Is Hungary The Next Ukraine? Protests Show Country Ripe For Conflict Between Russia And Europe

IBT ^ | November 18 2014 4:40 PM | Dennis Lynch

[wetphoenix]

A protest movement in Hungary over corruption and an increasingly pro-Russian leadership broke out this week,raising questions about whether the former communist nation is on the verge of becoming the next Ukraine. Hungary is more stable than Ukraine, which has been besieged by sectarian conflict for months, and seems less likely to fall into violent conflict,but growing anti-government demonstrations could become another battleground between Europe and Russia.

The wave of Hungarian protests is focused on Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban’s increasingly pro-Russian governance. Many shouted “Europe,Europe!” at Monday’s “Public Outrage Day” protest and one protester told AFP demonstrators "don’t want Orban to take us towards Putin and Russia.” Others chanted for Orban to resign. The chants and gripes with Orban are eerily similar to those Ukraine's Euromaidan protesters lodged against former President Viktor Yanukovych,who fled the country in late February after four months of violent protests over his decision to sign a $15 billion investment deal with Russia and reject a popular bid to move closer to Europe economically. The decision mobilized pro-European Ukrainians and saw a new pro-Western transitional government come to power after Yanukovych was ousted. That largely divided Ukrainians along the line of being either pro-Russian or pro-Western.

Some Ukrainians,many of whom are ethnic Russians and live in the heavily Russian east,sought to distance themselves from the pro-Western government. Russia annexed Crimea,a southern Ukraine region with close ties to Russia,arguing it was protecting Russians living there. No shots were fired there,but that wasn't the case in eastern Ukraine where pro-Russian rebels took up arms and declared a separatist state. The U.S. and EU accuse Russia of supplying the rebels and directly invading on their behalf.

While Hungary was never as close to Russia as Ukraine,an astounding 72 percent of Hungarians said in 2010 most Hungarians are worse

[melsec]

It is becoming more and more obvious why Putin has tried to present himself as a conservative, pro church anti-gay leader. He knows it will play well with Ethnic Russians in border states who tend to be conservative and don’t want to be involved in the perversion that Europe is becoming. They are also anti-Muslim having seen what happened in Chechnya and Georgia and they see Europe as weak and lying to their people about Islam.

He is pandering to them in an effort to restart some mutated form of the USSR.

If I go back to the 1980’s before the fall of the Berlin Wall a guy I knew, who was well versed in prophecy, told me that communism would fall but only for a short time and then they would revert again - I am unsure if he got this from Daniel or Ezekiel - seems like it is heading this way!

[Kozak]

Thats funny. The Hungarians HATE Russians. I was just there this summer.

[wetphoenix]

LOL. I was there in 2012. Many said they hate Americans. Probably tried to get my sympathy this way.
I think it is their method to play one against another.

[Kozak]

Oh for Christ’s sake. Just look at the history. Who invaded them multiple times recently?
I saw a statue to Reagan in Budapest. The ones for Lenin and all the other commie assholes were in a special Commie Park out of town. All thats left of Stalin is his boots.

[Greetings_Puny_Humans]

It is becoming more and more obvious why Putin has tried to present himself as a conservative, pro church anti-gay leader. He knows it will play well with Ethnic Russians in border states who tend to be conservative

Russkies are not conservative. Less than one percent attend their Russian Communist Churches even on Easter. It is true they talk morality, but this is the vanity of a group of people most of whom are dependent on government handouts and are heavily drugged up or are alcoholics. They are true Soviets after 5 generations of Russians killing off the very best people and promoting individuals with clear signs of delusional behavior and sadist tendencies.

All the good Russkies are either in prison, protesting i streets against their regime, or fled to Europe or the United States a long time ago.

Here is a good primer from a Russian explaining how that country really is:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/bloggers/3189416/posts

[nathanbedford]

If Putin is personally capable of a grand strategy it would be to add Germany to a Russo/Sino alliance which would break up NATO, break up the European Union, draw many Western European countries into his orbit through intimidation, and effectively isolate Great Britain and the United States.

I am astonished at the number of my neighbors here in Germany who find tortured ways of defending Putin. The damage to American influence in Europe caused by the Iraq war seems to never end. That damage is compounded daily by the pathetic image of an ineffectual president bungling every international question to which his country is exposed. Obama has become a laughingstock in Germany, at least at the man on the street level.

The Germans much like the Hungarians are severely constrained from breaking away from the American nuclear umbrella by the fact that they have no bomb of their own. The more Putin reveals himself to be a KGB thug, the less Germans will be likely to submit themselves to his tender mercies. This is not necessarily true of France which historically seeks ways to piss allies off and Great Britain which is always understandably sought to play a collection of states against the European superpower because both of these nations have the bomb.

But make no mistake, Europe is full of leftists and there is always the Islam card, indeed a wildcard, which might make common cause with Putin and seek to deliver Europe to him.

It is unlikely, but an alliance of Germany, Russia, China would be catastrophic.

[Grzegorz 246]

“They are also anti-Muslim having seen what happened in Chechnya and Georgia”

What happened ?

[wetphoenix]

~While Hungary was never as close to Russia as Ukraine, an astounding 72 percent of Hungarians said in 2010 most Hungarians are worse off than they were under communist rule when they were intrinsically linked to Russia and the rest of the Eastern Bloc. ~

I find this quote the most interesting.

It is quite typical for Eastern Europe and former Red Germany is certainly not exception.

The reasons behind such a weird phenomenon are quite complex though pretty much understandable.

The problem is noone is going to deal with a problem.

[samtheman]

The damage to American influence in Europe caused by the Iraq war seems to never end.

The Iraq war was a big mistake, on many levels.

[nathanbedford]

A terrible blunder.

[Grzegorz 246]

“If Putin is personally capable of a grand strategy it would be to add Germany to a Russo/Sino alliance which would break up NATO, break up the European Union, draw many Western European countries into his orbit through intimidation, and effectively isolate Great Britain and the United States.”

That has been Russia's long-term strategy, since many years.

[OldNewYork]

Bears watching.

[melsec]

I must admit I was struggling to explain the sort of faux conservatism that I see expressed there. So I 100% take your point on that it is not true conservatism

It is this morality based conservatism the type that Hitler exploited so well - Putin has really hooked into that and also fear of the future whether it has to do with Muslims, the new morality or economic dispair

I was watching a program recently on youth in Russia and they also took in some of the old Soviet Union. Some are doing well in new economies of these countries but many are not. Many, many towns have closed all the factories and there has been little or no work since the early nineties. Many youth are turning towards a type of national socialism. They have those characteristics of being against foreigners (especially Mulsims) but also anti-homosexual (violenlty so). I would have thought this would have made them anti Putin but it seems no - I think they don’t see much hope or support coming from the EU. Most middle-aged people who may have only been teens when the wall fell are feeling that what freedom brought them was unemployment and hunger.

Anyway add all that together plus feeling (rightly or wrongly) like they are unwelcome and discrimnated against in the former Soviet Block countries ethnic Russians are looking for someone to save them. Putin is playing that guy and it seems to sell well to that group.

Thanks for the link I will go and have a look.

Cheers

Mel

[melsec]

I must admit I was struggling to explain the sort of faux conservatism that I see expressed there. So I 100% take your point on that it is not true conservatism

It is this morality based conservatism the type that Hitler exploited so well - Putin has really hooked into that and also fear of the future whether it has to do with Muslims, the new morality or economic dispair

I was watching a program recently on youth in Russia and they also took in some of the old Soviet Union. Some are doing well in new economies of these countries but many are not. Many, many towns have closed all the factories and there has been little or no work since the early nineties. Many youth are turning towards a type of national socialism. They have those characteristics of being against foreigners (especially Mulsims) but also anti-homosexual (violenlty so). I would have thought this would have made them anti Putin but it seems no - I think they don’t see much hope or support coming from the EU. Most middle-aged people who may have only been teens when the wall fell are feeling that what freedom brought them was unemployment and hunger.

Anyway add all that together plus feeling (rightly or wrongly) like they are unwelcome and discrimnated against in the former Soviet Block countries ethnic Russians are looking for someone to save them. Putin is playing that guy and it seems to sell well to that group.

Thanks for the link I will go and have a look.

Cheers

Mel

[Ivan Mazepa]

What is the Russian view of Hungarian protests, anyway?
Can anti-corruption protests happen? or are western imperialists driving these as well