Skip to comments.Woman Falls 17 Stories to Her Death; AP Implies She Deserved It
Posted on 08/02/2013 3:44:57 PM PDT by grundle
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I have a friend who I only go to her home in the summer time when we can sit outside at the picnic table because I break out in hives inside if I sit down - because I am allergic to her husband's cologne and it has permeated all of their furniture. He understands this and never wears that cologne when we go out together or they come to my home.
Do you think people object to cigarette smoke just because they are jerks or busybodies?
Not all, but most I have encountered are exactly that. In fact, encountered a group of them just yesterday. They walked through the door, that has a sign stating smoking was permitted and immediately started complaining about it.
Or could it be possible that it really, truly is an obnoxious odor?
Totally a subjective opinion because others do not find it to be obnoxious.
LOL...I remember when I was a little kid, my pediatrician smoked, and he lived well into his 80s.
Her nose is really sensitive to farts. She can’t smell cigarette smoke, but farts she knows.
So you choose to be, "pretty social," but the people who smoke where you choose to socialize should curb their behavior to accommodate your choice of activities and venues?
If it bothers you so much, stay home.
The smoking didnt kill her, did it?
Saying that smoking is hazardous to your health when someone died from causes unrelated to smoking is silly. She was killed by falling from a 17th floor balcony. There's no reason to be outraged by the cigarettes, but rather the outrage should be focused at her building management. Seriously.
I don’t expecg go see “penthouse letters” on FR.
Nice change of subject from what was said in #43 and my response to it.
I was a smoker, a toker and a midnight joker.
You always had a choice, little man, without making a federal case out of it.
If you're a sensitive non-smoker, just don't visit smokers.
If you're a militant non-smoker, don't invite smokers to your house and presume a) that they will accept your invitation; or b) That they will insist on smoking in the house of a neurotic, controlling freak.
And don't go there. The story in NOT about smoking in a place of employment, or a public or commercial building.
Yeppers. Doctors are people and about 15% smoke just like the populace. The other 85% didn’t quit smoking.....they quit buying. Bums and tightwads all.
I'll bet you anything that for statistical purposes this will be ruled as a "tobacco related death." A few years ago in Louisiana there was a group pushing for some major restrictions/bans on where you could smoke. I looked at some of their literature, and my eye was caught by a graph showing the ages of "tobacco related deaths." It seemed strange to me that any kids under 18 would have used tobacco long enough to kill them, and yet the graph made it looked like a handful of them had one year. I did a little research on my own, and found that the minors had died in house fires that were suspected of having been started by a lit cigarette.
They were listed as, "tobacco related deaths."
Agonizing over others making choices that lower the value of their own house.
We used to call people like that irrational busybodies. Or controlling twits.
I don’t believe smoking is as much of a hazard as we are constantly being told, no. I see many more ill people who are ill as a consequence of poor diet or alcohol. Perhaps some people are more sensitive to the effects than others.
There are studies to prove anything. Some studies show smokers have less chance of Parkinson’s, Alzheimer’s and pancreatic cancer. Anecdotally, I don’t recall those specific diseases being prevalent back when smoking was ubiquitous. Right now, I know of 3 people who never smoked, yet are dealing with terrible cancers. I know others who have suffered from autoimmune conditions from an early age and who neither smoke or drink, have never done drugs and eat healthy diets. I know older, long term smokers who are fit, healthy, rarely ill and still working. Everyone knows of such instances.
I would not smoke in someone’s home, car or in an enclosed public space if it is not desired/allowed. I think the edicts against smoking outside are silly.
I mainly wish Americans would go back to not interfering in the lives of others. Smoke, drink, eat whatever you please and engage in whatever recreational activities you choose and don’t hassle or guilt-trip others about their personal choices. We all die of something, some people are healthy until the end and some die sooner than others.
If one checks the photos of the railing, as i see it concrete formed with NO
re-enforcement by rebar/iron!
It happens that crooked Contractors skimp/skip on the rebar that codes call for.
Yes, those references are for Manhattan only. The other boroughs have their own lingos.
First off, I’ve never smoked. In the 1970’s, I was a hospital patient sharing a room with a smoker. I was there for two days.
I felt fine until they wheeled in Thelma. I was fine, that is, until she woke up and lit up the first of many cigarettes, which she chain smoked. After awhile, the fumes began to nauseate me, and my head to ache.
Up until that time, smoking was rare enough in my family life that when I went out, I sort of enjoyed the smell. Now I was trapped, and I had to endure it.
The room stayed hazy all of the time. When Thelma’s family visited in the evening, they all smoked. I complained to the nurses and the doctor, but those were different times. While they were sympathetic, I was told Thelma and her visitors had every right to light up, even if it sickened me.
My eyes, nostrils and throat burned from the smoke. I’d walk down the hall and sit in the waiting room, but smokers were there, too, or the cigarette odors they left behind.
Because I couldn’t leave and go home, I resented being forced to inhale the smoke and have its residue stick to my hair, skin, gown and bedding. I could taste it, and I couldn’t wait to get out of there!
When I finally did get out to our car, my head began to clear. I brought the odor home with me, and my parents complained about it, too. I showered and washed everything, but it took a couple of days for the odor to fade from the house and the car.
Now, the smell of cigarettes is rare enough again that I sometimes enjoy the smell of them. However, based on my experience when I was 19, I don’t know if I could physically tolerate smoking in close quarters for very long.
Thelma and her visitors? Why they were just plain offish, selfish and rude individuals. They didn’t know whether I was in for tests, or sick, and they didn’t care.
That’s the way it was. “Good times”, indeed.
She worked for the New Yorker and Cosmopolitan???
Well then, OF COURSE she deserved to fall off a 17th story balcony.
Let me guess, they built the Building when Bush was President, right?
Is there such a thing as “Big Railing”, and did they meet privately with Darth Cheney at the White House?
What the hell are you talking about?
I simply posited ta guess that the railing may have given way due to naughty time on the balcony. I never said that sex outside marriage or sex outside on a balcony should be a capital offense. Now did I ever say that if the woman was having sex that makes her any less a victim.
It's you who is being a bit quick to judge here, not me.
Oh, yes. Sorry. They are different parts of Manhattan. Roughly, though there are specific (and to the north, different) streets bordering them, the UES, for example, is the area to the east of Central Park and the UWS, that to the west. It is 59th St. that is the southern border to all three, and this building is two blocks south, on 57th.
The next little chunk of the City to the south is ‘Midtown’, and on the eastern side of the island, it is Midtown East. Though there are also some smaller neighborhoods within those larger areas, and this building is also in a smaller neighborhood called Sutton Place.
Manhattan is only one of the five larger ‘boroughs’ of the City overall.
What the heck are you talking about? I said if they want it, that’s fine—and that applies to landlords too.
Hello—if you’re that allergic to raw seafood, you can not work in a fish market.
The theory, right or wrong, is that second-hand smoke is bad for everyone, where of course exposure to raw shrimp in the rare environment of a fish market isn’t bad for the majority of people.
Again, right or wrong, the theory is that second-hand smoke is bad for everyone, not just some rare few.
I can understand that view, but local governments can also determine if they think something is a public health hazard and place limits thereof.
That is so funny, but I totally understand. I've gotten much better over the years, but still not a fan of heights. Went on Oh My God Road near Idaho Springs, Colorado a few years back. Was totally freaked out because it was this kinda narrow dirt road. It didn't help that there was remnants of a car or two that had went over. Can't remember when the 2nd time happened, but I was much better at dealing with it then.
The main attraction was their waterfall :) ....and Beau Joes mountain pies.
Yes, public health hazards like salt, trans-fats, >16 oz. sodas, and firearms.
Are you being sarcastic or are you being serious? I hope you are being sarcastic. If not you might want to reconsider your tag line.
First off, I dont know where you are getting that her date was a black man. Ive not seen his race reported in any article nor could I find any pictures of him. His name is Stephen Close and while that name doesnt preclude him from being black, it doesnt sound at least stereotypically like a black name. He is reported to be in real estate and while he does not live in the same building as Rosoff, he does live nearby. I found what I think is his profile on Linkedin but there is no picture and I dont have a Linkedin account to view his full profile. But I seriously dont think that even if Close is a black man, that this says anything negative about her character especially if he was like her, an educated professional. I would point out that Clarence Thomas and Dr. Thomas Sowell are married to white women. FWIW, Ive never dated a black man - Im not particularly attracted to black men, but as a single white woman, if I met an intelligent, educated, successful, politically conservative and morally upstanding black man with whom I shared common interests, that I would rule him out merely because of his race.
I read one article that she met him on-line, inferring perhaps that they met through an on-line dating site, but being that they were both professionals, they could have met through Linkedin or as he did live in her neighborhood, she could have met him at any of places prior to that evening. They were on a first date but that doesnt necessarily imply that they had never met prior to that night.
Next, you say she was out drinking but all the articles state that they had gone out to dinner at a nearby Mexican restaurant Maya. After their dinner, she invited Close back to see her apartment and have a nightcap and had a smoke on her balcony (oh the horrors adults having an adult beverage and even more horrible smoking a cigarette I bet they also had salty Mexican food that night - has Mayor Bloomberg been informed yet?) And being that Close is in real estate, inviting him to see her apartment may not be as you imply, a purely sexual encounter. And the NYPD have stated that so far they do not believe that alcohol was a factor. I am guessing that the toxicology report will either confirm or refute that.
She fell to her death at approximately 12:30 AM and while that sounds very late to be out on a date on a weeknight, remember that this happened in Manhattan and she was an advertizing executive for a startup agency and he was a real estate professional. It is not at all unusual for folks like that to work until 8 or 9 PM or even later (heck Ive been known to be at my office that late). And restaurants in NYC are open very late as most are very busy with long wait times so I dont find it at all strange that one might not come home from a simple dinner date at around midnight. And so what if they had a drink or two during dinner?
I am sure that it was the apartment management's fault and the drinking alcohol and smoking who knows what had no effect on her judgment or balance and had nothing to do with her demise. Many drunk women who have just had sex with a stranger sit on weathered and partially rotted wooden railings 17 floors up while they smoke. If one checks I am sure that the same type of tragedy has played out many times even among Amish women.
Again, you are implying that she was at fault because she was drunk (facts not in evidence) and that this and smoking who knows what because yes of course they must have been smoking one of those funny cigarettes especially if she was out on a date with a black man because all black men are dope fiends (again, facts, his race and drug use, not in evidence) and that they had just had sex with a stranger (once again, facts not in evidence).
If you look at the pictures of the balcony railing, they dont appear to be wooden to me. They appear to be a metal of some type, looks to me to be a hollow aluminum railing and it is being reported this morning that they were not up to code and that the building management had not had them inspected, had delayed the scheduled inspection so if that is the case, they are in part responsible.
Yes, her date was concerned about her sitting (or leaning) on the railing just before it gave way. Although she told him shed done it many times before, was that bad judgment on her part? Yes. Does that mean she was some drunken floozy who invites strange men or strange black men back to her apartment to have sex with her? No.
(The Amish) I live and work in Amish country central PA. Read up about Rumspringa sometime and Im not talking about those Breaking Amish shows. While most Amish are morally upstanding and for most Amish youth, Rumspringa is pretty tame, there are some who experiment with alcohol, drugs and pre-marital sex. FWIW, you should know that many of the Amish here in Lancaster County grow tobacco as both a cash crop and for their personal use and many do smoke tobacco (pipes but not cigarettes, cigarettes being considered too worldly) and some distill and drink alcohol in moderation. Every once and a while I hear about an Amish youth being pulled over for DWI while driving a buggy.
While we're at it, I hope you'll answer my other question: New Yorkers refer to numbered street intersections, such as "3rd and 21st," without specifying which are Avenues and which are Streets. I'm assuming Avenues run in one direction and Streets in the other. The question is: what convention are they all using, which is unstated but universally understood? My assumption is that it's "Avenues, then Streets," because that's alphabetical.
Yes, when they use that shorthand, they are referring to streets in Manhattan, and if they’re First through 10th they are avenues. The avenues, plus Broadway and a couple of smaller fringe streets, run north to south. The streets go up to something like 244th, including part of the Bronx. They generally use the street (or avenue) that the address is actually on before giving the cross street. And you’re right, if simply referencing an intersection, the avenue comes first. They’ll slap an “Ave.” and/or a “St.” on if it’s open to confusion.
Thanks for the clarity and generosity of your replies. I’ve now learned a couple of things I long wondered about but had no one to ask.
Thanks for that clarification and my sincere apology to you for thinking you were not being sarcastic.
You are correct in that news stories are often inaccurate and lacking in important details or are just plain sensationalist.
Okay, it seems I read too much into your comments — I apologize for that. (Although I still wonder about your imagination.) Some other writers were clearly being judgmental. They need to give their heads a shake. The woman is a victim, plain and simple.
You should write a book about your exposure to smokers and the pain it caused you but I see you already did.
Yes, I like to write. Bye.
Well don’t get all huffy and puffy......
BTW, a psych unit didn’t give special considerations to patients on lock down for suicide watch back then. If you were breathing smoke...you were still breathing and alive. That’s all that mattered.
If that’s your story, glad you are okay but you need to lose that big old chip on your shoulder.
Wow. You sure get off being a bitch. You must be a member of Thelma’s family.
Thelma and her visitors? Why they were just plain offish, selfish and rude individuals.
Many psych patients often use name calling to verbalize their own self-hatred. You could google “transference” but I’m sure you are familiar with the term. If not, try googling “liberal mental illness” and “name calling.”
Later, flo. Need to run to the store and get Aunt Thelma a pack of smokes.
Go bite a rabid animal. It might sweeten you up, addict.
Now you want me to “bite” you. You really are sick. Please don’t start cutting yourself or doing any other form of self mutilation. Get some help, flo.
Oh, and by the way, joules, or whatever your name is, exactly who is doing the “transference” here, insinuating I’m a “psyche patient”? Ha! Ask my dearest love, Joe 6-pack, how I feel about smokers. As you know, he is one.
But back to transference, you can add my little “chip” to the mountain on your shoulder. How about “huffy, puffy”, words that incidentally describe a smoker to a ‘T’?
The truth is, you’ve got your nose out of joint because I blew a hole in your selfish nostalgia about the good old days, smoking up hospital corridors.
You know not everyone remembers your indoor smoking so fondly, but then you were just trying to bait folk weren’t you... for sport... in the wee hours... like you are wont to do almost every night? Sad.
Come on joulez, you can still devour another pack of fags before you conk out. It’s not even midnight.
You are getting creepy, flo. “Bite” “devour” “bait” “fags” “psyche” but my favorite is “joint”. Typical lib pot head thinking. Interesting.
BTW, you should ping someone when you talk about them.
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