Tough Talk On Trade

Investors Business Daily ^ | August 12, 2016 | Editorial

[expat_panama]

Trade: On the campaign trail, both Republican candidate Donald Trump and Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Clinton have become increasingly anti-free trade. Free traders may be in for a nasty surprise.

Right now, given current polls, Clinton seems most likely to be the next chief economic policy maker. If so, she will be the most anti-free trade leader of a major party since World War II.

In recent days, Clinton has criticized trade deals that she says hurt jobs... ...she promised to "ramp up enforcement" of trade laws and to even appoint a "chief trade prosecutor."

Criminalizing trade. Really?

Economists largely agree that the world's incredible economic success after World War II and into this century was due to a global move toward freer trade, lower tariffs and bigger global markets. Today, sadly, both parties seem prepared to abandon that. Capture short term gains with SwingTrader! Try us free for 14 days.

This week, Hillary Clinton, sounding a lot like socialist candidate Bernie Sanders, has picked up where he left off in her anti-trade diatribes...

...Those who think that's funny, please remember: In 1930 the Smoot-Hawley tariffs, a protectionist law that also had bipartisan support, set off a trade war that shrank the global market for U.S. goods and helped turn a recession into a Great Depression. Scapegoating trade is a big mistake. It won't lead to any more jobs, or to more goods made here. Just the opposite.

[expat_panama]

Polling results show that most Americans don't know much about commerce and they won't let that fact get in the way their opinions.

[ConservativeMind]

So, are you for the TPP?

[Pearls Before Swine]

5000 pages of TPP doesn’t sound like “free” trade. It sounds like a grab-bag of special interest side-deals, and if Obama is for it, those deals won’t be a net benefit to the USA. Of course, we don’t know what’s in it, as the deal is secret.

I can understand secrecy in negotiations in order to get the deal done, but not hiding it from us after the deal is on paper and subject to voting.

Bear in mind that according to the few crumbs of information that have leaked, only five of the 23 chapters of TPP are about trade; the rest are a sort of international governance treaty of the type Obama loves and the US always gets screwed over in.

I don’t know how anyone can be “for” it without knowing what it actually is.

[Gaffer]

As far as I’m concerned, this whole TPA/TPP mess is just like a Columbia record membership. The TPA traps you into the process and each TPP is secret until it’s delivered to your doorstep, AND IT IS UP TO YOU TO SEND IT BACK.

We should have at least gotten an OPT-IN TPP process instead of an OPT-OUT process.

On the balance the whole thing is a screw job against this country.

[olezip]

Trade: On the campaign trail, both Republican candidate Donald Trump and Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Clinton have become increasingly anti-free trade. Free traders may be in for a nasty surprise.

That is a misleading sentence.

Republican candidate Donald Trump favors free trade deals that benefit Americans, in stark contrast to Hillary Clinton who currently is against free trade.

But what are her positions worth; are they not available to the highest bidder?

[poobear]

Sounds like more of a cut off the pie.
“PAY TO TRADE”

[bert]

Although many here would consider me a globalist, I am merely an international trader. I do not know what is in the TPP in adequate detail and therefore am in opposition.

The size in pages is not necessarily a bad thing. There are many nations and many interests involved so that the development of acceptable compromise is lengthy.

Given the differences among nations, there will never be truly free trade. The best approach might be to establish the rules one on one rather than a complex mishmash like the TPP

Business and trade makes the world go round

[major-pelham]

These people think “free trade” was on the stone tablets Moses brought down. Their idea of free trade is unilateral disarmament by the USA while every other country on earth has unlimited trade barriers. They completely ignore the fact that the US became a colossus due to its mercantilist policies, copied to a tee, today, by China. Their idea of free trade is nothing but a series of transfer payments from America to all other nations. Combine it with open borders, massive debt, endless war and a welfare state and you have the Wall Street Journal et al. unabashedly promoting the ruin, yes the ruin, of the USA. But “Smoot Hawley” braying is nothing but globalist agitprop.

[expat_panama]

We got a beautiful Monday here and for quite a while stocks have been trading in an increasingly tighter range in ever decreasing volume.  Nobody know's nottin'  --even futures traders are confused w/ some contracts upbeat and some off.  They got metals down heavy -1.38% although gold-silver prices still trade in the current range $1,339.95 - $19.84.

Reports throughout the day: Empire Manufacturing, NAHB Housing Market Index, and Net Long-Term TIC Flows.

Headlines:

The Stimulus Wore Off. What's Next? - Robert Samuelson, Washington Post
Would Anyone Believe Clinton's 10 Million Job Promise? - Editorial, NYP
How Clinton and Trump Differ on Tax Rates - Neil Irwin, New York Times
Clinton's Economic Plan Is Recessionary - Steve Moore, Washington Times
Can the Recovery of Emerging Markets Last? - Tom Stevenson, Telegraph
Will Stock Market Hangover Follow Record Highs? - Mark DeCambre,MW
Why Robots Are a Threat to Job Security - David Ignatius, Washington Post
Don't Let Charges on Ailes Blind Us to His Genius - Steve Forbes, Forbes
U.S. Schools Are More Unequal Than We Thought - Susan Dynarski, NYT

[expat_panama]

5000 pages of TPP

We just had another thread that said that it was 6000 pages, and there's a live one right now that the 6K pages are only 14% of the total but there remaining are so secret that even our competitors don't know what's in there. 

[nathanbedford]

Surely all well-informed conservatives would stand against TPP because:

1. It surrenders American sovereignty.

2. It's supersedes Article III courts with international forums.

3. It is a nightmare confection of thousands of pages reminiscent of Obama Care.

These considerations obtain even if one is convinced that, overall, international trade creates more jobs than it costs, even if one is convinced that the benefit to consumers more than compensates for losses of jobs.

In coming to these conclusions we ought to be a little bit careful about articles such as this which, perhaps deliberately, are citing gross trade dollars but not domestic jobs. The article maintains, "U.S. exports have risen from $1.026 trillion in 2006 to $1.503 trillion last year, a 46% gain" but that rise is in inflated dollars and does not tell us how many domestic jobs it cost, if any, to obtain that half $1 trillion increase in exports. It could be that there was a net increase in jobs, but the article does not go there.

Before voters are castigated for having only partial knowledge of TPP perhaps we ought to consider that is because all sides and to treat voters like mushrooms.

Above all, arguments should clearly define who will be hurt and who will be advantaged by our trade policies. It is simply not possible to have entirely win-win negotiation results. Some sectors of the American economy will be hurt as others are helped. There is no magic wand to avoid this dilemma.

[bert]

It’s August

The second string is on the field

[expat_panama]

I do not know what is in the TPP in adequate detail and therefore am in opposition.

That's how most folks approach the subject, they won't let the fact that they haven't looked at the text of the TPP get in the way of having a very strong opinion against it.  Everyone just knows it's bad.

[bert]

Damn...... I thought the text was un available

[dennisw]

True 100%

[Alberta's Child]

Hillary Clinton will be 100% on board with all of these trade deals.

She's campaigning against them because she needs the support of labor unions and their leadership, but everyone -- including the people at IBD who write these stupid articles -- knows that she would swim to Korea to sign the TPP if the price is right.

This is why all of the big-government globalists of BOTH parties are lining up to support her.

[Pearls Before Swine]

5000 seemed like a nice round number.

But if its 6000, and that’s only 14% of the total, you’re saying there’s really about 40,000 pages.

That’s unlikely to be good.

I was remarking to the wife that it’s bad enough that our legislative representatives aren’t responsive; here, they are letting a select committee of negotiators and unelected lobbyists bind us with treaty law whose content even the legslators are ignorant of. How anyone can support this package without knowing its contents is beyond me.

Party loyalty uber alles!

[Gaffer]

Any proposed act, pact or legislation that must be held secret from the constituency until their representatives have been brainw——I mean fully briefed into the efficacies of said deal and who votes affirmatively, is a screw over of the American public. It cannot be put any simpler than that.

[bert]

Here’s some of one page on US tariffs.....

Tariff Line Description Base rate (*) Staging
Category Remarks Year 1 Year 2 Year 3 Year 4 Year 5 Year 6 Year 7 Year 8 Year 9 Year 10 Year 11 Year 12 Year 13 Year 14 Year 15 Year 16 Year 17 Year 18 Year 19 Year
20
Year
21
Year
22
Year
23
Year
24
Year
25
Year
26
Year
27
Year
28
Year
29
Year 30
and
subsequent
years
0401.20.20 Milk and cream, unconcentrated, unsweetened, fat content over 1% but
n/o 6%, for not over 11,356,236 liters entered in any calendar year
0.43 cents/liter B3 VN 0.2
cents/liter
0.1
cents/liter
0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.20.20 Milk and cream, unconcentrated, unsweetened, fat content over 1% but
n/o 6%, for not over 11,356,236 liters entered in any calendar year
0.43 cents/liter B5 JP 0.3
cents/liter
0.2
cents/liter
0.1
cents/liter
0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.20.20 Milk and cream, unconcentrated, unsweetened, fat content over 1% but
n/o 6%, for not over 11,356,236 liters entered in any calendar year
0.43 cents/liter EIF BR, CA, CL, MX,
MY, NZ, PE, SG
0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.20.20 Milk and cream, unconcentrated, unsweetened, fat content over 1% but
n/o 6%, for not over 11,356,236 liters entered in any calendar year
0.43 cents/liter US20 AU See AUS
FTA
See AUS
FTA
See AUS
FTA
See AUS
FTA
See AUS
FTA
See AUS
FTA
0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.20.40 Milk and cream, unconcentrated, unsweetened, fat content over 1% but
not over 6%, for over 11,356,236 liters entered in any calendar year
1.5 cents/liter B3 VN 1 cents/liter 0.5
cents/liter
0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.20.40 Milk and cream, unconcentrated, unsweetened, fat content over 1% but
not over 6%, for over 11,356,236 liters entered in any calendar year
1.5 cents/liter B5 JP, NZ 1.2
cents/liter
0.9
cents/liter
0.6
cents/liter
0.3
cents/liter
0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.20.40 Milk and cream, unconcentrated, unsweetened, fat content over 1% but
not over 6%, for over 11,356,236 liters entered in any calendar year
1.5 cents/liter EIF BR, CA, CL, MX,
MY, SG
0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.20.40 Milk and cream, unconcentrated, unsweetened, fat content over 1% but
not over 6%, for over 11,356,236 liters entered in any calendar year
1.5 cents/liter US20 AU See AUS
FTA
See AUS
FTA
See AUS
FTA
See AUS
FTA
See AUS
FTA
See AUS
FTA
0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.20.40 Milk and cream, unconcentrated, unsweetened, fat content over 1% but
not over 6%, for over 11,356,236 liters entered in any calendar year
1.5 cents/liter US21 PE See PE FTA See PE FTA See PE FTA See PE FTA See PE FTA See PE FTA See PE FTA See PE FTA See PE FTA 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.40.02 Milk and cream, not concentrated, not sweetened, fat content o/6% but
not o/10%, subject to general note 15 of the HTS
3.2 cents/liter B5 JP 2.5
cents/liter
1.9
cents/liter
1.2
cents/liter
0.6
cents/liter
0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.40.02 Milk and cream, not concentrated, not sweetened, fat content o/6% but
not o/10%, subject to general note 15 of the HTS
3.2 cents/liter EIF AU, BR, CA, CL,
MX, MY, NZ, PE,
SG, VN
0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.40.05 Milk and cream, not concentrated, not sweetened, fat content o/6% but
not o/10%, subject to additional US note 5 to Ch. 4
3.2 cents/liter B3 VN 2.1
cents/liter
1 cents/liter 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.40.05 Milk and cream, not concentrated, not sweetened, fat content o/6% but
not o/10%, subject to additional US note 5 to Ch. 4
3.2 cents/liter B5 JP 2.5
cents/liter
1.9
cents/liter
1.2
cents/liter
0.6
cents/liter
0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.40.05 Milk and cream, not concentrated, not sweetened, fat content o/6% but
not o/10%, subject to additional US note 5 to Ch. 4
3.2 cents/liter EIF AU, BR, CA, CL,
MX, MY, NZ, PE,
SG
0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.40.25 Milk and cream, not concentrated, not sweetened, fat content o/6% but
not o/10%, not subject to general note 15 or additional note 5 to Ch. 4
77.2 cents/liter B10 JP 69.4
cents/liter
61.7
cents/liter
54 cents/liter 46.3
cents/liter
38.6
cents/liter
30.8
cents/liter
23.1
cents/liter
15.4
cents/liter
7.7
cents/liter
0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.40.25 Milk and cream, not concentrated, not sweetened, fat content o/6% but
not o/10%, not subject to general note 15 or additional note 5 to Ch. 4
77.2 cents/liter B3 VN 51.4
cents/liter
25.7
cents/liter
0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
0401.40.25 Milk and cream, not concentrated, not sweetened, fat content o/6% but
not o/10%, not subject to general note 15 or additional note 5 to Ch. 4
77.2 cents/liter B5 MY 61.7
cents/liter
46.3
cents/liter
30.8
cen

[citizen]

5000 pages of TPP doesn’t sound like “free” trade. It sounds like a grab-bag of special interest side-deals, and if Obama is for it, those deals won’t be a net benefit to the USA.

Yes, too true.

The fanatic free traders are akin to the pro-aborts. Any restriction or even a discussion about restrictions sets them to frothing at the mouth - one prophesying back-alley procedures...the other warning of bread lines and soup kitchens.