internal organs?"
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:07pm ET
These murders were NOT committed with medical precision. It is extremely easy to cut somebody open and grab an organ. If you don't believe me, simply talk to a medical examiner.

These were blitz attacks. They were mutilations. They were simply digging into the body cavity or throwing the viscera onto the streets.

After all of the autopsies I have seen, I can promise you there was no medical precision whatsoever involved in these murders.


ABCNEWS.COM at 12:08pm ET
Anne Huart asks: "Is there anything to suggest Sickert knew his victims? Did anyone close to Sickert die mysteriously? Did he show signs of trouble in his youth or throughout his life?"
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:11pm ET
As a boy, he showed narcissistic tendencies, i.e. that he was the center of the universe, very egotistical, master at manipulating people, and at a very early age he demonstrated a great gift of disguising himself to the point that neighbors and his own mother didn't recognize him.

In his early 20s, this ability to disguise himself reached its fruition when he became an actor. His specialty was makeup.

There is nothing to suggest he knew his victims. However, I firmly believe that he was a stalker.

His second wife died very suddenly of an alleged illness in 1920. He very quickly had her cremated, which was unusual back in those days. While there certainly is no evidence of foul play, her death to me is a curiosity.


PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:12pm ET
In fact, at her graveside service, he opened the casket, dug his hand into her ashes and flung them all over the people at the graveside.
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:13pm ET
To me, this again demonstrates his total disregard for others' feelings, his total inability to connect with other people -- which again are traits of a psychopath.
ABCNEWS.COM at 12:13pm ET
Laura Holmes asks: "Have you tried to find Sickert's widow's memoirs?"
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:15pm ET
To my knowledge, there are no memoirs from his widow, unless they remain with family and have never been offered to archives.

I microfilmed the entirety of Sickert's archives and have hunted down any letters pertaining to him in just about every archival source there is and have found very little -- maybe one or two letters written by his widow Terese Lessore.


ABCNEWS.COM at 12:15pm ET
Kevin L. Schroeder writes: "I believe there was no mention on the show of the results for the handwriting analysis. What was determined?"
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:17pm ET
It is believed that the handwriting in the alleged 'Ripper' letters was disguised, which is not at all surprising because people knew, back then, that the police did attempt to make handwriting comparisons.

Handwriting comparison is not a science; it is very subjective and relatively useless if somebody has disguised his handwriting. Sickert most certainly would have know this.


ABCNEWS.COM at 12:17pm ET
Amanda Reynolds writes: "I admit that I'm skeptical, although I believe you have certainly done your research. Ms. Corwell, could you tell me a little more about the mysterious new 'Ripper' letter that was not preserved? Perhaps what it said, or why it was not preserved?"
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:20pm ET
This was a letter that was donated to the public record office in London around a year ago and, according to the public record office, had been in the possession of the 'Ripper' expert Donald Rumbelow.

The letter makes reference to the author's "murder of Mary Kelly" and it included an envelope with a postmark and a stamp. This particular letter was one of two alleged 'Ripper' letters that bore the watermark that is identical to the watermark on Walter Sickert's personal stationary at that time.

I don't know where the letter has been all these years. But there is absolutely no reason to suspect it is anything but authentic because, were it not, someone would have had to manufacture the postmark, the stamp and a watermark that was dated 1887, which I believe would have been impossible.


ABCNEWS.COM at 12:21pm ET
How common was this watermark at the time?
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:23pm ET
This particular paper manufacturer was very popular. However, it was a very high grade of paper and was not something that an ordinary person would use.

In fact, of all the alleged 'Ripper' letters in the public record office, and we're talking about at least 500, there were only 2 or possibly 3 letters that had any sort of watermark at all. Two of those were the ones that were identical to Sickert's personal stationary.

One thing the show did not make clear was that there were two 'Ripper' letters that bore this watermark -- one of them, which the police have always taken seriously, has been in their files since the beginning. The other was the recent one to turn up.


ABCNEWS.COM at 12:24pm ET
mnieman writes: "You stated in your interview that the murders never stopped, they just stopped calling them 'Jack the Ripper' murders. As a result of your investigation, how many murders do you attribute to 'Jack the Ripper.'"
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:27pm ET
That is a question that will never be precisely answered. However, based on the unsolved murders that I have come across in my research from looking at police reports, morgue statistics and newspaper stories and hospital records written at the time of unsolved crimes, in addition to my knowledge of serial killers, I would not be surprised if this so-called 'Jack the Ripper' (i.e. Sickert) murdered anywhere from 20-40 people during his active, violent years.

You need to remember that most lust murderers begin to burn out in their late 40s.


ABCNEWS.COM at 12:27pm ET
Dennis Dunne wonders if there were any 'Ripper'-style murders in England while Sickert was living in France?
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:31pm ET
I have found no record of similar murders in England during his absence and I find it more than coincidental that less than a year after he returned to London and moved to Camden Town, a prostitute was found with her throat cut ear to ear, nude in her bed, in Camden Town.

Sickert told the newspapers that he had shown up at that crime scene to sketch it and the body. That newspaper clipping was in his own scrap book.

The body of the victim only remained inside the lodging house for several hours, long enough for the police surgeon to examine her before her body was transported to teh morgue. It would strike me as a remarkable "coincidence" that Sickert just happened to be in the area during that time and just happened to have his sketch book with him.

My conclusion would be that either he showed up because he already knew about it, for obvious reasons, or that he never visited the crime scene at all except which he was there cutting her throat.


ABCNEWS.COM at 12:32pm ET
Mark Rush writes: "Ms. Cornwell, did you take any direction in your search from a book published in the 1970s naming Walter Sickert as 'Jack the Ripper'? I was disappointed at the subsequent 'debunking' of that theory back then. But then, as now, Sickert's paintings point to an eerie similarity between his subjects and the 'Ripper's' victims. Thank you for your solid dedication and superb scholarship."
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:36pm ET
Thank you! Sickert's name has come up in the last 30 years because of such theories. Interestingly enough, although the theories are wrong, had it not been for such theories I don't think Sickert's name would ever have been mentioned.

The theories had to do with this royal conspiracy which is absolutely wrong. There is no conspiracy. What we have here is a plain and simple case of serial murders committed by one of the most diabolical psychopaths I have ever come across. It is no wonder he has gotten away with it for so long.

Sickert was never a suspect during the 'Ripper' era nor was he ever a suspect in the Camden Town murder or any others despite the fact that he enjoyed reinacting such crimes in front of his friends.


ABCNEWS.COM at 12:36pm ET
CMac2 writes: "Is there any piece of evidence out there that a critic of yours could use to say that Sickert was NOT the 'Ripper'?"
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:37pm ET
I cannot think of any piece of evidence that would indicate Sickert was not the 'Ripper' though I am sure some of my detractors might say that he was simply a rather warped practical jokester.

What is also difficult to comprehend about him and other psychopaths is that he could be perfectly charming, generous and delightful. But the same has been said about Ted Bundy, the Nazis, etc.


ABCNEWS.COM at 12:38pm ET
A question from Becky Wilson: "Would exhuming the bodies of the victims help procure a DNA sample of the murderer, and if so, have you pursued this option?"
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:42pm ET
Unfortunately, exhuming the bodies would serve no purpose. Although we might be able to extract DNA from their remains, there is nothing to compare it to. All bloody clothing and other evidence was disposed of at the time (simply tossed out in the alley way).

Sickert has no blood descendants that we know of. He had no children in his three marriages. But even if we got Sickert's DNA, we still have no evidence from the victims to compare it to.

For example, there was no seminal fluid, and it was believed by the police that there was no rape or sexual activity involved, which again would fit with a killer who might be sexually dysfunctional.

Seminal fluid, for example, has even been found in the Green River strangling cases. It is uncommon that it was not found in any of the 'Ripper' cases or the Camden Town murder.


PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:43pm ET
You have to remember that in the 1880s authorities couldn't distinguish animal blood from human blood, nor did they know anything about the forensic science that is commonplace now, not even fingerprints.
ABCNEWS.COM at 12:43pm ET
JennyO says: "With DNA technology it seems many 'old' crimes could be investigated and solved. Is it fair and even necessary to the public to open old cases rather than focus on current investigations? Is it okay to 'pin' crimes on people who are not here to defend themselves?"
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:48pm ET
First of all, if there is ample evidence that someone has committed a crime, even if he or she is not here to defend themselves, I believe justice should be fulfilled.

There is no statute of limitation on murder, so to speak. Any act of violence that is revealed and pinned to a perpetrator should be made known if for no other reason than out of respect for the victims and what they suffered.

However contemporary crimes, where perpetrators are still among the public posing a threat, should definitely take priority over very old, cold cases which no longer pose physical danger to the public.

Which is why, in the case of the 'Ripper' investigation I used forensic scientists who took vacation days and did this investigation on their own time under the auspices of the Virginia Institute of Forensic Science and Medicine.

You also have to remember that even though "Jack the Ripper" has been gone for a very long time, he has continued to influence other violent offenders and it is time for his myth to be dispelled and for him to be relegated to the grave, where he belongs.


ABCNEWS.COM at 12:49pm ET
Mary Krause wonders: "Have you thought about checking the red paint in Sickert's paintings for the prostitutes' DNA?"
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:52pm ET
That is an excellent question, and I am impressed that you would think of it. I have wondered the same thing because during the most murderous times, he tended to use blood red paint -- which he did not use during the other periods in his artistic life.

As an experiment, I mixed blood with red oil paint to see what would happen. The blood has been perfectly preserved in the paint, and you cannot tell it is there.

I fully intend to see if it is possible to extract DNA from human blood mixed with paint. But I believe it is unlikely such a test would be successful. Turpentine, for example, might destroy the DNA.

But at present, this remains an unanswered question. But by the time I have written about this case, I promise you I will have answered that, both by testing current blood mixed with paint and red paint from Sickert's paintings.


ABCNEWS.COM at 12:53pm ET
A "Ripperologist" writes: "Patricia, don't you think it's going a bit far saying that the murders are "100% solved"? The evidence you've provided against Sickert is circumstantial at best, flimsy at worst; and you admit it would never stand up in court. What differentiates your claim from those of hundreds before you who claimed to have had the 'final solution' to the case?"
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:56pm ET
I have taken an investigative and scientific approach versus theorizing and have had access to documents that no one has ever touched or seen -- thousands of pages of letters, for example, that contain some very interesting and incriminating information.

You have to remember that what you saw on television was a very distilled version -- albeit very well done -- of my work.

You must also remember that if this crime were tried in a modern court room, we would have had access to modern forensic science and medicine and I have no doubt that there would have been a conviction.

During the Victorian era, people were convicted based on circumstantial evidence and I think the matching watermark alone would have been very incriminating.

You will see when I write up this case that there is a lot of very compelling information that you have yet to hear about.


ABCNEWS.COM at 12:57pm ET
SandieSG asks: "What do you think of the theory by former FBI profiler John Douglas, put forth in his book The Cases That Haunt Us that the 'Ripper' killer was most probably an Eastern European immigrant to England whose rage against women escalated in the exceptionally gruesome murder of Mary Kelly?"
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 12:59pm ET
I have not looked at that. But John Douglas is a good friend of mine and I very much respect his profiling skills. All I can say is I agree with him that the crimes escalated. But I believe they escalated beyond the Mary Kelley case, culminating in dismemberment. Many people don't know that torsos and body parts began to show up not only Whitechapel but in France.

As for the killer being of Eastern European extraction -- for what it's worth, Sickert was born in Germany and was Danish, even if he did spend most of his life in England and in France.


ABCNEWS.COM at 1:00pm ET
SweeneySkip writes: "Don't you think it a bit odd that for 113 years this most famous of murderers would have eluded the greatest sleuths in history? I'm not saying that I disagree with you, because I think you make some very compelling points, buy why you? What approach have you taken that others haven't in order to solve it so relatively quickly and easily?"
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 1:05pm ET
First of all, I have been working in the world of criminal investigation for virtually half of my life and perhaps have a different perspective from many others who have studied the case.

I have never been interested in the 'Ripper' case in terms of its status as an unsolved mystery or a puzzle. So when I began to look into it, it was with the eyes of cold objectivity.

Also, to be fair to those who have investigated it before me, I would be the first to admit that I have been blessed with resources that have made it possible for me to dig as deep and as far as possible. In order to secure rare documents such as Sickert letters -- just to give one example -- it was not only very difficult, but very costly.

I have also had enough experience in forensic medicine to read the inquests with a different eye than someone else might. I also have a very clear awareness of forensic possibilities -- not only then, but now.

One thing that was not stated on Primetime was that we have not finished testing for DNA. We're now in round two, and maybe we'll get lucky. But even if we don't, I stand firm in my belief that Walter Sickert brutally murdered these women and others.


ABCNEWS.COM at 1:05pm ET
Anita asks: "Have you heard from any of the Sickert family since the airing of this piece on Prime Time?"
PATRICIA CORNWELL at 1:09pm ET
Yes, I had a long conversation with his nephew, John Lessore. This is the nephew of Sickert's third wife. And, or course, Mr. Lessore is very upset at what I have to say and certainly not about to believe such a thing of his uncle.

I told him I was very sorry for the pain I know this must cause him. But that is part of the ripple effect of evil. It continues to hurt people forever. I told that I did not do this to him, Mr. Lessore, but the person who has hurt him was Sickert.

Let me add that for everybody who has been kind enough to log on today, thank you for your interest. I am very impressed with your intelligent and astute questions. And finally, I fully expect people who will disbelieve what I have to say. But whether you do or don't, I promise you that I am telling the truth and would never accuse anybody of any crime if I did not have evidence that speaks as loudly as this evidence does.

I will do my best to clearly present this to you in detail when I am finished writing about this case.


ABCNEWS.COM at 1:10pm ET
Our thanks to Patricia Cornwell and all those who joined the live chat! If you'd like to chat with other ABCNEWS.com viewers about this case, visit our Primetime message board.

19 posted on 12/07/2001 11:06:11 AM PST by SlickWillard
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To: SlickWillard
Wierd, wild stuff.
20 posted on 12/07/2001 11:07:47 AM PST by Silly
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