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Europe 2017: Brexit, far-right surging, Russian threat
Associate Press ^ | December 30th, 2016 | GREGORY KATZ

Posted on 12/30/2016 10:38:31 AM PST by Old Teufel Hunden

LONDON (AP) -- Europe's leaders are not expecting a smooth ride in 2017 following a year marked by political upheaval, extremist attacks, unchecked immigration, and a rising military threat from Russia.

Britain is suing for divorce, the far-right is on the march, some former Soviet satellites seem disillusioned with the West even as Russia seeks to regain its influence, and America will soon inaugurate an untested, seemingly Russia-friendly president who has voiced doubts about the usefulness of the NATO alliance. The uncertainty is thick enough to breathe.

It all looks so different from the triumphant panorama presented more than two decades ago when the European Union was expanding. Formerly captive nations freed from Soviet control seemed eager to embrace liberal democracy, capitalism - and substantial subsidies - from their wealthier neighbors.

There was rosy talk of an ever-closer union, the development of a single currency, and a cooperative relationship with Russia. It hasn't turned out that way - the EU, with its touted ideals of shared democratic values and free movement of people, has never seem so frayed and vulnerable.

"The risks for 2017 remain very high," said Adam Thomson, director of the London-based European Leadership Network research group. "We Europeans need to recognize that we face a level of risk in the West-Russian confrontation that we have not seen since the 1960s. It is partly because a lot of the security rules of the road have been torn up or suspended, so there are fewer rules and less predictability."

(Excerpt) Read more at hosted.ap.org ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: brexit; elections; govtabuse
I would only caution readers that when an article says far right in relation to Europe, do not necessarily equate that to right wing in America. They are not the same. While I believe that LePenn would be good for France and Geert good for the Netherlands, I don't know enough about these other "right wing" group to know if they are truly fascists are more in line with what we believe in.

I am worried about the Russian threat against the Baltics, Poland and other former soviet satellites. These central European countries are some of America's strongest allies now, far better than Germany and other western Europeans.

1 posted on 12/30/2016 10:38:31 AM PST by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: Old Teufel Hunden

Another “far right equals anyone who is not a Pinko” article.


2 posted on 12/30/2016 10:42:51 AM PST by BenLurkin (The above is not a statement of fact. It is either satire or opinion. Or both.)
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To: Old Teufel Hunden

I think Le Pen is going to win it and that will be the end of the EU.

Also, Mr. Megan is retired from 25 years in the USMC and I thank you for your service!


3 posted on 12/30/2016 10:47:57 AM PST by MeganC (Hate crime: The heinous act of disagreeing with a liberal.)
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To: BenLurkin

Europe does not have a “far right” , their “right wingers” are classic liberals who simply are not hard left Marxists.


4 posted on 12/30/2016 10:48:39 AM PST by rdcbn (.... when Poets buy guns, tourist season is over ......d)
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To: Old Teufel Hunden

I am proud to call myself a fascist, in the mold of Mussolini.


5 posted on 12/30/2016 10:58:42 AM PST by ichabod1 (Make America Normal Again)
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To: rdcbn

Do you really think there are no hardline nationalist fascist factions in Europe? They cannot speak. It is not permitted. But of course it is there.


6 posted on 12/30/2016 11:01:38 AM PST by ichabod1 (Make America Normal Again)
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To: Old Teufel Hunden
I am worried about the Russian threat against the Baltics, Poland and other former soviet satellites.

You've bought into the propaganda. Putin is no angel, but I'm more worried about Obama, Soros and their fellow multi-culti, progressive globalists starting a war with Russia, who they view as a stumbling block to total control of Europe. They've already tried in Ukraine and Syria.

7 posted on 12/30/2016 11:15:25 AM PST by PGR88
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To: BenLurkin

“Far right” means that you’re tired of being raped, mugged, harassed, taxed-to-death and killed by migrants.


8 posted on 12/30/2016 11:18:13 AM PST by Opinionated Blowhard ("When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.")
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To: PGR88

Poland will kick Russia’s ass if they tried. EVERY Pole will fight.


9 posted on 12/30/2016 11:18:49 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: MeganC
"Mr. Megan is retired from 25 years in the USMC and I thank you for your service!"

So do I. Thanks for your service Mr. Megan and Semper Fi! You as well Mrs. Megan. I remember all the times my wife had to hold down the fort when I was deployed overseas. Not an easy job! Thank you for helping to make America Great again!
10 posted on 12/30/2016 11:23:33 AM PST by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: PGR88

It would make no sense for Russia to attack the Baltic states.

Europe is in big trouble right now. He should just let it die on its own. No sense provoking everyone by invading the Baltics. He’ll get it without firing a shot when the EU finally keels over in a couple of years.


11 posted on 12/30/2016 11:26:18 AM PST by KyCats
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To: MeganC

I would love to see Le Pen win. And then Frauke Petry in Germany. (While we’re dreaming might as well go big!)


12 posted on 12/30/2016 11:31:12 AM PST by KyCats
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To: PGR88
"You've bought into the propaganda."

If I have, so has Gen Breedlove who as NATOS Supreme allied commander has been warning for a number of years concerning Russia's retrenchment. He's not the only one in the military community that believes this.
13 posted on 12/30/2016 11:31:40 AM PST by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: Old Teufel Hunden

It’s happening a few years too late, but reality is finally hitting the euros upside the head and getting their attention.


14 posted on 12/30/2016 11:32:13 AM PST by aquila48
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To: KyCats

The thought is that if he invaded the Baltics NATO would be treaty bound to defend them as they are in NATO. If NATO responded as tepidly as they did in Ukraine which was the first test, then NATO would crumble and all of the former satellite states would go back into the arms of Russia. A big gamble, but considering the state of the west’s military preps, is it that big of a gamble. Most wars have started because of perceived weakness by one side and western Europe is extremely weak militarily. With the current sequestration, I wouldn’t suggest we are strong either.


15 posted on 12/30/2016 11:34:46 AM PST by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: Old Teufel Hunden

Breedlove was a moron. While everyone freaks out pretending its 1982 and invasion is imminent, even a casual look at the map shows a relentless NATO march east, right up to the border of Russia where they finally began to get some rumbling.

Meanwhile, we have countless wars, interventions, covert wars, and destabilizing operations going on all Africa and the middle east.

Then we run around screaming about Russian aggression. It’s actually kinda comical.


16 posted on 12/30/2016 11:48:02 AM PST by DesertRhino
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To: Old Teufel Hunden
People born in the Baltics are leaving in huge numbers as fast as they can. Putin doesn't want a bunch of failed States just so he can add territory to what is already the largest nation on earth.

The main reason the Baltics have their panties in a wad is that they have no tax base and they're falling apart. They're crying wolf over Russia in hopes of fat US and NATO bases making up for their tax shortfall so they're not running broke and decaying little countries. It's no fun being a big politico in a country that can't afford to keep the lights on in the offices.

Bureaucrats who have no money to spend or who are afraid their budget will be cut can usually come up with some sort of "dire emergency" that they claim requires their little fiefdom remain intact and that's exactly what all the hoopla about Russia invading them is, bureaucratic desperation.

17 posted on 12/30/2016 11:52:44 AM PST by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory !!)
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To: Old Teufel Hunden

Ukraine wasn’t NATO.

All of this Breedlove and war drums in NATO is designed to do one thing. Its a raindance for the defense industry, designed to bring back the defense spending of the cold war. Nothing more.


18 posted on 12/30/2016 11:54:32 AM PST by DesertRhino
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To: DesertRhino

Fine, call Breedlove a moron. Why not call Gen Dunford a moron, call Gen Milley a moron also. They’ve all gone on record with statements regarding Russia aggression. Newsflash, Putin is not our friend.

We are in this position because of a weak and feckless leader to be sure, but President Trump has to put a stop to this when he gets into office by getting rid of sequestration and making our military strong again. He also has to encourage our European partners in NATO to start antying up and living up to their military commitments to NATO. Some are starting to. If you think this is a joke and all of these military men who see far more intelligence than we do are morons, well then you can stay a part of the Neville Chamberlain wing of the Republican party and yes Chamberlain was a tory or English conservative.


19 posted on 12/30/2016 11:58:08 AM PST by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: Rashputin

I guess they are not upset with all of the Russian forces that have been staged closer to them. That has nothing to do with it.


20 posted on 12/30/2016 12:00:29 PM PST by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: Rashputin

I guess they are not upset with all of the Russian forces that have been staged closer to them. That has nothing to do with it.


21 posted on 12/30/2016 12:01:09 PM PST by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: DesertRhino
"Ukraine wasn’t NATO."

Ummm I never said they were. They and Georgia have made overtures to be in NATO but it's never going to happen as long as they are unstable. However, the Baltic states are in nato. I said Ukraine was a test and it's a test to see what the U.S. and western Europe would do and we failed the test or in Putin's eyes, he was successful.

We do need to up the spending on our military. Spend to keep the peace or you will be spending to wage war later.
22 posted on 12/30/2016 12:04:39 PM PST by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: Old Teufel Hunden
If I have, so has Gen Breedlove who as NATOS Supreme allied commander

You do not get to the top of NATO unless you are part of the progressive-left statist status quo.

NATO's mission ended 25 years ago. NATO's mission now is to keep the EU on the globalist plantation, and stand guard over the steady transformation of EU society and culture by massive, steady social-engineering and immigration.

23 posted on 12/30/2016 12:04:47 PM PST by PGR88
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To: DesertRhino
Meanwhile, we have countless wars, interventions, covert wars, and destabilizing operations going on all Africa and the middle east. Then we run around screaming about Russian aggression. It’s actually kinda comical.

Bingo. NATO is being used as one of many tools used to push the slow and steady transformation of Europe, its culture and population. Russia is resisting the march towards a multi-culti western-progressive world, so as a nation, it must be weakened and broken. Hence every Obama operation from Syria, to Libya, to Ukraine/Crimea to NATO.

24 posted on 12/30/2016 12:10:01 PM PST by PGR88
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To: Old Teufel Hunden
Ok, thirty miles from St. Petersburg and in your opinion that portion of Russia and any portion of Russia that borders one of the Baltic States should be some sort of DMZ where Russians aren't permitted to put their own troops on their own soil, gotcha.

Sorry, I don't see it. Russia has every right to move troops wherever it likes within its own nation and that includes near the Baltics whenever the Baltic States are beating the war drum and holding NATO maneuvers on those borders.

25 posted on 12/30/2016 12:10:39 PM PST by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory !!)
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To: PGR88

I’ll add you to the Neville Chamberlain wing of the Republican party. All through the 30’s men like Churchill were warning the public the need to build up the military against the Nazis, oh we can’t do that was the cry. We can’t afford to....

Smart dictators test the limits first. Like Hitler with Alsace Lorraine, Austria and then Czechoslovakia. Putin even used the same excuse to go into Ukraine as Hitler did for his “invasions”. It was for the native Russian peoples..

I’m not saying Putin is Hitler. What I am saying is he has expansionist ambitions and wants all of the old soviet satellites back. He’s using the same tactics.


26 posted on 12/30/2016 12:12:37 PM PST by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: Rashputin
"whenever the Baltic States are beating the war drum and holding NATO maneuvers on those borders."

Those manuevers happened in response to Russia's aggressiveness, not the other way around.
27 posted on 12/30/2016 12:14:54 PM PST by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: All

I will give credit to Putin for one thing, his response to this whole whiny Obama temper tantrum of Russian “hacking” our election. He has shown the world what an idiot Obama truly is.


28 posted on 12/30/2016 12:16:57 PM PST by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: Old Teufel Hunden
I’ll add you to the Neville Chamberlain wing of the Republican party.

As long as John McCain, Lindsey Graham and Paul Ryan are not in this wing, I'll take it.

29 posted on 12/30/2016 12:21:40 PM PST by PGR88
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To: PGR88

They are not talking about going to war with Russia, but rather building up our military and encouraging NATO to do so also (i.e live up to their commitments). Trump has said the same thing basically.


30 posted on 12/30/2016 12:28:08 PM PST by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: Old Teufel Hunden
Those manuevers happened in response to Russia's aggressiveness, not the other way around.

I don't know. Maybe, or maybe not.

Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union represented aggressive, globalist, even messianic, ideologies. Even Saddam Hussein had to ridiculously claim he represented true Islam and the 1600 year-old battle against the Jews when he invaded Kuwait. Putin and Russia today do none of this. In fact, they are the opposite. They represent their own culture, their own religion, their own sovereignty. They clearly have said they are pushing no ideology on the world, except that of national sovereignty.

Russia can invade Poland, but to what end? To make them Russian? How will they hold and organize it? With what ideology? As some kind of 19th century Czardom? I don't think so.

Ask yourself - who and what is the aggressive, globalist, utopian ideology of our present time? Who is promoting it?

31 posted on 12/30/2016 12:33:53 PM PST by PGR88
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To: ichabod1

Do you really think there are no hardline nationalist fascist factions in Europe? They cannot speak. It is not permitted. But of course it is there.


There is , but it’s very small, smaller than the size of the American KKK. That may be changing given the current problems with the Muslim Invasion.


32 posted on 12/30/2016 12:40:08 PM PST by rdcbn (.... when Poets buy guns, tourist season is over ......d)
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To: Old Teufel Hunden
Check your facts. Ukraine being in a mess due to a US coup there is why the US decided to have asymmetric maneuvers in the Baltics, not in response to anything the Baltics did. Poland is another matter, they've been yelling about why they should own half of Russia ever since they were thrown out of Russia centuries ago.

This is all BS and a smokescreen just like the Poles ignoring the fact that they were run by a military junta prior to WWII and gladly took part of Czheckslovakia when the Germans took over most of the country.

Whatever. Think what you like, but the facts are that the NATO crowd is scared to death their perks and gravy train is going to end and next thing ya' know, poof, a major "crisis".

I don't believe a damn thing coming out of the Pentagon ever since after serving in VN I found out that the who attack on a US destroyer that was used to justify our sending anything but SF and advisers was nothing but a complete lie.

During my time in the Corps I think I heard every boneheaded theory and conspiracy theory anyone could possibly dream up so, I won't argue with you anymore.

Maybe the VC really were shipping hookers with incurable VD into dives around 29 Palms to cripple the USMC, maybe the nasty Russians aren't worried about fixing their own country, they're really worried about taking over a lot of little nothing countries that are falling apart.

Semper Fi.

33 posted on 12/30/2016 12:41:23 PM PST by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory !!)
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To: PGR88

Putin said that when the Soviet Union fell he thought that was the darkest day in history or some such thing. I have no problem with Russian nationalism, in fact I encourage it. However, that doesn’t mean that if there are Russian speaking peoples in Georgia he can invade it or the same in Ukraine. These are sovereign countries that he has interfered with by invading.

I don’t think he wants to invade all of these countries. I think he could invade the Baltics which he hopes (and I think also) would break up NATO because we would not come to their aid as we are treaty bound to do. This would break up NATO and all of the former soviet satellite states would eventually turn towards Russia instead of liberal democracy you would see nationalist autocrats come to power in these countries.


34 posted on 12/30/2016 12:41:47 PM PST by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: Rashputin

We can agree on Semper Fi at least.

The VC could have done more damage by shipping those VD infested hookers to Oceanside instead, more Marines there.

We can agree to disagree and I hope you’re right that Putin has no intentions on all these countries. Unfortunately I believe I’m right but I would be so glad and happy if you are.


35 posted on 12/30/2016 12:46:21 PM PST by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: Old Teufel Hunden

Oceanside hookers were probably NVA regulars.


36 posted on 12/30/2016 1:04:31 PM PST by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory !!)
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