Posted on 08/06/2019 8:56:30 AM PDT by Kaslin
Earlier today, President Trump -- with Vice President Pence by his side -- addressed the nation from the White House. Americans are still reeling from a bloody and horrible weekend, during which two young white males perpetrated appallingly lethal mass shootings on consecutive days. A white supremacist and anti-immigrant fanatic murdered 20 (update: now 21) people at a Walmart in Texas on Saturday, then a disturbed self-identified leftist killed nine on a busy city street in Ohio. The president forcefully denounced the "barbaric" violence, calling for unity and healing, and urging elected officials to take bipartisan action to help curb such spasms of mass violence. In case you missed his remarks, here they are in their entirety:
The president was right to describe this phenomenon as "domestic terrorism," pledging to deploy "any and all assistance required" from the federal government to aid the communities torn apart by this bloodshed. He also promised resources to "disrupt hate crimes and domestic terrorism," specifically mentioning monitoring internet forums in which extremists are radicalized and bred. The task, in which he enlisted government agencies and social media companies, is to "detect mass shooters before they strike." This is, needless to say, much easier said than done -- and also raises civil liberties questions. Trump also rightly singled out white supremacy and racism in his comments: "In one voice, our nation must condemn racism, bigotry and white supremacy," he said. "These sinister ideologies must be defeated. Hatred has no place in America." National Review's Sunday editorial -- entitled 'Crush This Evil' -- is profound:
The killer was the second gunman to cite Christchurch as an inspiration in the last six months. The perpetrator of the massacre at California’s Poway Synagogue — also a devotee of 8chan — made exactly the same claim in April. In the Internet era, malevolence tends to echo...If, as they should, the various providers that make websites such as 8chan possible decide that they no longer wish to do so, that is their prerogative. If, as they should, Americans take it upon themselves to spot the early warning signs of radicalization and do whatever they are able to discourage it, that is their prerogative. Here, as elsewhere, the best prophylactic against mass killings is individual intervention and social responsibility... Now, as ever, evil is evil and murder is murder, and we gain nothing by refusing to call them by their names.
President Trump also embraced a proposal known as "red flag laws," which we've discussed in the past. Firearm-related mental health restraining orders, with expedited due process provisions, seem like a good idea. Here's how writer David French, a conservative constitutional attorney, described them last year:
It’s called a gun-violence restraining order, or GVRO. While there are various versions of these laws working their way through the states (California passed a GVRO statute in 2014, and it went into effect in 2016), broadly speaking they permit a spouse, parent, sibling, or person living with a troubled individual to petition a court for an order enabling law enforcement to temporarily take that individual’s guns right away...The concept of the GVRO is simple, not substantially different from the restraining orders that are common in family law, and far easier to explain to the public than our nation’s mental-health adjudications. Moreover, the requirement that the order come from people close to the respondent and that they come forward with real evidence (e.g. sworn statements, screenshots of social-media posts, copies of journal entries) minimizes the chance of bad-faith claims.
Trump specifically endorsed "extreme risk protection orders" with "rapid due process," then pivoted to calling for aggressive and expedited application of the death penalty for mass shooters. There are no easy ways to circumvent due process on this front, but I suspect that a fair number of death penalty opponents -- who, like me, oppose the practice due to concerns over wrongful convictions -- are open to pursuing this form of justice against hateful bigots who commit acts of terrorism, with their culpability not remotely in doubt. On the subject of gun regulations and restrictions, the president did not propose any new action, but smartly highlighted two steps already taken during his term in office; Trump signed a Fix-NICS provision into law last March, strengthening background checks, and took executive action barring 'bump stocks,' which were used to horrifying effect by the Las Vegas shooter. While progress may be limited and frustrating to many, the notion that "nothing" ever gets done isn't accurate.
The president's one false note, in my view, was echoing other officials in scapegoating video games. The evidence of linkage between violent games and violent actions is very weak to non-existent. In his speech, Trump signaled an openness to any ideas that "will actually work." This isn't one of them. Far more useful, I think, would be a collective agreement among media outlets (the government should not be involved) to severely limit mentions of mass shooters' names, and to largely suppress images of their faces.
President Trump complete remarks on Mass Shootings (Link to the video)
I’ve heard of 4chan. What is 8chan?
Easy to denounce “white supremacy,” until you have to define what that means.
This is a backdoor for a national registry and confiscation.
Amendment V
No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.
Why don't Americans "reel" from 7 murders a week in Chicago, and more in Baltimore? For all the hysteria over El Paso -- that is just 3 weekends worth of death in Chicago every single summer. Is that because every single on of those murders are by "young black males" -- and they're, what...expected by liberal and RINO racists?
OK, I’m just thinking out loud here, so please just hear me out without judging. I’m not sharing my opinion, just a thought exercise.
I just did some research on 8chan and they seem to have online gaming roots but are also extremely right wing. What it renimds me of is the whole MGTOW movement. I did some research on it a while back and my impression is that they are the male equivalent of fourth wave feminism. That is, just as these feminists are angry misandrists, these men are angry misogynists. The difference being that the women show their anger by protesting, yelling and screaming, remaining in “groups” for the same reason women tend to go to the ladies room together. They are more communal than men.
And these 8chan guys are the male equivalent. Except men in that mindset are physically dangerous and go the “loner” route. Fortunately, they are much more rare, but they can be extremely dangerous.
Now, one can argue that society did it to them, etc., but the bottom line is that it is worth considering that they are the male equivalent of the man hating feminists, but acting out as an angry, out of control man would, rather than how an angry, out of control woman would.
Again, I’m only posting this for discussion, not as my opinion of what is going on.
The Left knows what will happen if they go for confiscation.
This “Red Flag” lie is just a smoke screen for incremental confiscation.
No sir - it is NOT sensible.
No further laws on gun control are needed - as all guns were purchased legally by legal citizens and no parents or family intervened.
What they always fail to tell you about red flag laws, interestingly enough, is that cops can flag you too, not just relatives, etc.
What we really need is constitutional carry.
I can forgive Trump’s inability to deal w/immigration as the RINO congress is against him, and his failure to control spending like with the shutdown, since he didn’t campaign on that so I knew it going in.
Even the bumpstock bit I could forgive given his many more positives.
But if he does this forget it. I don’t vote for gun grabbers. If no other palatable person is in the running, I abstain.
Oh BS - have you happened to look at the daily kos? How about Reddit’s political forum or chappotraphouse?
8chan was and is nothing of the sort but please continue perpetuating the propaganda.
It came out in court documents that the FBI posts there as agent provocateurs.
I have no idea what you are talking about.
To perpetuate the conversation (which is why I posted that), I would include daily kos and Reddit folks. I’m not talking about 8chan specifically. I’m talking about the mindset. It can happen anywhere - but apparently is banned at 4Chan. So yes, thrown Daily Kos and Reddit into the pile if you want.
dude ... try breaking the pills in half ...
I agree with you, and I mentioned the same thing - and various Freepers told me I was stupid and naive - and that its obvious Trump is yet again playing 4D chess with leftists, and co-opting their position to ultimately grind down any initiative they have on the issue.
I'm always willing to admit being wrong, but I hope to see some proof.
At least your response was funny. :)
I wish folks would take my first sentences seriously. I think a serious conversation about the main point of my post is worth having. Seriously. And the main point is “male equivalent of angry feminists”, and how they are different from the females. Can it be used to short circuit future events?
You can’t find out if you’re not willing to even discuss it.
These will work just as well as the FISA courts in 2016 when localized political and ideological (or just plain bureaucratic stupidity) gets involved.
With paid informants it’s the Wild West. All the police state agencies do this. It’s hard to find out who these people are because their identities are protected by the secret police.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/nov/16/fbi-entrapment-fake-terror-plots
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/08/04/fbi-informant-crimes-report/2613305/
it an open forum ... a computer software platform ..
anyone can post there ... even FBI folks posing as whatever suits them ...
do you really think that all of the posters on those (mostly) unmoderated forums think alike?
Perhaps - but being an angry feminist in America today will get you fame on TV and movies, it will get you top political positions, or the ability to influence government at the highest levels, and earn you all kinds of money in the form of media promotions, book deals, or government and academic grants.
What does the male side of that equation get? Shunning to corners of the web and extreme institutional hate.
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