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APD sees rise in active shooter training requests
KOAT 7 ABC News ^ | UPDATED 6:48 PM MST Jan 05, 2013 | Regina Ruiz

Posted on 01/05/2013 6:55:28 PM PST by Redcitizen

In the weeks after the deadly shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Connecticut, local police said they are receiving more requests for active shooter training in local schools.

The active shooter training went into effect after the Columbine High School Massacre in 1999.

(Excerpt) Read more at ...

TOPICS: Miscellaneous; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: banglist; guncontrol; schools; secondamendment
"The odds are pretty small that you would be involved in a shooting, but what if it happened. what if it happened and you don't have a plan. Because hiding under the desk doesn't work," said Albuquerque police officer James Vautier.

"Run, it's very simple. run if you can, if you can't run, hide. That's where lockdowns come in," Vautier said.

So in one sentence, Vautier says hiding under a desk does not work and in the next he says run and hide. Which means his training is not worth a hill of beans. It might make someone feel good, like they are doing something.

Any active shooter training that does not involve the use of firearms to defend yourself is useless. Your other alternatives are to throw a stapler or use harsh language.

"We won't be there in time. the average shooting is over in 5-10 minutes. Hopefully we are there in time. Most likely we are not," Vautier said.

Gee I'm filled with confidence.

1 posted on 01/05/2013 6:55:42 PM PST by Redcitizen
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To: Redcitizen
Kids are more precious than money...
Too bad security in schools is looser than the average retail store.
And many many people go in & out of stores all day...
Size & population of any given facility or building are NOT a deterrant to simple security measures...
2 posted on 01/05/2013 7:16:18 PM PST by 45semi (A police state is always preceded by a nanny state...)
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To: Redcitizen

Or put a biometric pop-open safe under the desk of teachers that want to stow their guns and deter the shooting from even occurring.

3 posted on 01/05/2013 7:17:54 PM PST by struggle (
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To: Redcitizen

He says “run, run if you can. But if you cannot run, hide”. Sounds like some honest advice for those who are unarmed at such incidents. Some people are trapped by architecture and have no escape avenue, so for them hiding is a better alternative than standing there openly.
A recent example is the kids who survived sandy hook locked in a closet where that austitard couldn’t get to them. Another is the woman in Aurora small enough able to completely hide below and behind the row of theater seats.

Vautier was honest and encouraged people to flee if possible, and that it was much preferable to just hiding if an escape route exists. Usually you don’t hear cops saying that. And it might come as a surprise to you, but that cop probably doesn’t write the laws and school policies.

Armed resistance is best, but high school and middle school kids simply will not be carrying. And no matter how much you may wish they would do so, most female teachers under the age of 30 vote for Obama, and would rather die that own a gun, even if it was allowed.

So that leaves escape if possible, or hide and barricade as best you can if running is no longer possible.
What’s so hard to understand?

4 posted on 01/05/2013 7:28:54 PM PST by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: struggle

That works since it involves use of a firearm to stop an active shooter.

5 posted on 01/05/2013 7:32:58 PM PST by Redcitizen (.)
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To: DesertRhino

Running and hiding doesn’t require active shooter training. That’s not hard to understand. Kids know to do that already.

6 posted on 01/05/2013 7:37:13 PM PST by Redcitizen (.)
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To: Redcitizen

Active shooter training:

Two to center of mass, one to the head. Repeat until active shooter is permanently inactive.

What more do you need?

7 posted on 01/05/2013 7:39:28 PM PST by Turbopilot (iumop ap!sdn w,I 'aw dlaH)
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To: Redcitizen

Nothing wrong with some training. Tell some 26 year old teacher girl “run if you can”. Tell her if he is in the hall right outside your door, “here’s a good way to barricade your door”, etc etc.

Not everybody is a combat vet. When things start happening far across the school, and she is in near panic, not knowing what to do, she might remember the day she was told “run if you can”.

A classic example is the Librarian at Columbine. There was a great opportunity for the students in the library to escape. But without even 5 minutes of training, she bullied and harrassed and firmly ordered the kids to stay put, even though they could see there was a chance to flee.

So some young teacher indeed needs to be told that fleeing is ok. That if she hears the shots far away in the school, and her classroom is 12 feet away from an external door, to go for it.
Anything that reduces the thinking required of these teachers in such situations is beneficial under stress. A comparable example is in the airliner when the stewardess points out the locations of the emergency exits and how to put on an oxygen mask.
Just because it is pretty obvious how to put a rubber band mask on doesn’t mean there is no value in taking a minute. Same is true with these teachers and kids.

8 posted on 01/05/2013 7:54:48 PM PST by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: Turbopilot
Active shooter training:

Two to center of mass, one to the head. Repeat until active shooter is permanently inactive.

What more do you need?

Lets start with how do two or more defenders armed with pistols optimized for concealment, not long range effect, neutralize a shooter armed with a semi-auto rifle?

Next up: What is the best tactic for one person armed with a pistol to confront a shooter armed with the same semi-auto rifle.

Next: best way to support an evacuation of children from a building with an active shooter while armed with a pistol?

Next: Rapid calculation of how many children is it acceptable to have shot while working yourself into a better position to confront a shooter.

Extra Credit: How do you avoid being shot by late-arriving police while firing into the school building to suppress fire coming from the shooter within?

9 posted on 01/05/2013 7:58:59 PM PST by CurlyDave
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To: CurlyDave

I am a trainer in active shooter. I have trained 4-500 law enforcement over the years. What is missing in almost all communication is that the goal of active shooter training and all training is to disrupt the shooter. The shooter is usually mission oriented and anything that disrupts that plan will stop the shooting. This is why the guy in the Washington Mall last month shot himself when he observed someone with a gun pointing it at him. He realized his plan was coming to an end. The end frequently is suicide. Yes, we have trained schools to go into lock down and secure their rooms. Some places are more secure than others. I am one of those that thing Teachers should carry in schoo.
I teach CCW or CPL classes. I have had one teacher in my class. He is actually my youngest daughters’ teacher. I would feel much more confident if you were allowed to carry. I know several teachers and former teachers who are CPL.
I am not afraid of guns in the hands of citizen’s. Never have. I remember long before columbine requesting to have SWAT training for patrol officers but was denied. You see, it was a special club. We were told to secure the perimeter and the hero’s would show up and save the day. A few years later, Columbine. The resonding officers did just as they were trained. They had been trained wrong. In my opinion, it was because of the special club status that speciality teams get in Law enforcement.
You can probably guess I am not a fan of specialty teams. Anyway, long missive. Take care.

10 posted on 01/05/2013 8:27:59 PM PST by midcop402
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To: midcop402

At my department we have stressed active shooter training for years. My last range training at the end of November was an active shooter scenario. We used to be taught to assemble the first four officers on scene into a small fireteam and make entry. We have changed that to first two officers on scene. If you arrive alone and you hear shooting, you are to make entry and attempt to locate the suspect and put him down. You only wait for the next officer if you arrive and no active shooting is occuring. At the last shooter training, it was arrive on scene solo, shooting is ongoing....I made entry and had to clear the building alone...certainly makes you think about how far some departments have come since Columbine....

11 posted on 01/05/2013 8:54:23 PM PST by Crapgame (What should be taught in our schools? American Exceptionalism, not cultural Marxism...)
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To: DesertRhino


Are you attempting to use the DISGUSTING term “autisitard” which some foul jerk made up recently?

I can’t express how vile using such a term is. There are many parents of autistic children on this site.

12 posted on 01/05/2013 10:01:12 PM PST by Politicalmom (Liberalism. Ideas so great they have to be mandatory.-FReeper Osage Orange)
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13 posted on 01/06/2013 9:09:35 AM PST by RedMDer (Those that believe in gun free zones should put GUN FREE ZONE on their property and persons.)
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