Posted on 03/14/2013 7:51:02 PM PDT by Bigtigermike
In his first public Mass, Pope Francis urged the Catholic Church on Thursday to stick to its Gospel roots and shun modern temptations, warning that it would become just another charitable group if it forgot its true mission.
Addressing cardinals in the frescoed Sistine Chapel the day after his election there, Jorge Bergoglio said the Church should be more focused on the Gospels of Jesus Christ.
"We can walk all we want, we can build many things, but if we don't proclaim Jesus Christ, something is wrong. We would become a compassionate NGO and not a Church which is the bride of Christ," he said, speaking in Italian without notes.
"When we don't proclaim Jesus Christ, we proclaim the worldliness of the devil, the worldliness of the demon."
"We must always walk in the presence of the Lord, in the light of the Lord, always trying to live in an irreprehensible way," he said in a heartfelt homily of a parish priest, loaded with biblical references and simple imagery.
"When we walk without the cross, when we build without the cross and when we proclaim Christ without the cross, we are not disciples of the Lord. We are worldly. We may be bishops, priests, cardinals, popes, all of this, but we are not disciples of the Lord," he said.
(Excerpt) Read more at mobile.reuters.com ...
Dear Leader probably won’t like Pope Francis.
As a non-Catholic Christian, I really like this guy.
I agree totally. He’s speaking the truth here that many Protestants would agree too as well
Maybe not the ELCA.
Yeah you got a point
Ping!
RE: As a non-Catholic Christian, I really like this guy.
Well, as a non-Catholic Christian myself, I’d like to hear Francis expound further exactly what he means by the gospel.
Francis is not apparently afraid to call demonic things demonic (a term he's also used in reference to gay marriage).
I think a number of RC Bishops and senior clerics of other denominations have become somewhat reluctant to use such stark verbiage as it has such a medieval, anachronistic ring to it. It's refreshing to have such clear acknowledgment of Ephesians 6:12 at the very top.
The ELCA and the UCC are poster children for “becoming a pitiful NGO”.
This statement isn’t clear to you:
“When we walk without the cross, when we build without the cross and when we proclaim Christ without the cross, we are not disciples of the Lord. We are worldly. We may be bishops, priests, cardinals, popes, all of this, but we are not disciples of the Lord,” he said.
OOPS.
All those lberal talking heads that were all excited about this new Pope just had their heads explode!
(Gimme that) Old Time Religion? A relative of mine, Jim Reeves, sang that one.
I like this pope. He seems like a straight shooter from what I’ve read.
As a non-Catholic I can clearly understand what he’s saying -— that even if one has a title of POPE and doesn’t proclaim Christ on the cross for our sins then you are none of The Lords
I would like him to expound further on what he means by “walking with the cross”, “building with the cross”, “proclaim Christ with the cross.”
There’s a lot of meaning behind it and different people have different understanding of the above.
He is a Jesuit and Jesuits are dedicated to destroying Protestants.
http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/jesuit_extreme_oath_of_induction.htm
If Jesuits are dedicated to destroying Protestants, apparently they are no good at it. I’ve never heard of any Protestant saying he was destroyed by a Jesuit, and Protestants remain plentiful while Jesuits are not at all numerous.
Having read and taught the Gospel of Jesus Christ there is nothing there remotely having anything to do with Roman Catholicism. The old "Peter is the rock Jesus built the church upon" ruse doesn't hold water if anyone with a modicum of N.T. Greek grammar examines the passage in the original and in its context. Hint, it is highly unlikely almighty God would build his church upon Peter the "pebble". But God did build His church upon the person of the Lord Jesus Christ Himself who Scripture declares to be "THE ROCK" = (f Romans 9:33; 1 Corinthians 10:1-4; 1 peter 2:4-8).
Sadly, men would rather worship a man made institution, and follow after mortal men who make themselves out to be so-called "Vickers of Christ" before they die and turn to dust and another mortal charlatan takes their place. Instead of worshipping the Lord Jesus Christ who alone is worthy of worship and veneration because He and He alone died upon the cross of Calvary for our sin, was burried and arose again from the dead because God the Father was totally satisfied with His ONE and ONLY all-sufficient sacrifice (f: Romans 4:25).
You link comes from a Conspiracy Theory site.
Here is one of the first links:
“There were no “suicide” pilots on those September 11 jets. The jets were controlled by advanced robotics and remote-control technology, not hijackers. Fantastic? Before I explain, read about the history-making robot/remote-controlled jet plane.”
One of the more fruitier nutcakes I must say.
As for your last comment, God has a way of balancing the scales of justice because He says "vengence is mine, I will repay." Yes, God has a way of working things out.
....those maniacal Jesuits eh...
blood libel and all...
The intellect of irrational Muslims.
I would take his words to mean that he believes/wants Christians, and others, to look at the life and teachings of Jesus Christ for living in this world so that Christ can be the way to God’s eternity. I take you have thoughts of other meaning(s). If so you should share these.
If Pope Francis means “
1Co 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
1Co 15:2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
1Co 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
1Co 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
1Co 15:5 And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:
1Co 15:6 After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep. “
Pope Francis is talking about penance for sins.
Rock-band, good-time, we-love-everyone churches, don’t talk like that but then they are not truly Christian. Jesus died on the cross for our sins.
Galatians 6:14: But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.
Today we are disciples and ambassadors for Christ and sons / daughters of God:
II Corinthians 5:20: Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us
Romans 8:14: For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Romans 8:19: For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.
Galatians 4:6: And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.
Philippians 2:15: That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;
Exactly what was accomplished by the cross? according to Catholic doctrine?
So, if Jesus Christ is crucified for our sins . . . and it was only He upon that old rugged cross . . . then Mary has nothing to do with our salvation, other than being the human vessel by which God became flesh?
“And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory” (I Timothy 3:16)
Christ Jesus died for ALL sins PAST, PRESENT and FUTURE: and all sins which were laid upon Him in the 1st Century from our perspective are FUTURE sins. Therefore, no sin that men / women commit today for a believer, is not unforgiven; everything is paid in full.
Colossians 2:13: And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
Christ has forgiven you all trespasses (and sins): paid in full at the cross. That is what was accomplished at the cross.
Amen to your response!
In other words, when Jesus said, “It is finished” . . . He meant that all the work that needed to do to procur an eternal salvation for each believer was accomplished finally and for all time.
Yet, Catholicism seeks to add human effort and good works to the equation, and limits our access to God and his forgiveness to the dictates of a mere priest who stands in the way of the shed blood of Jesus Christ.
I believe that the Word of God tells us that we have a mediator, and it is not a man trained in the rudiments of his religious hierarchy.
“I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men; For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty. For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time” (I Timothy 2:1-6).
Would to God a man might see and understand this truth and proclaim, “Once I was blind, but now I see!” (John 9:25).
I am not paid up, full accounted. You are a good person, right? AmbassadorForChrist? Perhaps, you can tell of your missions? Just go ahead, and spit it out
I am not paid up, full accounted. You are a good person, right? AmbassadorForChrist? Perhaps, you can tell of your missions? Just go ahead, and spit it out
I am not paid up, full accounted. You are a good person, right? AmbassadorForChrist? Perhaps, you can tell of your missions? Just go ahead, and spit it out
The answer is really quite simple, if one is willing to accept the biblical response . . .
“Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ’s stead, be ye reconciled to God. For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him” (II Corinthians 5:20-21).
Notice that ambassador is in the plural case, meaning that all that are washed by the blood of Christ - if they are willing - are representatives of our Lord Jesus Christ.
To further add clarity to the context of the verses I posted . . .
“Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation” (II Corinthians 5:17-19).
Not only is salvation a free gift from God to be received; but the Christian ministry also, is a gift from God to be used for God.
Biblical response? God is written in my heart. Now, I will insult you. Cast no heed, of the words of the deeds of men. Record your soul, by the breath of God.
I apologize, but I have no clue as to what you just said.
Okay. It was just blather. Thank you.
That’s ok. Perhaps it was this that you were referring to this early morning . . .
“Do we begin again to commend ourselves? or need we, as some others, epistles of commendation to you, or letters of commendation from you? Ye are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men: Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart. And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward: Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God; Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life” (II Corinthians 3:1-6)
God bless you!
May God bless us, all
>what he means by the gospel
Most likely it has relevance to the words of Matthew, Mark, Luke, John and perhaps Francis.
At the exclusion of the other 62 Books of the Bible?
This Protestant thinks that Francis is the Real Deal. On day one he unflinchingly tees off against secularism and proclaims Christ crucified. But that more of our “faith leaders” would follow his example (are you taking notes, Rick Warren? Joel Osteen? Bueller...?) The Holy Spirit will use Pope Francis mightily.
I’m more familiar with the somewhat current Jesuits than the bloody historical ones. I went to a music conference once where the featured speaker was from the St. Louis Jesuits. I don’t imagine a Protestant could die from hearing cheezy 1980s guitar mass music.
I guess what I’m trying to say is that today’s Jesuits are not even close to wanting to try to go out there and harm Protestants. They are not jihadis. Be impressed by their intellect, but do not fear their wrath. They don’t have any.
RE: . I take you have thoughts of other meaning(s). If so you should share these.
I am simply asking a question out of interest, that’s all.
Francis talks about the cross, which is the sacrifice that Christ made for the sins of mankind.
I’d really like to know if he believes that this sacrifice has been COMPLETED.
In other words, does Francis teach about Christ’s perfect sacrifice on Calvary? Does he teach that in the cross, Christ FINISHED His work of redemption for man and no additional sacrifice is needed?
Or does he teach the priest miraculously transforms the bread and wine in the mass into Christ’s real body, and that Jesus is then sacrificed anew?
Does he teach that when the priest utters the words of consecration, the bread and wine are changed into the literal body and blood of Christ. Does he teach that Christ is still being offered to God on the altar as a propitiatory sacrifice for sin today?
I am interested in listening to Francis expound on this, since he mentioned the cross.
And note: I originally addressed my response to a Non-Catholic Christian.
I see. You don’t understand what the Mass is.
RE: I see. You don’t understand what the Mass is.
That is why I seek clarification. You will notice that all I have were questions...
Maybe you can help this non-Catholic christian out.
Can you explain this :
In checking out the Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC), The Catholic Encyclopedia, and The Council of Trent, we find the following: The Eucharist is referred to in several ways.
As a sacrifice
“the holy sacrifice of the Eucharist,” (CCC, 1055) and “the Eucharist is also a sacrifice,” (CCC, 1365).
As a divine sacrifice
“For it is in the liturgy, especially in the divine sacrifice of the Eucharist, that “the work of our redemption is accomplished,” (CCC, 1068).
“If any one saith, that the sacrifice of the mass is only a sacrifice of praise and of thanksgiving; or, that it is a bare commemoration of the sacrifice consummated on the cross, but not a propitiatory sacrifice; or, that it profits him only who receives; and that it ought not to be offered for the living and the dead for sins, pains, satisfactions, and other necessities; let him be anathema.” (Trent: On the Sacrifice of the Mass: Canon 3)
Some of my Catholics friends tell me that the Eucharist is not a re-sacrifice of Christ.
They want to make it clear that Christ was offered once for all and that the Mass is not a re-sacrifice but a “re-presentation” of the sacrifice.
Well, I certainly do not want to misrepresent Roman Catholic theology, but I must ask how it is possible for the Mass to NOT be a re-sacrifice of Christ when the Mass is called a divine sacrifice (CCC, 1068) that is done over and over again.
We are told that “the sacrifice of Christ and the sacrifice of the Eucharist are one single sacrifice”; (CCC, 1367); that it is an unbloody offering that is proptiatory, (CCC, 1367); that it can make reparation of sins, (CCC, 1414); and is to be considered a true and proper sacrifice (The Catholic Encyclopedia, topic: “Sacrifice of the Mass”).
Based on the above, I cannot help but conclude that it is a sacrifice that occurs over and over again and since it is said to be a true and proper sacrifice that is propitiatory, then logically it must be a re-sacrifice of Christ. If it is not, then how can it be called a sacrifice of Christ?
Also, how could it be propitiatory if it is not a sacrifice of Christ since it is Christ’s offering on the cross that is itself propitiatory?
Hence, my questions...
And Mary says "God my Saviour."
Luk 1:46 And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord, Luk 1:47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.
And who needs a saviour but sinners.
So true, and a great point, the dang.
With this verse alone, the centuries of teaching that Mary was sinless from her birth and throughout her life is shown to be in error.
We must pity those that place their eternal destiny in the hands of sinners, and not the spotless Lamb of glory, the Lord Jesus Christ who repeated the Old Testament promise, “Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool” (Isaiah 1:18) when he proclaimed to the crowd, “Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light” (Matthew 11:28-30).
The pope is correct in saying that the gospel must be proclaimed, but the troubling truth of this verse in Galatians causes me to ponder which gospel he is speaking of . . .
“I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed” (Galatians 1:6-9).
It is also a pity that a thread of this magnitude is being ignored. The topic has direct bearing upon the question of where Catholics will spend their eternity; and whether that decision is based on the “Thus saith the Lord” of God’s Word or the dictates of a fellow sinner, no matter how religious that man might be.
If I had one disappointment with FreeRepublic, it is that so many fine threads are quickly lost in the multitudes of other topics and buried in the pile.
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