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The limits of consent: Consent only has value when based on knowledge of what is truly good for us
Mercatornet ^ | 10/1/15 | Timothy Hsiao

Posted on 10/01/2015 6:50:25 AM PDT by wagglebee

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The most perfect freedom consists in obeying the dictates of right reason, and submitting to natural law.

And this basic principle is despised by the left and libertarians.

1 posted on 10/01/2015 6:50:25 AM PDT by wagglebee
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2 posted on 10/01/2015 6:51:19 AM PDT by wagglebee ("A political party cannot be all things to all people." -- Ronald Reagan, 3/1/75)
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To: wagglebee
There is more, and farther reaching wisdom in your post than you know ..... thanx

I've copied it out for study and meditation

3 posted on 10/01/2015 6:53:54 AM PDT by knarf (I say things that are true ... I have no proof ... but they're true.)
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To: wagglebee

i see a push to redefine ‘consent’ to mean whatever the progressives want it to mean. yes will mean no, and no will mean yes before too long. don’t fall for this crap. the girl is using the same logic that got us gay marriage, and that slipper slope has little to do with consent, and more with preference


4 posted on 10/01/2015 6:59:30 AM PDT by camle (keep an open mind and someone will fill it full of something for you)
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To: wagglebee

I’m sure a great many people here at FR are totally sold on consent and self-ownership concepts.


5 posted on 10/01/2015 7:00:10 AM PDT by Romulus
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To: wagglebee
In a famous passage in On Liberty, Mill writes that the “only purpose for which power can be rightfully exercised over any member of a civilized community, against his will, is to prevent harm to others.” The problem with this argument centers on the meaning of “harm.” Persons can be harmed physically, morally, spiritually, psychologically, culturally, educationally, financially, and in many other ways. A harm is simply a setback to any kind of flourishing, and persons flourish in a variety of ways. In a moral sense, every immoral action necessarily harms both the person and the community, for in acting immorally he acts against the moral order. If certain sexual acts are immoral, then they are necessarily harmful as well.

Uh-oh. This is not going to sit will with our Libertarian FRiends who think that legalizing pot and prostitution will bring about social harmony.

As if they give a damn about social harmony.

6 posted on 10/01/2015 7:02:32 AM PDT by Texas Eagle (If it wasn't for double-standards, Liberals would have no standards at all -- Texas Eagle)
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To: Texas Eagle
This is not going to sit will with our Libertarian FRiends who think that legalizing pot and prostitution will bring about social harmony.

They're too busy trying to figure out why Rand Paul's campaign collapsed.

7 posted on 10/01/2015 7:05:08 AM PDT by wagglebee ("A political party cannot be all things to all people." -- Ronald Reagan, 3/1/75)
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To: wagglebee

What a Catch-22. They’d have to be sober to understand why it collapsed.


8 posted on 10/01/2015 7:07:21 AM PDT by Texas Eagle (If it wasn't for double-standards, Liberals would have no standards at all -- Texas Eagle)
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To: wagglebee

I think this needs to be decided by the SCOTUS. They always get things like this right. //sarc off//


9 posted on 10/01/2015 7:09:47 AM PDT by mosaicwolf (Strength and Honor)
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To: wagglebee

Thank you wagglebee, for bringing this article to us.
Too tired to do much with it now, but saving to contemplate on when rested.

I will say though, that very few people under the age of thirty know enough to give an informed opinion, much less consent, on such life changing subjects.

In the article she says she and her father brought each other out of some very dark places.
Well, that’s what fathers are for.
We continue to raise our children long after they have reached the age of legality.
For a father to use the emotional turmoil of such a scenario only speaks to his own low morality.

A father is usually the one male his daughter trusts completely. After all, he has been the male she has turned to all of her life.
To turn that trust into an outlet for his own lust and needs reserves a special place in hell for him.

I pray that these people turn away from their path and instead seek the love and forgiveness of Christ, that their souls be saved and their burdens lifted from them.


10 posted on 10/01/2015 7:34:20 AM PDT by oldvirginian (I question all things political each day and reach the same conclusion. I stand with Ted Cruz!)
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To: Texas Eagle

On strictly a medical basis, that marriage could be potentially very harmful to any offspring as any genetic anomaly from the father’s DNA will come from both parents in this case. Not only immoral, sick but unkind to offspring.


11 posted on 10/01/2015 7:42:06 AM PDT by nclaurel
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To: wagglebee
A subject so taboo, it had no name.
That was before,now...

adopted children who had recently reconnected with their biological relatives coined the term “Genetic Sexual Attraction” (GSA) to describe the intense romantic and sexual feelings that she observed occurring in many of these reunions. --- From sub link.

And so it begins...

12 posted on 10/01/2015 8:03:43 AM PDT by DUMBGRUNT (BINGO!)
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To: wagglebee

Just as opinions without reasons are worthless, consent without understanding is worthless.


13 posted on 10/01/2015 8:40:21 AM PDT by TBP (Obama lies, Granny dies.)
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To: oldvirginian

“I will say though, that very few people under the age of thirty know enough to give an informed opinion, much less consent, on such life changing subjects.”

Umm, if the age of consent were 30, the human race would be dead very quickly.


14 posted on 10/01/2015 8:46:10 AM PDT by Boogieman
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To: wagglebee
The most perfect freedom consists in obeying the dictates of right reason, and submitting to natural law.

And this basic principle is despised by the left and libertarians.

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

 

How very true. But when you apply these notions of consent and freedom to issue like drugs - OMG! The liberals here at FR freak out!

15 posted on 10/01/2015 8:52:20 AM PDT by Responsibility2nd (With Great Freedom comes Great Responsibility)
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To: wagglebee

LOL. the Paul nuts are too confused to ever understand why they are perceived as loons let alone wonder their panderer is near bottom.


16 posted on 10/01/2015 10:16:20 AM PDT by manc (Marriage =1 man + 1 woman,when they say marriage equality then they should support polygamy)
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To: Boogieman

More and more couples are waiting until they have established themselves in a career and are financially sound before they begin families, so no the human race would do just fine.

Winston Churchill said “If you are under thirty and you are not a liberal, you have no heart. If you are over thirty and not a conservative you have no brain.”

With the average lifespan what it is waiting to start a family would be best for everyone involved and society as a whole.

By waiting, the average person would get the foolishness of youth over with before children were born.

The family would be better off because in most cases the parents would have already begun purchasing their home,

The parents would benefit by being able to enjoy their families more because they would realize what gifts their families are and could give of themselves instead of giving money and material things to show their love and appreciation. The divorce rate would probably be lower as people would more likely realise what is important to them and marry accordingly. They would also realize that the passion of first love gives way to the comfort of a deeper and more lasting love.

Children would benefit from living in a home made more stable by the life experiences of their parents. With a lower divorce rate the children would not have to face the problems that go with broken homes.

Society would benefit because there would be fewer broken homes with only one parent.
The children would be less likely to behave destructively and would be better able to handle adulthood.
The savings in social programs and lower incarceration rates would be a huge benefit to society.

I realise what I proposed is a one size fits all solution, knowing that one size does not fit all.
Some in their early twenties are perfectly capable of making very good decisions.
Some could live as long as Methuselah and still make bad decisions.
On the whole though, we would all be better off.


17 posted on 10/01/2015 10:42:24 AM PDT by oldvirginian (I question all things political each day and reach the same conclusion. I stand with Ted Cruz!)
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To: oldvirginian

“More and more couples are waiting until they have established themselves in a career and are financially sound before they begin families, so no the human race would do just fine.”

Biology is a harsh mistress. At 30 years old, a couple only has a few short years of fertility left (if they are lucky). Otherwise, if they want to breed, it means very expensive fertility treatments that most people probably can’t afford.

Considering how low the birthrates already are in industrialized nations, this would be the death blow.


18 posted on 10/01/2015 11:02:42 AM PDT by Boogieman
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To: wagglebee

Thank you for the article!


19 posted on 10/01/2015 11:04:57 AM PDT by Crolis ("To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it." -GKC)
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To: wagglebee
We cannot speak meaningfully of harm prevention without adopting a prior theory of what it means to flourish. As result, the state cannot be neutral when it comes to issues of consent, autonomy, liberty, and harm reduction. Since invoking these concepts presupposes some prior understanding of the good life, the state must inevitably adopt some comprehensive moral framework when it comes to regulating social life.

Thanks. but rather than have Barry's or Bernie's or Hillary's "comprehensive moral framework" imposed on me, I'll stick with the Founder's ideal of limited government and leave "morally, spiritually, and culturally" in their proper venue of families, churches, and voluntary associations.

20 posted on 10/01/2015 11:10:52 AM PDT by ConservingFreedom (a "guest worker" is a stateless person with no ties to any community, only to his paymaster)
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