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In gun debate, lots of emotion but little solid research
pioneer press ^ | 3-10-13 | megan boldt

Posted on 03/10/2013 6:55:34 AM PDT by TurboZamboni

Do guns make people safer or more susceptible to violence? Does banning assault-style weapons or expanding background checks save lives, or are such measures merely inconveniences for law-abiding gun owners?

These are just some of the questions in the debate over gun control, with advocates and foes lobbing a dizzying number of statistics and studies to make their case. Often, those facts and figures contradict one another.

The lack of objective research on gun violence has become evident as Minnesota and the nation grapple with a slew of proposed changes to gun laws after the Newtown, Conn., school shooting that killed 26. And some say it's time to reinvest in research, which was virtually cut off more than 15 years ago after opposition from pro-gun lobbyists.

"We can make a big difference on this issue if we stop posturing and blocking good, objective research," said Arthur Kellermann, a clinician and researcher who has practiced and taught emergency medicine for more than 25 years.

RESEARCH DRIES UP

Federal funding for research on preventing gun violence has been seemingly nonexistent since 1996. That's after public health research on guns started to take off and get noticed by the public.

(Excerpt) Read more at twincities.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: banglist; guncontrol; research; secondamendment; spendmoremoney; studies
so basically we need to spend more money so goobermint researchers can tell us what Obama pays them to say.
1 posted on 03/10/2013 6:55:34 AM PDT by TurboZamboni
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To: TurboZamboni

MY MEDICAL APPOINTMENT

You may want to review this prior to your next medical appointment.
.....

She said, “Before we start, I have to ask you a few questions.

She said, “Do you have any guns in the house?”...

http://www.altadenagroup.com/CSIA/post_details.asp?p_Id=11064


2 posted on 03/10/2013 6:59:47 AM PDT by KeyLargo
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To: TurboZamboni

In related news...

Florida Lawmakers Want Anger Management Training Required for Buying Ammo
http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/constitution/item/14727-florida-lawmakers-want-anger-management-training-required-for-buying-ammo


3 posted on 03/10/2013 7:04:39 AM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: KeyLargo

Response:
“When did you remove the kiddie porn from your work computer?”

I’m kinda thinkin’ the next time I need to go to the doc I’ll take a straight edge and a marker and cross out most of the hippa garbage and turn it back in and see it they’ll still see/treat me. Could be interesting.


4 posted on 03/10/2013 7:08:19 AM PDT by rktman (BACKGROUND CHECKS? YOU FIRST MR. PRESIDENT!(not that we'd get the truth!))
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To: TurboZamboni

If I may make this observation. Once you leave urban areas (Dallas, Atlanta, Philly, Chicago, etc), and you get into small towns (say 30k or less)...you start to notice a lot less usage of weapons. When you get into the rural parts of America....then you notice that weapon problems are mostly due to hunters and simply bad judgement on firing at the animal target or accidents.

In my home county in Alabama....the county has one hospital. I’d make a pretty good guess that the emergency room handles maybe twenty gun-shoot folks per year...around half of which are related to hunting or just cleaning a loaded gun (don’t even ask how stupid this sounds). You might have one or two folks want to use the weapon for suicide but really do a lousy job. And the remaining folks are simply assault victims, family issues, or drunk folks firing on other drunk folks.

You could make as many rules as you want....but statistically....things in my home county would remain just about the same for the foreseeable future. If anyone wants to waste time on research...just compare the massive urban areas against the rest of America. Your conclusions might shock folks. Urban areas are magnets for jobs, and trouble.


5 posted on 03/10/2013 7:10:43 AM PDT by pepsionice
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To: TurboZamboni

I don’t need any research at all to tell me that when your government says, we want Universal Background Checks for weapons purchases and transfers, they are really talking about a registration system.

In other words, they want to know “who has what guns and where they are.” It is simple as that. They may talk about grandfathering or other some such bullshit, but they will soon say “we need to register ALL guns, everywhere.”

The ONLY reason they want this is so that they can come and get them when they feel ready to do it at a minimum cost of government lives.

They greatly fear free-thinking individual Americans who’ve somehow escaped their traps of entitlements, delegated power, brainwashing schools, and the like. They, government, are not your compatriots, nor are they your friends. They are tyrants, NAZIs in fact, who want to control your lives, your work and your mind.


6 posted on 03/10/2013 7:11:40 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: Jack Hydrazine

Didn’t someone respond to this report the other day with: “This crap really pisses me off!” to which another FReeper quipped: “See, that’s why you need anger management classes.” Trust me, I can manage just fine without any pointers from some “expert”. Saw enough “experts” in my many years working dealing with “pc experts”, “diversity experts” “gender equality experts” “efficiency experts” “productivity experts”................ They managed to prove I could manage my anger. They all walked away from the classes under their own powert. Mostly shaking their heads. LOL!

(Jack Hydrazine. Is your middle name MonoMethyl?)


7 posted on 03/10/2013 7:16:44 AM PDT by rktman (BACKGROUND CHECKS? YOU FIRST MR. PRESIDENT!(not that we'd get the truth!))
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To: TurboZamboni

Gun Laws are ONLY for Law-Abiding-Citizens..


8 posted on 03/10/2013 7:17:01 AM PDT by 56newblog (Registered Islamophobe)
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To: TurboZamboni
Do guns make people safer or more susceptible to violence? Does banning assault-style weapons or expanding background checks save lives, or are such measures merely inconveniences for law-abiding gun owners?

None of that really matters. People just don't get individual liberty.
9 posted on 03/10/2013 7:23:28 AM PDT by andyk (I have sworn...eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.)
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To: rktman

I didn’t see the post nor the hilarious responses to it.

My middle name is Unsymmetrical Dimethyl!


10 posted on 03/10/2013 7:31:44 AM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: TurboZamboni
funny they never want to talk about Vermont, NO gun laws to speak of and very little crime...
11 posted on 03/10/2013 7:36:30 AM PDT by Chode (Stand UP and Be Counted, or line up and be numbered - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: KeyLargo
She said, “Do you have any guns in the house?”...

"Why, yes. Do you need one?"

12 posted on 03/10/2013 8:00:37 AM PDT by VeniVidiVici (Obama's vision - No Job is a Good Job)
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To: KeyLargo

This is EXCELLENT! Thanks for the find!

I recently commented on my GD’s experience with the pediatrician: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2995280/replies?c=36

Not quite as good as your composed piece. :)


13 posted on 03/10/2013 8:09:39 AM PDT by Daffynition (The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer. It has never yet melted. — D.H.)
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To: Chode
That's b/c those who would commit *crime* can't tolerate the snow 'n cold.


14 posted on 03/10/2013 8:14:22 AM PDT by Daffynition (The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer. It has never yet melted. — D.H.)
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To: Daffynition
pretty much...
15 posted on 03/10/2013 8:26:49 AM PDT by Chode (Stand UP and Be Counted, or line up and be numbered - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: Chode

Wonder how the secession is going...if that ever happens...I’m packed to our bugout cabin!


16 posted on 03/10/2013 8:29:44 AM PDT by Daffynition (The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer. It has never yet melted. — D.H.)
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To: Daffynition

I have chosen to ignore any phone calls and notices posted in the medical clinic to participate in the Government Wellness Exam.

I would strongly recommend that others do the same.


17 posted on 03/10/2013 8:35:51 AM PDT by KeyLargo
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To: pepsionice
Yep, absolutely. Get away from population centers of 100,000 or more, and there is no serious violence problem. I suspect that it could be broken down even more by zip code or some other way of identifying a region of a city, but I don’t know how to do that.

If you want evidence, then download the charts from the FBI’s UCR available every year at the fbi.gov website. One of the charts lists violent crimes by population of the area in which the crime is committed. Table 16 from the 2011 report contains this data:

City of over 1,000,000? 754.5 violent crimes per 100,000 inhabitants. Rural area (called “Nonmetropolitan counties”): 180.8 violent crimes per 100,000 inhabitants. That's fewer than 1/4 as many crimes in the rural areas (where guns are more prevalent) than in the urban areas (where guns are more regulated).

Stay away from the urban centers, and America is not a violent place.

18 posted on 03/10/2013 8:39:30 AM PDT by Stegall Tx (Part time and enjoying it.)
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To: Daffynition
don't know...
19 posted on 03/10/2013 8:39:57 AM PDT by Chode (Stand UP and Be Counted, or line up and be numbered - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: KeyLargo

My doc has anti-obama stuff posted on his walls....that he prints out in his spare time. How great is that?


20 posted on 03/10/2013 8:41:48 AM PDT by Daffynition (The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer. It has never yet melted. — D.H.)
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To: Chode

That was a flash-in-the-pan. I love Vermont, second only to Maine. Now you can get really lost in Maine. :)


21 posted on 03/10/2013 8:43:22 AM PDT by Daffynition (The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer. It has never yet melted. — D.H.)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

I was more familiar with MMH during my years of employment. Not so much UDMH. LOL!


22 posted on 03/10/2013 9:13:27 AM PDT by rktman (BACKGROUND CHECKS? YOU FIRST MR. PRESIDENT!(not that we'd get the truth!))
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To: TurboZamboni

“”We can make a big difference on this issue if we stop posturing and blocking good, objective research,” said Arthur Kellermann, a clinician and researcher who has practiced and taught emergency medicine for more than 25 years.”

Didn’t read the article, didn’t need to after seeing this. Kellerman is an anti-gun partisan hack who doesn’t mind promoting, and performing, junk science to further his agenda:

http://www.keepandbeararms.com/information/XcIBViewItem.asp?id=2331


23 posted on 03/10/2013 9:19:39 AM PDT by MtBaldy (If Obama is the answer, it must have been a really stupid question)
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To: TurboZamboni

Sorry, Megan, but you’re spouting absolute bullsh*t and you need to educate yourself, at least a little.

John Lott has researched the topic to death using estalished research methods, and the results couldn’t be more clear or more unequivocal.

Get it right or keep your yap shut; there’s enough horse manure flying around the country these days without your contribution.


24 posted on 03/10/2013 10:00:24 AM PDT by Jack Hammer
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To: Jack Hydrazine
My middle name is Unsymmetrical Dimethyl!
Some of my earliest work after college was on the Gemini launch vehicle program. Been so long ago that I don’t remember the propellants exactly, and have to look them up:
Google confirms my recollection - fuel was UDMH and hydrazine; oxidizer Nitrogen Tetraoxide.
Had to wear protective gear to do a test with Nitrogen Tetraoxide once. Long time ago.

25 posted on 03/10/2013 10:04:24 AM PDT by conservatism_IS_compassion
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To: TurboZamboni
In gun debate, lots of emotion but little solid research

Two words - John Lott. Anything else is repetition or fiction.

26 posted on 03/10/2013 10:08:28 AM PDT by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Economics In One Lesson ONLINE www.fee.org/library/books/economics-in-one-lesson)
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To: Stegall Tx

You realize, of course, that the demographic that ends up sending the most representatives to Congress and the state houses is centered in and around these Major Metropolitan Areas.

But there is so much of America that is NOT in these metro areas. Remove the excess concentration of population from the urban area, and the stress that drives the insanity so prevalent in urban settings is vastly decreased.

All the evidence in the world, however, will still not convince people to abandon the cities and disperse. Cities are such marvelous machines for the concentration of wealth and power, that invariably, people are drawn there in hopes of getting some small slice of that money and power.

But alas, all the money is in a vault in the middle of the city in somebody else’s name, and all the power is vested in a small clique that is entrenched in City Hall.

Which leaves the vast preponderance of the people stressed and a little nuts.

Sometimes a lot nuts. And violent.


27 posted on 03/10/2013 10:41:19 AM PDT by alloysteel (What is all too obvious, is not obvious to all. Until it is too late to reverse course.)
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To: MtBaldy

They bury Kellermans statement that deaths have dropped with little or few new laws and it would be good to find out why BEFORE adding laws that would do nothing or infringe on the Second Amendment,

Last paragraph— Funny it wasn’t with the rest of his quotes.

He used th claim 47 times more likely, now it’s only 2.7.


28 posted on 03/10/2013 11:48:53 AM PDT by TurboZamboni (Looting the future to bribe the present)
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To: TurboZamboni

We have the 4 year multi-volume Jimmy Carter funded research that was quickly shelved due to its inconvenient conclusion. Also the 2 latest reports from Holland & Harvard University as well as Lotts very conclusive research. But the socialist don’t like the truth so they falsely decry the lack of gun research.


29 posted on 03/10/2013 5:10:39 PM PDT by Deodoto
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To: TurboZamboni

Had my annual physical last week. Subject of guns never came up, but then I do live in Oklahoma.


30 posted on 03/11/2013 9:07:26 AM PDT by ops33 (Senior Master Sergeant, USAF (Retired))
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