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Body found in burned home of killer of 2 firemen
Associated Press ^ | 12/25/2012 | George M. Walsh

Posted on 12/25/2012 1:00:11 PM PST by JustaCowgirl

WEBSTER, N.Y. (AP) — Police have found human remains in the burned-out home of the Webster, N.Y., ex-con who killed two firefighters and believe the victim is the gunman's sister. Police Chief Gerald Pickering said Tuesday the remains were found in the charred house that 62-year-old William Spengler shared with his 67-year-old sister, Cheryl. A medical examiner will need to determine the identity. Police say Willliam Spengler armed himself with a revolver, shotgun and military-style rifle before he set his house afire to lure first responders into a pre-dawn death trap on Christmas Eve. Pickering says Spengler "was equipped to go to war."

(Excerpt) Read more at news.yahoo.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Front Page News
KEYWORDS: firefightersgunned; firemen; firemengunned; firemenshooter; murder; shooting; spengler; websternewyork; williamspengler
Some FR posters mentioned this as a possibility...a coverup to a crime.
1 posted on 12/25/2012 1:00:22 PM PST by JustaCowgirl
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To: JustaCowgirl

Spengler should never have been let out of prison. After all, he murdered his own grandmother.


2 posted on 12/25/2012 1:03:07 PM PST by FlingWingFlyer (U.S. elections have become nothing but another cheap ripoff of American Idol.)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

A very bad dude, in the traditional meaning of the word. He will not be missed.


3 posted on 12/25/2012 1:05:44 PM PST by JustaCowgirl (Revolutions are not born out of success, they are born out of despair)
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To: JustaCowgirl

I know he was daft but even with that, what was the point to covering up a crime? He committed suicide.

I thought the fire was to lure firefighters, or so I had read.

I’m thinking it was a twofer, that he either first killed his sister by other means or simply trapped her in a fire to kill her, which also lured the firefighters whom he shot.


4 posted on 12/25/2012 1:07:37 PM PST by txrangerette ("hold to the truth...speak without fear". (Glenn Beck))
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To: txrangerette
I know he was daft but even with that, what was the point to covering up a crime? He committed suicide.

Good question. I don't know, but I think your speculation might be correct. He probably wasn't real bright to begin with, and mean as a snake on top of that. I think most likely he started the fire to cover up the murder, then when the firefighters showed up, it escalated from there. Might not have originally intended to commit suicide. Who knows.

5 posted on 12/25/2012 1:13:59 PM PST by JustaCowgirl (Revolutions are not born out of success, they are born out of despair)
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To: txrangerette

He left a note saying he wanted to kill as many people as possible, and that killing was what he did best.


6 posted on 12/25/2012 1:14:54 PM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy (Pennies and Nickels will NO LONGER be Minted as of 1/1/13 - Tim Geithner, US Treasury Sect)
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To: txrangerette

And because of the actions of these WACKOS we are supposed to give up our guns. BRING BACK THE STATE INSTITUTIONS AND LOCK THESE DANGEROUS PEOPLE AWAY FOREVER. It is the most loving and kind thing we can do for them and for us.


7 posted on 12/25/2012 1:17:04 PM PST by Sioux-san (c)
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To: JustaCowgirl
Read about this yesterday and called my sister-in-law this morning. She lives in Ontario, NY, which is not that far from Webster. I figured when they said they couldn't locate the sister, that he'd killed her, then set fire to the house. One online news article said the police are investigating the possibility that Spengler got the weapons from home thefts.

I worked in the NYS prison system for 25 years, but the guys picture didn't look familiar to me. I've been retired over 9 years, so it's possible my memory isn't like it was. The news articles were a little unclear as to the timeline of his incarceration and parole. One article said he'd served 17 years and had been paroled in 2009, another said he'd been parole in 2006. That's more than 17 years for a 1980 murder. So after reading several other articles, one in particular said that he'd been on parole for approximately 8 years since being released. That means that he'd probably been released around 1998, but was under parole supervision for 8-9 years after that.

The next door neighbor said Spengler didn't get along with his sister, and that after his 91 year old mother died this past October, Spengler had "gone crazy." I got news for that neighbor...the guy was crazy when he took a hammer to his grandmother back in 1980, and he never should have been released in the first place.

8 posted on 12/25/2012 1:23:44 PM PST by mass55th (Courage is being scared to death - but saddling up anyway...John Wayne)
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To: JustaCowgirl

The “progressives” killed the two fireman and the sister.

The shooter was their tool.


9 posted on 12/25/2012 1:24:10 PM PST by NoLibZone (If the left gave the money they make on violence, we could feed all the hungry and reduce the defict)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

Now he’ll have his name in all the papers.


10 posted on 12/25/2012 1:29:38 PM PST by bgill (We've passed the point of no return. Welcome to Al Amerika.)
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To: JustaCowgirl

I know, except it “says” the fire was meant to lure firefighters...although how can they know that?

The impression they wanted to leave was that he planned to shoot them after luring them there with the fire.

Your scenario has a gradually unfolding event with a not-too-bright, and mean, murderer (having killed his own grandmother) sort of winging it after starting out killing his sister.

The pattern of murdering family members seems clear. What isn’t yet clear is if he meant to commit suicide after he murdered his sister, meant to shoot the firemen etc or was this something that escalated.

The murderer had an arsenal of weapons ready for the arrival of any first responders, apparently, so if only from that, I’m leaning that he meant to do the entire thing from the beginning.

If true, then I don’t think the fire was to cover up a crime, since he was planning to kill himself at the end.

Seems like he was a destroyer...destroyed his grandmother, his sister, the house and the first responders he shot. And everyone connected to them...

Got his name up in lights, too, which was probably something he desired since he was a total loser otherwise...


11 posted on 12/25/2012 1:29:58 PM PST by txrangerette ("hold to the truth...speak without fear". (Glenn Beck))
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy; JustaCowgirl

Then the fire wasn’t to cover up anything, but a part of his plan to kill people, not just his sister (referencing the fact that a note was found laying out his intentions)...


12 posted on 12/25/2012 1:33:06 PM PST by txrangerette ("hold to the truth...speak without fear". (Glenn Beck))
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To: Sioux-san

Either jail them forever, lock them away in a mental institution, or apply the death penalty.

Because of THESE people, an excuse is used to say our rights must be voided. Which wouldn’t work anyway, as we know.

The whole thing makes me very angry.


13 posted on 12/25/2012 1:37:42 PM PST by txrangerette ("hold to the truth...speak without fear". (Glenn Beck))
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To: JustaCowgirl

Murdered his 92 yr old grandmother with a hammer, and some idiot judge lets him out after only 17 years.

What part of cold blooded, sociopath, didn’t the judge recognize?

ya, it’s the gun’s fault.....


14 posted on 12/25/2012 1:42:11 PM PST by G Larry (Which of Obama's policies do you think I'd support if he were white?)
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To: txrangerette

I am a strong advocate that every time one of these liberal jackasses opens his yap to spout gun control, conservatives should respond that what we need is *not* putting such killers in mental hospitals, but to swiftly and surely execute them.

That is, clear the decks so intrusive federal judges cannot delay an execution for decades, nor overturn it except in the most egregious of circumstances.

Second, to declare the states “legally competent” to carry out the death penalty *as they see fit*, without federal judges nit-picking this function to death. If they want to hang, they can hang, or electrocute, gas chamber, firing squad, or lethal injection if they want. But it is up to them, the states.


15 posted on 12/25/2012 1:46:14 PM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy (Pennies and Nickels will NO LONGER be Minted as of 1/1/13 - Tim Geithner, US Treasury Sect)
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To: G Larry

It sounds like the hammer started it all.


16 posted on 12/25/2012 1:46:19 PM PST by TigersEye (Who is John Galt?)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy
There would be alot less murders if we just fed murderers to the wood chipper. No more life in prison.
17 posted on 12/25/2012 2:04:14 PM PST by Newbomb Turk (Hey Newbomb, where's your brothers ElCamino ?)
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To: JustaCowgirl

Fires were set to lure in firemen to be shot back in the 1960s and 1970s. It is not new.


18 posted on 12/25/2012 2:31:17 PM PST by Ruy Dias de Bivar (REOPEN THE CLOSED MENTAL INSTITUTIONS! Damn the ACLU!)
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To: Newbomb Turk

I actually want federal death penalty reform, so I don’t get glib on the subject. Orrin Hatch as chairman of the senate judiciary committee, is satisfied with the status quo, more or less, so until he is replaced by a conservative in a Republican controlled senate, such reform is unlikely.


19 posted on 12/25/2012 2:47:18 PM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy (Pennies and Nickels will NO LONGER be Minted as of 1/1/13 - Tim Geithner, US Treasury Sect)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

Wondering if “Maxwells silver hammer” came own upon sister’s head too like granny? Anyway since the murderous tasbard loves fire so much he gets to spend christmas day in fiery hell nice and toasty. He should have been executed or at least still be in prison for killing granny. Now all these victims would still be alive. Eff the non-justice Lieberal system.


20 posted on 12/25/2012 2:48:04 PM PST by tflabo (Truth or Tyranny)
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To: G Larry
ya, it’s the gun hammer’s fault.....

There, that's fixed.

Regards,
GtG

21 posted on 12/25/2012 2:54:22 PM PST by Gandalf_The_Gray (I live in my own little world, I like it 'cuz they know me here.)
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To: JustaCowgirl

Never try to get inside a mad man’s head and attempt to understand what you find there, for if you do understand what you find there, you’re just as crazy as he is.


22 posted on 12/25/2012 2:58:44 PM PST by DJ Taylor (Once again our country is at war, and once again the Democrats have sided with our enemy.)
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To: txrangerette
"I know, except it “says” the fire was meant to lure firefighters...although how can they know that?"

Read in other articles that he'd left a 3-page typewritten note saying that he wanted to burn down the neighborhood, and "do what he likes doing best...killing people."

23 posted on 12/25/2012 3:05:02 PM PST by mass55th (Courage is being scared to death - but saddling up anyway...John Wayne)
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To: JustaCowgirl

Uh-oh, the evil “military-style rifle” was involved. Was it identified? Probably a single-shot .22.


24 posted on 12/25/2012 3:09:17 PM PST by ought-six ( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
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To: JustaCowgirl

Call Cuomo - NYS should immediately outlaw felons and the mentally ill from possessing firearms.

This must never be allowed to happen again.


25 posted on 12/25/2012 3:12:38 PM PST by Jim Noble (Diseases desperate grown are by desperate appliance relieved, or not at all)
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To: ought-six

According to Fox News, the killer was armed with a .38-caliber revolver, a 12-gauge shotgun, and a .223-caliber Bushmaster rifle. The Bushmaster is the same make and caliber semiautomatic rifle as the one used in the Newtown school massacre.

If you listen to the radio transmissions from the scene, it is clear that the guy used the rifle to shoot at the first responders as soon as they arrived, from behind a berm across the street from the fire, so he set them up in a trap.


26 posted on 12/25/2012 3:26:49 PM PST by drjimmy
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To: drjimmy

I don’t watch Fox News, or any alphabet news station. I based my comment on the article posted, and that article did not identify the rifle. If it was a Bushmaster .223, then it is a very common rifle, and is not in reality an assault rifle (in newspeak, though, it is.).


27 posted on 12/25/2012 3:34:47 PM PST by ought-six ( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
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To: drjimmy

I don’t watch Fox News, or any alphabet news station. I based my comment on the article posted, and that article did not identify the rifle. If it was a Bushmaster .223, then it is a very common rifle, and is not in reality an assault rifle (in newspeak, though, it is.).


28 posted on 12/25/2012 3:34:58 PM PST by ought-six ( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
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To: G Larry

“Murdered his 92 yr old grandmother with a hammer, and some idiot judge lets him out after only 17 years.”

That is nothing my cousin murder was released after his bail was reduced from 1 Million to $250,000.00. EVEN!!! when he bludgeoned an elderly couple who happens to be Berkeley Professors almost to death. Leaving the woman unable to speak and her husband. There place had blood everywhere yet this stupid woman judge I guess didnt think that was enough so she stupidly reduce his bail only to get out by using his house & boat as collatral and murder my cousin by cutting him up.


29 posted on 12/25/2012 3:38:13 PM PST by Patriot Babe
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To: Lazamataz

Ping


30 posted on 12/25/2012 3:39:29 PM PST by Ouderkirk (Obama has turned America into an aristocracy of the unaccomplished.)
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To: JustaCowgirl

Not a coverup. This was THE crime. Police have a 3 page letter the POS left stating his intent to burn down the neighborhood and kill as many people as he could.

This perp was a total scumbag who should have been hanged back when he killed his grandmother with a hammer.


31 posted on 12/25/2012 3:47:56 PM PST by Nik Naym (It's not my fault... I have compulsive smartass disorder.)
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To: ought-six
"Uh-oh, the evil “military-style rifle” was involved. Was it identified? Probably a single-shot .22."

It was a Bushmaster. I'll give the police and press credit here. In this article they avoided reporting this as a "deadly, highpowered, extra-triple high capacity automatic assault rifle," which is the verbiage typically used. I'm ok with referring to a Bushmaster as a "military style rifle"; That's essentially what it is. A Springield, a 98 Mauser, a Garand, or M-1 Carbine could also be characterized as "military style rifles."

From what I've heard, the chief of police's first impulse was to blame the killer, stating he should never have been released, and (to my knowledge) didn't blame the rifle. either the chief and press involved here have their heads screwed on right, or we're making some progress.

32 posted on 12/25/2012 3:57:22 PM PST by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: Joe 6-pack

A Bushmaster is indeed a “military-style” rifle in appearance, as it is a clone of the M16. In functionality, it is not.

I, also, commend the police chief if he blamed the shooter and not the weapon, and applaud him for not calling the Bushmaster an assault rifle. We’ll see if he changes his narrative after the mayor and city council have a talk with him.


33 posted on 12/25/2012 4:08:21 PM PST by ought-six ( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
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To: ought-six

“. We’ll see if he changes his narrative after the mayor and city council have a talk with him.”

Won’t happen. Webster is a suburban town and doesn’t have a mayor or city council. Plus it is quite conservative or at least conservative leaning.

Add to that the fact that the head of the next agency involved is the Monroe County Sheriff Pat O’Flynn who would be welcome at any freeper’s table. He answers to the County manager Maggie Brooks who is also pro 2nd amendment.

We are dealing with good people on this one and you are NOT going to hear them blaming guns.


34 posted on 12/25/2012 4:22:16 PM PST by Nik Naym (It's not my fault... I have compulsive smartass disorder.)
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To: txrangerette

This man was found guilty of killing his Grandmother with a hammer. If he had been executed that wouls have been the end of it.

There is no record of any executed killer ever killing again.

Stop farting around with these people.
There is no such thing as being too stupid or too insane to be executed, That’s horse hockey.

If they are too sick to be executed-—carry them to the table and git er done.

600 people in California sitting on death row waiting to get turned loose so they can kill again. Why? Because some governor hasn’t the balls to set up the schedule./


35 posted on 12/25/2012 4:59:14 PM PST by Venturer
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To: bgill
Now he’ll have his name in all the papers.

yea, but too bad for him, he won't be able to read them. The papers don't make deliveries to Hell.

36 posted on 12/25/2012 5:11:48 PM PST by houeto (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

The news said a three page type written note. I doubt seriously this guy could type and he doesn’t look like the type of guy that would write a three page suicide note. I personally don’t believe he did.


37 posted on 12/25/2012 5:25:17 PM PST by Duchess47 ("One day I will leave this world and dream myself to Reality" Crazy Horse)
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To: Nik Naym

How come the letter did not burn up but almost the whole block was burned?


38 posted on 12/25/2012 5:33:28 PM PST by funfan
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To: JustaCowgirl

Executed murders generally, without known exceptions that I know of, are not repeat offenders. Had they done the right thing in the first place the whole conversation would be moot.


39 posted on 12/25/2012 6:37:44 PM PST by RetiredTexasVet (Save the nation, have your family's progressives spayed or neutered.)
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To: txrangerette

Why was he let out of prison after serving only 17 years?!! Why?!


40 posted on 12/26/2012 6:28:44 AM PST by demshateGod (The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.)
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To: G Larry

That judges name needs to be in the papers. Does the governor have to sign off on releases? Everyone involved in the process needs to be hung or tarred and feathered. Enough of this! We need our land back.


41 posted on 12/26/2012 6:34:43 AM PST by demshateGod (The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.)
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To: Nik Naym

That’s good to hear.


42 posted on 12/26/2012 3:30:24 PM PST by ought-six ( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

What responsibilities do parole boards have for their insistance in releasing the worst of the worst?

Who’s next?
Charlie Manson?


43 posted on 12/27/2012 9:09:46 AM PST by ridesthemiles
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