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'Not Islamic'?
Townhall.com ^
| September 23, 2014
| Dennis Prager
Posted on 09/23/2014 10:35:44 AM PDT by Kaslin
resident Obama declared in his recent address to the nation that "ISIL is not Islamic."
But how does he know? On what basis did the president of the United States declare the a group of Muslims that calls itself "Islamic State" "not Islamic"?
Has he studied Islam and Islamic history and concluded that ISIL, Boko Haram, al-Qaida, Hamas, Hezbollah, the Taliban, Jamaat-e-Islami, Lashkar-e-Taiba (the group that slaughtered 166 people in Mumbai, most especially guests at the Taj Hotel,and which tortured to death a rabbi and his wife), the various Palestinian terrorist groups (all of which have been Muslim, even though there are many Christian Palestinians), and the Muslim terror groups in Somalia, Yemen, Libya and elsewhere are also all "not Islamic"?
Has he concluded that the Muslim Brotherhood, which won Egypt's most open election ever, is "not Islamic?"
And what about Saudi Arabia? Is that country "not Islamic," too?
Oh, and what about Iran? Also "not Islamic"?
Isn't that a lot of Muslims, Muslim groups, and even nations -- all of whom claim Islam as their religion -- to dismiss as "not Islamic"?
To be fair, these baseless generalizations about what is and what is not Islamic started with his predecessor, President George W. Bush, who regularly announced that "Islam is a religion of peace." And it is equally unlikely that his assertion came from a study of Islam and Islamic history.
The fact is that a study of Islamic history could not lead any fair-minded individual to conclude that all these Muslims and Islamic groups are "not Islamic." Neither Islamic history, which, from its origins, offered vast numbers of people a choice between Islam and death, nor Islam as reflected in its greatest works, would lead one to draw that conclusion.
Killing "unbelievers" has been part of -- of course not all of -- Islam since its inception. Within 10 years of Muhammad's death Muslims had conquered and violently converted whole peoples from Iran to Egypt and from Yemen to Syria. Muslims have offered conquered people death or conversion since that time.
The Hindu Kush, the vast, 500-mile long, 150-mile wide mountain range stretching from Afghanistan to Pakistan, was populated by Hindus until the Muslim invasions beginning around the year 1000. The Persian name Hindu Kush was proudly given by Muslims. It means "Hindu-killer." At least 60 million Hindus were killed by Muslims during the thousand years of Muslim rule. Though virtually unknown, it may be the greatest mass murder in history next to Mao's.
The groups named above are following some dictates of the Quran.
A few of many such examples:
"I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them" (8:12).
"When the sacred months are over slay the idolaters wherever you find them. Arrest them, besiege them, and lie in ambush everywhere for them. If they repent and take to prayer and render the alms levy, allow them to go their way. God is forgiving and merciful." (9:5)
"Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth." (9:29).
There is also a different admonition in the Quran: "In matters of faith there shall be no compulsion" (2:256).
So a Muslim can also cite the Quran if he wishes to allow non-Muslims to live in peace.
The problem is that Muslim theological tradition, affirmed by many scholars, holds that later revelation to Muhammad supersedes prior revelation (a doctrine known as "abrogation"). And the Quranic verses ordering Muslims to fight and slay non-believers came after those admonishing Muslims to live with non-believers in peace and without religious compulsion.
The problem is that Muslim history, in keeping with the doctrine of abrogation, has far more often practiced the violent admonitions.
The problem is that more than 600 years after Muhammad, Ibn Khaldun, the greatest Muslim writer who ever lived, explained why Islam is the superior religion in the most highly regarded Muslim work ever written, "Muqaddimah," or "Introduction to History":
"In the Muslim community, the holy war is religious duty, because of the universalism of the Muslim mission and (the obligation to) convert everybody to Islam either by persuasion or by force."
In other words, Ibn Khaldun boasts, whereas no other religion commands converting the world through force, Islam does. Was Ibn Khaldun also "not Islamic"? And so much for the president's other claim that "no religion condones the killing of innocents."
None of this justifies bigotry against Muslims. There are hundreds of millions of non-Islamist Muslims (an Islamist is a Muslim who seeks to impose Shariah on others), including many "cultural" or secular Muslims. And individual Muslims are risking their lives every day to provide the intelligence needed to forestall terror attacks in America and elsewhere.
It is only a call to clarity amidst the falsehoods coming from the president, the secretary of state, and especially the universities.
As the courageous Ayaan Hirsi Ali, the Somali-born woman who leads a worldwide effort on behalf of Muslim women and for reforming Islam, asked in a speech at Yale University this month: If Islam is a religion of peace, why is there a sword on the Saudi flag?
If the president feels he has to obfuscate for the sake of gaining Muslim allies, so be it. But the rest of us don't have to make believe what he said is true.
TOPICS: Editorial
KEYWORDS: 0bama; isis
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1
posted on
09/23/2014 10:35:44 AM PDT
by
Kaslin
To: Kaslin
2
posted on
09/23/2014 10:47:42 AM PDT
by
Nevadan
To: Kaslin
Pretty much sums it up. He neglected the Muslim invasion of Europe that predated the Crusades by three and a half centuries.
3
posted on
09/23/2014 10:49:20 AM PDT
by
fhayek
To: Kaslin
President Obama saw to it that our men gave Osama bin Laden an Islamic funeral. All muslims are in “good standing with Islam” according to the Boy King.
4
posted on
09/23/2014 10:50:18 AM PDT
by
a fool in paradise
(Hey Obama: If Islamic State is not Islamic, then why did you give Osama Bin Laden a muslim funeral?)
To: Kaslin
The was NOTHING else Pres. Bush could have said about Islam, but that it was a ROP.
The Islam of Pres. Bush’s time had yet to show its true face to the world.
The American media, print and TV, was always in hunting mode, just waiting for Bush to say something, anything that could be attacked for ANY reason.
For Bush to have proclaimed (then) that Islam was the “religion” of butchery, beheading, raping, kidnapping, torture, suicide bombing, genocidal behavior, using hospitals as ammunition dumps, and storing missles under elementary schools, he would have been attacked with utmost print and video generated violence. The ACLU and American religious groups would have accused Bush of the most vile religious bigotry and the left would join in claiming that he was “NOT fit to occupy the White House.”
It is 2014, Islam has shown it true face, and anyone can make the point by merely describing what was done in the last week or so.
5
posted on
09/23/2014 10:51:11 AM PDT
by
CaptainAmiigaf
(N.Y. TIMES: "We print the news as it fits our views.")
To: Kaslin
Obama’s statement is designed to protect and defend Islam. Anyone who doesn’t see that for what it is, is delusional.
To: Kaslin
“Islam is a religion of peace.”
This should be considered the same as saying,
“Nice doggy”, while searching for a rock or stick.
(actually it would be better to be taking the safety off,
but some people just won’t learn.)
7
posted on
09/23/2014 10:55:41 AM PDT
by
tet68
( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
To: Kaslin
Finding the first “real” Muslim will be like finding the Lochness Monster!
8
posted on
09/23/2014 10:56:16 AM PDT
by
MNDude
To: a fool in paradise
President Obama declared in his recent address to the nation that "ISIL is not Islamic." How does he know that?
It's simple.
His Imam told him.
9
posted on
09/23/2014 10:58:23 AM PDT
by
Quality_Not_Quantity
(Liars use facts when the truth doesn't suit their purposes.)
To: Kaslin
Obama employs Fiction Writers to write his speeches
10
posted on
09/23/2014 11:16:54 AM PDT
by
molson209
(Blank)
To: Kaslin
"But how does he know?"
Because he's the Magic Mullah.
11
posted on
09/23/2014 11:20:11 AM PDT
by
clintonh8r
(It's possible to love your country and hate your government. I'm proof of it.)
To: Kaslin
re: The problem is that Muslim theological tradition, affirmed by many scholars, holds that later revelation to Muhammad supersedes prior revelation (a doctrine known as “abrogation”). And the Quranic verses ordering Muslims to fight and slay non-believers came after those admonishing Muslims to live with non-believers in peace and without religious compulsion.
It is my understanding that the “nice Muslim” verses that talk about peace were written when Mohammad was still trying to get the Christians and Jews in his time to accept him as a prophet who superseded Jesus & Moses. When that plan didn't work as he desired, he changed his tune to “death and destruction for the infidels” who didn't accept his claims. Since the surahs (chapters) are not written in chronological order but rather in order of size from largest to smallest, this fact is not always obvious.
12
posted on
09/23/2014 11:26:14 AM PDT
by
Nevadan
To: Kaslin
Very well done!
"There are hundreds of millions of non-Islamist Muslims (an Islamist is a Muslim who seeks to impose Shariah on others)
I've never heard the term non-Islamist Muslim before--is it commonly used or understood this way among the Muslim population?
13
posted on
09/23/2014 11:26:54 AM PDT
by
lonevoice
(Life is short. Make fun of it.)
To: Kaslin
“Not Islamic” is brought to you by the same people who brought you a “right wing” Nazi.
In other words, a non-Socialist “National Socialist German Workers’ Party” member.
Right wing = small government
Nazis and other Socialists = Large government.
It's amazing how Leftists try to talk the masses out of believing what is obvious
To: CivilWarBrewing
I agree.
But for the record, here's some addition information from a panel on "Benghazi: The Difference It Makes Is Accountability!"
I know this is long, but there's a lot of "to-the-point" and "hard-hitting" truth here.
Read this thread.
What You Cant See on the UNs Maps of Gaza Brigitte Gabriel described the problem very well in her response to Saba Ahmed at the Heritage Foundation's June 16, 2014, event, "Benghazi: The Difference It Makes Is Accountability!"
Basically if I were to have titled it, I would call it "Sharia" Is Not The "SAME FAITH", and "THE PEACEFUL MAJORITY WERE IRRELEVANT !"
But what's more defining is what several news source stories cut out in their version of the even.
Here are links to the reports that I'm referring to. These slightly different versions stirred my curiosity to dig into the full story myself.
Below is MY TRANSCRIPT of the 9 minutes and 17 seconds of video of the event. (I'm a retired air traffic controller/supervisor and I have done official transcripts before.)
Full Context: Benghazi Accountability Coalition Event
Full Context: Benghazi Accountability Coalition Event ( 9:17 ) Published on Jun 17, 2014 by The Heritage Foundation
The exchange between questioner Saba Ahmed and a panel at a June 16, 2014, event, "Benghazi: The Difference It Makes Is Accountability!"
the Benghazi Accountability Coalition hosted by the Heritage Foundation. On the panel Chris Plante, Clara Lopez, Brigitte Gabriel, and Frank Graffney
SABA AHMED: As-salamu alaykum. Peace to you all.
My name is Saba Ahmed.
I'm a Law Student at American University.
I am here to ask you a simple question.
I know that we portray Islam and all Muslims as bad, but there is 1.8 billion Muslims followers of Islam.
We have 8 million plus Muslim Americans in this country, and I don't see them represented here.
But my question ishow can we fight an ideological war with weapons?
How can we ever end this war?
The jihadist ideology that you talk about - it's an ideology.
How can you ever win this thing if you don't address it ideologically?
CHRIS PLANTE: Frank.
FRANK GAFFNEY: Well, um, I'm glad to see you're representing Muslims in this company.
Uh, I don't want to speak for anybody else, but I think I can say safely that there isn't anybody on this panel that thinks that all Muslims are the problem.
I certainly don't.
What we have been trying to help people to understand is the ideology, to use your tern, the doctrine, if you will, uh the program, agenda.
I don't know what best way to describe what "Sharia" is.
But that's the default line, I think, between Muslims who are
decidedly the problem,because they believe it is "Allah's will", God's will, to impose that will on everybody else, Muslim and non-Muslim, alike, on one hand.
And on the other hand, you have lots of Muslims who don't follow that program.They don't even know what it's about,
don't speak Arabic,
aren't imbued with the traditions of the faith as out of Saudi Arabia, for example.
And they are NOT necessarily the problem, at least not yet.
But what makes these policy things so important it seems to me, and why it is imperative that we understand it ...
It's not just that we don't know that we're fightingan "ideological war" against people who ARE ABSOLUTELY CONVINCED OF THE SUPREMACY OF THEIR IDEOLOGY
but because as a practical matter, we're engaged in a situation that is becoming vastly worse in part because we keep embracing people who are imbued with that ideology.
This is why I come back to this idea of legitimating and engaging and funding and arming the Muslim Brotherhood.
These are exponents of "Sharia".
It is part of their agenda, very explicitly, to impose it, as I say, on everyone else.
So I thank you for the question and I think we absolutely do need to deal with it as an ideologically war, at least in part or at least understand the the ideology that is driving THE VIOLENT JIHAD ON THE ONE HAND,
AND EVERY BIT AS IMPORTANTLY WHAT THE MUSLIM BROTHERHOOD CALLS THE "CIVILIZATION JIHAD" ON THE OTHER.
Many in the government, if they're thinking about this at all, are focused on the sort of dangling, shiny object, dangerous as it is, of "VIOLENT JIHAD".
But they're missing ENTIRELY, that other piece that I talked about in connection with Huma Abedin and others,
which is
the SUBVERSION, the not-so-much non-violent form of Jihad, as the PRE-VIOLENT FORM OF JIHAD, with which they hope ultimately to take us down just as surely as the others who embrace VIOLENT JIHAD seem to.
But at the end of the day, it is something that brings them together, whether it is ISSI,
whether it is the Taliban,
whether it's Al Qaida,
whether it's the Muslim Brotherhood,
whether it's dozens of others,
IS "Sharia" .
And we DO have to get THAT straight.
BRIGITTE GABRIEL: Great ,,,
Crowd: ( applause) [Video time ( 4:06 )]
BRIGITTE GABRIEL: Great question.
I am so glad you're here.
And I am so glad you brought that up, because this
, because it gives us an opportunity to answer.
What I find so amazing is, since the beginning of this panel, which we are here about Benghazi attack against our people;
not one person mentioned Muslims,
we are here against Islam,
or we're launching war against Muslims.
We are here TO DISCUSSHOW 4 AMERICANS DIED,
and WHAT OUR GOVERNMENT IS DOING.
We are NOT here to bash Muslims.
YOU were the one who brought up the issue about 'most Muslims', NOT US.
And since you brought it up, allow me to elaborate with my answer.
There are 1.2 BILLION Muslims in the world today.
OF COURSE NOT ALL of them are radicals.
The majority of them are peaceful people.
The radicals are estimated to be between 15 to 25% according to ALL intelligence services around the world.
That leaves 75% of them, ma
a peaceful people.
But when you look at 15 to 25% of the world's Muslim population,you're looking at 180 million to 300 million people DEDICATED TO THE DESTRUCTION OF WESTERN CIVILIZATION.
That is as big of the United States.
So why should we worry about the radical, 15 to 25%?BECAUSE IT IS THE RADICALS THAT KILL.
BECAUSE IT IS THE RADICALS THAT BEHEAD AND MASSACRE.
When you look throughout history, when you look at all the lessons of history,most Germans were peaceful.
Yet the Nazis drove the agenda.
And as a result, 60 million people died, almost ah,
14 million in concentration camps. 6 million were Jews.
The peaceful majority were IRRELEVANT.
When you look at Russia, most Russians were peaceful as well.
Yet the Russians were able to kill 20 million people.
The peaceful majority were irrelevant.
When you look at China for example, most Chinese were peaceful as well.
Yet the Chinese were able to kill 70 million people.
The peaceful majority were IRRELEVANT.
When you look at Japan prior to World War II, most Japanese were peaceful as well.
Yet, Japan was able to butcher its way across Southeast Asia, killing 12 million people, mostly killed with bayonets and shovels.
The peaceful majority were IRRELEVANT.
On September 11th in the United States, we had 2.3 MILLION Arab Muslims living in the United States.
It took 19 hijackers,19 radicals,to bring America down to its knees,
destroy the World Trade Center,
attack the Pentagon,
and
and kill almost 3000 Americans that day.
THE PEACEFUL MAJORITY WERE IRRELEVANT !
SO FOR ALL OUR POWERS OF REASON, and US TALKING ABOUT moderate and peaceful Muslims, I'm glad you're here.
But WHERE ARE THE OTHERS SPEAKING OUT?
AND SINCE YOU ARE THE ONLY MUSLIM REPRESENTATIVE
Crowd: ( overwhelming applause)
BRIGITTE GABRIE: ( speaking to the large crowd and waving her hands down to lower the noise) Save your applause until the end.
Crowd: ( overwhelming applause)
BRIGITTE GABRIEL: Thank you.
Crowd: ( overwhelming applause)
BRIGITTE GABRIEL: (Laughing) Thank you.
AND SINCE YOU ARE THE ONLY MUSLIM REPRESENTATIVE IN HERE, YOU TOOK THE LIME LIGHT INSTEAD OF SPEAKING ABOUT And I assume
[Ahmed responded yes.]
BRIGITTE GABRIEL: You're an American Citizen?
[Ahmed responded yes.]
BRIGITTE GABRIEL: So, as an American citizen, you sat in this room, and INSTEAD of standing up as saying a question,
or asking something about our 4 Americans that died and what our government is doing to correct the problem,
YOU STOOD THERE TO MAKE A POINT ABOUT PEACEFUL, MODERATE MUSLIMS.
I wish you brought 10 with you TO QUESTION THEM ABOUT WHAT, HOW WE CAN HELP OUT GOVERNMENT RESPONSIBLE It is timewe take political correctness and THROW IT IN THE GARBAGE CAN WHERE IT BELONGS,
and STOP CALLING IT "SAME FAITH" .
[Video time ( 8:00 )]
Crowd: ( Shouts of "Yeah" and overwhelming applause)
CHRIS PLANTE: And they'll be refreshments afterwards.
Crowd: ( Laughter and overwhelming applause)
CHRIS PLANTE: (to Clare Lopez) Ah, did you want to respond to the ah
?
CLARE LOPEZ: (Shaking her head no) I don't want to.
CHRIS PLANTE: You think, ah (laughing) you think that
another time .
CLARE LOPEZ: (Shaking her head no) I can't follow that.
CHRIS PLANTE: ( Laughing) ( Pointing to Saba Ahmed) You had a follow-up that you'd ah
I'd uh
Yeah, go ahead. Go ahead.
[Video time ( 8:31 )] (Video of part of the large crowd and Saba Ahmed asking question)
SABA AHMED:
A comment.
Thank you for your responses.
And I do really hope that other Muslims will start showing up at these conservative forums.
But, you know, as a peaceful
ah, American Muslim I would like to think that I'm not that irrelevant.
I would like, I'm just as much an American and Im very deeply saddened about the lives that were lost in Libya.
And I hope that we will find justice for them and their families and
But I don't think that this war can ever be won BY JUST THE MILITARY.
You have to address the war
You have to bring the Muslims to the table TO ADDRESS THIS.
CHRIS PLANTE: I think that
I think everyone agrees that it can't be won JUST by the military, and I that everyone has said that.
You,
Can you tell me WHO the head of the uh, Muslim Peace Movement IS?
SABA AHMED: Huh, I guess that's me right now, sir. (she's smiling)
Thank you.
CHRIS PLANTE: Uh, yeah, well uh
(smiling)
Thank you.
(Crowd clapping)
END of video.
15
posted on
09/23/2014 11:29:22 AM PDT
by
Yosemitest
(It's Simple ! Fight, ... or Die !)
To: Kaslin
ISIL? Not Islamic"...how mentally ill is this man?
16
posted on
09/23/2014 11:30:01 AM PDT
by
yoe
To: Yosemitest
17
posted on
09/23/2014 11:36:52 AM PDT
by
St_Thomas_Aquinas
( Isaiah 22:22, Matthew 16:19, Revelation 3:7)
To: CaptainAmiigaf
-— The Islam of Pres. Bushs time had yet to show its true face to the world. -—
I can’t make sense of this statement on any level.
18
posted on
09/23/2014 11:41:40 AM PDT
by
St_Thomas_Aquinas
( Isaiah 22:22, Matthew 16:19, Revelation 3:7)
To: CaptainAmiigaf
I bet Bush knew that is Islam means “Submission” not “Peace.”
IMHO, he was just trying to make sure we didn’t have fight all of them at once.
19
posted on
09/23/2014 11:41:56 AM PDT
by
Little Ray
(How did I end up in this hand-basket, and why is it getting so hot?)
To: yoe
20
posted on
09/23/2014 11:50:42 AM PDT
by
Travis McGee
(www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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