Posted on 06/19/2017 10:20:48 AM PDT by Kaslin
Last Updated Jun 19, 2017 11:37 AM EDT
TOKYO -- Japan's coast guard is investigating why it took nearly an hour for a deadly collision between a U.S. Navy destroyer and a container ship to be reported.
A coast guard official said Monday they are trying to find out what the crew of the Philippine-flagged ACX Crystal was doing before reporting the collision off Japan's coast to authorities 50 minutes later.
The ACX Crystal collided with the USS Fitzgerald off Japan's coast, killing seven of the destroyer's crew of nearly 300. The ships collided early Saturday morning, when the Navy said most of the 300 sailors on board would have been sleeping. Authorities have declined to speculate on a cause while the crash remains under investigation.
A track of the much-larger container ship's route by MarineTraffic, a vessel-tracking service, shows it made a sudden turn as if trying to avoid something at about 1:30 a.m., before continuing eastward. It then made a U-turn and returned around 2:30 a.m. to the area near the collision.
The impact crushed the starboard side of the Fitzgerald. The ship was listing as it sailed into its home port in Yokosuka, Japan, Saturday, CBS News correspondent Ben Tracy reports. The commander of the U.S. 7th Fleet said the sailors' actions kept the ship from sinking.
"This was not a small collision," Vice Adm. Joseph Aucoin said. "It was right near the pilot's house, and there is a big puncture."
(Excerpt) Read more at cbsnews.com ...
Chuckles. In my experience, Navy chow was superior to what our Marine cooks served up. But AF chow beat everyone.
Who's full of shit besides you?
“And, remember all of the talk a couple of years ago about the Russians/Chinese being able to blind US surveillance systems?”
I have never been in the navy but that is what I am wondering, that or some sort of hack. The spotters outside may be reporting there is a ship at so and so and the bridge feels like they have it under control based on the electronics but the course and direction on the electronics is not true.
I agree with others we may not ever know the true story as I don’t doubt our government would throw some sailors under the bus rather than let out our electronics had been compromised.
One thing that surprised me is how high up the damage was on the container ship. I would have thought the destroyer was a lot lower than the container ship. Once again, sorry as I am not expert on this by any means.
If it is something that major I am not sure
It will be proven at their Courts Martial.
Also ex-Navy. That was a chilling audio recording from the Porter. I know that some Captains like to put their OODs into tense situations, but this CO seemed to make the situation worse; my first CO would've taken command on the spot, got the ship out of that situation, and then taken appropriate action with the OOD later.
That said, we don't know right now, if there were other ships around the Fitzgerald and Crystal, that may have caused an unexpected turn. Still, the Crystal would not make a "sudden" turn; she was far too big to do anything "suddenly." The Fitz should have been far enough away to detect any potential CPA-zero situations, and taken steps to avoid them.
Yes. They’re known as sailors and consist of officers and men. At least in the U.S. Navy I served in from 1967 to 1971. I have almost two years on the Pacific in a small Gearing class tin can launched in 1943. We were in one collision at sea off the coast of the RVN in 1970. We hit a wooden fishing tug five miles off the coast that was DIW with running lights lit. We had this boat on radar at 25 miles in a flat sea and visual at 10 miles. We hit it going around 5 kts. Our old man was wakened and was on the bridge when we hit around 2 AM. Several weeks later there was a Change of Command ceremony in Subic. Been in and out of Yokosuka multiple times. What bothers me about this one is that the old man was still in his fart sack.
So, you’re willing to condemn your fellow Sailors before all the facts are in?
I don’t care how much time you have in whatever ship.
You weren’t there.
Consider, for just a moment, if you are wrong.
You would be disparaging your fellow Sailors on a public forum.
Now, let’s consider my point.
I say wait until all the facts are in.
Does that disparage your fellow Sailors?
Nope.
You are full of shit.
Your statements are here on a public forum to prove what you have written.
Thank you for your service.
That is a question that the Senior member of the Navy investigation team will ask the Officer of the Deck at the time of the collision.
uhh.... I think you missed the point....
I never said it was a "mere" navigational error. I agree that situational awareness is always required, but I think the Fitzgerald and the Cole situations were completely different circumstances.
Helm! Hard Port!!! No, No, No, Starboard! Nooooo! Oops!
Something like that?
Sorry, it’’s not even funny. Somebody really screwed up.
This is bizarre. Perhaps a loss of steering function?
How much control redundancy is built into a navel ship like this?
What point? You suggested that all the sailors would be sleeping because it was night time. I was merely pointing out that there are plenty of sailors working at all hours of day/night.
No matter what, the CO and OOD of the Fitz have a lot of ‘splainin to do.
But I still think it’s possible to lie your way into a deliberate collision in the last minute. “Don’t worry, I’m turning to port, I’ll pass behind your stern.”
Then turn hard to starboard, the Fitz never in their wildest dreams believing this could happen.
Yes, if 20 minutes out you told the OOD: “That ship is going to try to ram you. Don’t let it ram you.”
Then it’s all very easy.
But if the Crystal maneuvered into a passing/crossing situation, with the covert intention to attempt a ramming, and then lied on the VHF (”I’m turning to port, no worries captain.”) and then turned to starboard, completely unexpectedly.....
That’s my theory. It’s just a theory.
Same reasoning: a tow truck “should not be able” to collide with a state trooper’s high performance patrol car.
But if the tow truck driver crosses the double yellow line at the last second....collision.
Even though “the state trooper’s patrol car could EASILY avoid and intentional ramming by a tow truck on the highway. Easily.”
The captain’s “at sea” cabin is literally meters from the bridge, so there can be some confusion about where he was.
Sea Jihad.
Captain should have been on the bridge with a CPA less than two miles, especially by a contact that had an erratic path.
Yes, the actual timeline will be critical to understanding the true picture.
My main question was whether or not this “turn” occurred within the shipping corridor. Or was a turn to exit the shipping lane for some reason, possibly for reasons ltc8k6 suggests.
You’re quite correct. The Crystal couldn’t do any quickly, but that U turn to port appears to have put them in the path of the much faster moving Fitzgerald, which should have been able to avoid the collision. But as you say, we don’t know. It’s possible colliding with the Crystal WAS the better option.
“The Fitz had propulsion after the collision, and most certainly before. It was hit at an oblique angle by a cargo vessel, at low speed, on the open seas.
There are no other relevant factors or conditions.”
Highly relevant will be any last-minute ship-to-ship VHF comms, in the event that the Crystal deliberately mislead the OOD/CO on the Fitz.
“Don’t worry, I’m coming to port, I’ll pass your stern.” (Then puts the helm over to starboard.)
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