California´s soaring healthcare costs bode ill for the budget

L.A. Times ^ | 1/8/15 | Chris Megerian

[SoFloFreeper]

My point, perhaps made with a bit of hyperbole, is that California is not in a healthy fiscal situation.

Productive citizens and businesses are fleeing for places like Texas and Florida, while at the same time illegal aliens are invading—and getting government sanction in the form of drivers license.

The state budget is being threatened by its own Death Panel program. Pensions are facing a major crisis. The state is being led by the mentality of the bankrupt philosophy of the Democrat party.

In 2012, California residents were 12% of the nation’s population but 33% of its welfare recipients. Has that improved under Brown and Obama?

Add to that the state’s unique place in the degradation of the culture (see Hollywood, San Francisco) which creates and sustains a perverted worldview, and I think one can make a case for California being a place one might want to visit but not live.

I fully recognize there are good, decent hardworking citizens in the state. Sadly they are being rapidly replaced and outnumbered. If America is in decline, California is on the fast track.

[Organic Panic]

...nothing to do with illegal and obamacare...

[Graybeard58]

Your friend with Cancer needs to ask the the doctors/hospitals he has treatment from which plans from the ones currently available will pay for the treatment he is recieving.

My doctor tells me, (correctly, I believe) that he knows very little about health care plans, except his own and has no intention of learning as it's not his job.

I doubt that many doctors are educated in these matters, they hire people to take care of that.

[PoloSec]

No big deal just raise taxes folks in Cali have proven there is no limit on the amount of taxes they are ready and willing to pay, they are easy if the gov’t says it needs more money they know the benevolent gov’t is going to spend it wisely for the common good of all.

Won’t decide if this comment should have a /S tag, have it your way.

[rockinqsranch]

“......Although the federal government picks up most of the tab, state costs have also been growing, and faster than expected.”

Wondering where the L.A. Times thinks the Fed gets its money.

[vette6387]

“Add to that the state’s unique place in the degradation of the culture (see Hollywood, San Francisco) which creates and sustains a perverted worldview, and I think one can make a case for California being a place one might want to visit but not live.”

I was born in San Francisco in 1940 and I have lived here all my life. I live in the East Bay today and have lived here since 1952. I have raised three children and am now watching them raise their’s here as well. To suggest that this is a completely depraved place is not supported by the facts. Sure, the RATs have made a mess out of things in recent years, bur so have then done in most other states where they control the governments. It is small minded and counterproductive ( although I can understand that it might make people like yourself feel good to make outlandish statements here on FR) to try and paint an inaccurate picture of our state.
The issue that you raised ( and it was not supported by the facts) was to the effect that our economy was “third world” and failing. California, despite our terrible government, has a flourishing economy. California pays into the Federal government the largest amount of money of any other state and by a considerable margin, and as can be seen by the data I supplied, and gets back far less than it’s contributions. I am wondering since your FR name is SoFlo Freeper if it is indicative of the fact that you reside in South Florida. Interestingly, in view of your comments, that Florida is the premier deadbeat state of all in terms of what it pays into the Federal Government as opposed to what it receives back. In truth by that measurement, Florida does live off of the rest of the states and in all probability gets a lot of that money out of the pockets of Californians. And yet we see that Florida is at the very least a “purple state” that has “given us” Jeb Bush, Marco Rubio and any number of other so-called “conservative leaders.”
So on the issue of economics, your original comments were way wide of the truth, and frankly as a Conservative Californian, I am getting a little tired of all the California Bashing that goes on here on FR, which is headquartered, here down in Fresno. Like Florida, we have our “pockets of shame,” but just like the map of the country, most of the area that comprises our state is populated with decent folks who don’t like what the trash in our cities foists off on us as “elected representatives.” And efforts here ( which unfortunately will go nowhere) to divide the state physically into several smaller, more manageable entities are indicative of the dissatisfaction of people living in the less populated areas.
Personally, I would like to see California go under financially because it would be the most direct way to correct what’s wrong here, but apart from some number of our cities going into bankruptcy, that’s not likely to happen either. In the end, taking pot shots at this state or that, isn’t productive and in so doing we do a disservice to addressing the real tasks we face trying to take back our country.

[Jim Noble]

Although the federal government picks up most of the tab

For two years.

[vette6387]

“I just find it difficult to taken in that a state budget like CA has with its deficit and some pretty serious resource and energy problems, that it is such a producer that it is the “engine of the world” so to speak.”

Well, despite our government, we are still the largest economy in the country and by a wide margin (I imagine we are still in the top ten world economies).
But our state budget is a shambles and is so largely due to the gold plated retirement benefits we give our PE’s.
As for “resource and energy problems,” I am assuming you mean the draught and perhaps the fact that we will most likely be shuttering our nuclear plants over time. Right now out water situation is a lot better than it has been in dry periods before ( not that it’s rosy at the moment), and at least we don’t use coal to fuel our power plants.

[Gaffer]

The state is not sustainable for the long term on the course that it is on. Major electricity supplies from Arizona/Nevada Hoover dam, water aqueducts and pipes everywhere that would make the Romans look like pikers, IMO.

Mulholland raped every water source in California to feed LA - for what? Millions of bleeding heart liberals and millions of illegals?

As for coal, it’s soooooo bad, huh? You’re believing the Eco-hype.

[SoFloFreeper]

Didn’t really mean to elicit such an obviously upset response.

I tried to put some caveats in my second post, which apparently went unnoticed.

Particularly, I acknowledged the decent folks (yes, Free Republic’s founders included!!) who still live in California.

Anyway, have a great day.

[roadcat]

So on the issue of economics, your original comments were way wide of the truth, and frankly as a Conservative Californian, I am getting a little tired of all the California Bashing that goes on here on FR, which is headquartered, here down in Fresno.

Very well said, thank you. I am a native San Franciscan, having been born here and now living in South San Francisco. I and others have endured the insults of others who claim we're all gay for living here. Not so. Lots of family people here, with good morals. Most of the people on my block fly the U.S. flag every day. The economy is roaring, lots of jobs, new building going on, and everywhere you look there are baby strollers and children playing. Every other large city I've been to has large pockets of poverty. Not so here. The "ghetto" in SF (Hunters Point/Bayview district) looks like a well-to-do middle-class enclave from other towns, versus the burned-out desolate stretches I've seen in other cities.

Someday we may reclaim California as a conservative state. The liberal trouble-makers came here from elsewhere and lots of them are going back to where they came from.

[vette6387]

” The “ghetto” in SF (Hunters Point/Bayview district) looks like a well-to-do middle-class enclave from other towns, versus the burned-out desolate stretches I’ve seen in other cities.”

Years ago, I worked down on Jerrold Avenue. The area around the Produce Market, including Potrero Hill was a $hit hole. We had dead bodies turn up on our streets and it wasn’t a place where you wanted to take a walk after lunch. We had a chance to drive through that area a few weeks ago incuding driving up Third St. to the AT&T Ballpark. The Renaissance is stunning! Gone is all the crappy city-owned housing on Potrero Hill, replaced by high-end apartments and condos. Third St. is revitalized ( don’t know where all the Blacks who used to live there went, but they are largely gone from the area). Our daughter works for one of the major contractors in SF. They have never been busier building both business and housing. Downtown SF has an ever changing skyline due to all the construction. The old Transbay Terminal has been torn down and is being rebuild to accommodate better transportation infrastructure as well as more office space above. All of this activity has had the effect of displacing all the trash people that used to lurk in the city. Don’t know where the’ve all gone, but they have gone!
These people on FR who form the anti-California “amen chorus” don’t have a clue. They lash out in their stupidity at our state without having any first-hand knowledge about what’s really going on here. Would I like to see the RATs go packing? Sure, but nothing in governance is static, and the pendulum will swing back as people finally figure out that they are being played. Personally, I am not going to let those who use less than truthful invective to trash our state without a response.

[vette6387]

“As for coal, it’s soooooo bad, huh? You’re believing the Eco-hype.”

No, I think not using coal is stupid. I was merely pointing out that we don’t have coal-fired plants here in California. As for the water, the big culprit here has always been Los Angeles, and we in the northern part of the state hate what they’ve done in the past to satiate their desire to grow using someone else’s resources. California would be a better place with a much smaller population in the Los Angeles Basin. And it may be coming because the water entitlements from the Colorado River are going away as Arizona takes what they were legally to get from the original contracts that were set up when Hoover Dam was built. And they’ve been cut off from large portions of the Owens River water because they were killing Mono Lake.
I seldom go to LA, but the decay there is striking. If we cut off the state at the south end of the Central Valley, and controlled our own resources, LA would wither.

[vette6387]

“Productive citizens and businesses are fleeing for places like Texas and Florida”

Perhaps some are, but I can tell you I had a business associate who moved to Austin (built a big home on a hill there), worked for Tracor. After five years, his wife paid us a visit, then called her husband and said that he’d have to find a new job back here because she had had it with “the Texas lifestyle,”( their neighbors were unfriendly because they weren’t “Texans”).
I had a chance for a promotion to Texas and turned it down (at the time Texas still allowed school teachers to hit their kids, and they were the consummate racists to boot). Texas, on it’s best day isn’t anywhere close to being California climate-wise. As for Florida, I understand why everyone there carries a gun, you absolutely do need the protection it affords on a daily basis. And I am left wondering if Florida is such a “happening place,” why it gets back from the Federal Government, twice what it pays to it.

[Gaffer]

Well, I wish you well in your part of the state. It’s a shame there are so many parts of it that are so doomed (IMO). I’ve spent many years up in what some might call the high desert areas doing contract work and I loved it. I love the desert climate, personally. Before I retired, I finally just went ahead and flew into LV and drove over through Death Valley to get where I was going - just for the peace of mint.

I just wouldn’t live there because of the state government crazies and their attitudes about owning guns and gun control.

Best wishes and good luck. :0)

[vette6387]

“I just wouldn’t live there because of the state government crazies and their attitudes about owning guns and gun control.”

Keep a good thought for us that the 9th Circuit will ultimately uphold Peruta v. San Diego That would completely change the gun picture in California ( and Hawaii too). An affirmation of the original 3 Judge decision would result in CA having to be a “shall issue” state with respect to CCW permits.

[Gaffer]

I will, but I have to tell you that I’ve said this here a few times. Congress should reduce the jurisdiction of the 9th Circus to the size of the postage stamp, and then move their benches into the nearest Greyhound/Trailways bus stop bathroom. Last stall down on the right. :0)

[vette6387]

I have generally held the same view of the Ninth Circus, but I’ve read the majority decision in Peruta, and it is compelling and very well researched. No matter the outcome ( the 9th is currently mulling over whether to do an en banc on it) it will be appealed to the SCOTUS. The opinion will well serve those of us who want the 2A to be broadly interpreted. Personally, although I am a states rights supporter, I think that just like the other parts of the Bill of Rights, the 2A should be federally mandated and thus wipe out all state restrictions as they relate to guns.
This idea that we are not free to travel with our firearms without fear that some state operative ( like the MD cops) can unlawfully detain us while they search our cars for guns that are legal where we come from.

[Gaffer]

Here’s hoping they don’t succumb to cognitive dissonance in the face of pure evidence and justification. :0)

[SoFloFreeper]

Well, since we're continuing the conversation, let me throw a couple of charts for anyone trolling this thread.

Contrary to anyone who thinks things in California are just peachy...Here are few cold hard facts:

Bill Watkins at New Geography cites a census report:

According to a Census Bureau report, The Research SUPPLEMENTAL POVERTY REPORT: 2011 California has the nation's highest poverty rate of any state. By its Supplemental Poverty Measure, 23.5 percent of California's population is poor, while only 15.8 percent of the nation's population is poor. No other state is above 20 percent.

So California is #1 in poverty.

And as far as jobs and people fleeing the place, here is a chart showing domestic migration in California over the past few years:

This is the number of people leaving California and going to other states ("domestic migration")....and the "net" migration isn't looking so hot either for California:

Watkins seems to think MORE "immigration" is the answer--whether he supports Obama's executive order, I don't know.

But at least Watkins, a California-based professor of economics, acknowledges that California is in deep doo doo:

Unless there is some dramatic change, it is almost inevitable that California will suffer a declining population within a generation. The way to avoid this calamity is create an economic environment that encourages job growth and economic activity...
California needs to reform its business climate, reduce its debt and unfunded liabilities, and do so quickly.

I would agree with him. Frankly, though, I am sick of seeing California be an automatic LOCK for the Democrat operatives every four years....I still remember when it was a state that was considered a "battleground".

So my hope is it either becomes that battleground OR it loses so much population that its value in the electoral college diminishes.

Right now 20% of the electoral college votes are in California, and it is so Democrat-laden that no Republican seriously campaigns in the state.

Anyway, vette6387, take it easy. Hope you have a good afternoon.